I am going to back Cruz.

carpet bombing and making the sands glow? I'm sorry, Cruz is a liar and he talks out of both sides of his mouth.

Those are deal breakers for me too.

But when you have a coalition, which you need if you want any hope of winning a presidential election, you're going to have people with different sets of priorities. All things considered, Cruz is closer to Rand in most policies than any of the other Republican candidates. Rand and Cruz have a history of being allies, and hopefully can continue that. By not burning that bridge, Rand stands to win favors and can hopefully have a positive influence on Cruz when it comes to foreign policy.
 
You're absolutely right. And I did not say winning means you lose your principles. I said this, exactly:



If we really need to go over all the cases in the last four years where principle was shoved in the back seat, for the umpteenth time here (just that I've been involved in), then we certainly can.

You're right - trying to win does not mean you have to lose your principles.
But the fact is, either that happened, or the principles changed.[/COLOR]

Well also there's not agreement on what the principles are. For you principle means getting rid of the government entirely. For LE it means getting back to the constitution. For me it means going back to the mosaic civil code. etc.
 
I'm supporting Rand at least until he officially drops out. I'll vote for him in the Kansas caucus if he's still in the race at that time. I'm not sure how long he's planning to stay in the race though.
 
I'm supporting Rand at least until he officially drops out. I'll vote for him in the Kansas caucus if he's still in the race at that time. I'm not sure how long he's planning to stay in the race though.

Maybe I'm part of the old Paultard crowd living in fantasy land, but to me, the office of President doesn't mean all that much without Rand or Ron in it.

A lot of people seem to have in their mind that Rand would push things this way, but Trump would push things that way, and Cruz would push things the other way. So if Rand doesn't win my second choice is (blah).

My fear was always that Rand wasn't maybe going to stand up to the establishment as much as Ron. It was never that he wasn't. But for all the others, they are empty suits. They won't stand up to jack or shit. People saying Cruz is "the most like Rand after Rand". Compared to the clowns on the stage? Throw a dart at the Senate/House, I'm sure you could get a Cruz alternative after one or two shots.

Main point is that the real "game" at play isn't making people think their vote counts. It doesn't. They know it doesn't. That's why they flip-flop and try to identify with "the winner" so much. The real success of TPTB is making you think the office itself counts for anything. It doesn't. Not without someone of impeccable principle occupying it. Rand is the only one who even passes the smell test on this count.
 
Maybe I'm part of the old Paultard crowd living in fantasy land, but to me, the office of President doesn't mean all that much without Rand or Ron in it.

A lot of people seem to have in their mind that Rand would push things this way, but Trump would push things that way, and Cruz would push things the other way. So if Rand doesn't win my second choice is (blah).

My fear was always that Rand wasn't maybe going to stand up to the establishment as much as Ron. It was never that he wasn't. But for all the others, they are empty suits. They won't stand up to jack or shit. People saying Cruz is "the most like Rand after Rand". Compared to the clowns on the stage? Throw a dart at the Senate/House, I'm sure you could get a Cruz alternative after one or two shots.

Main point is that the real "game" at play isn't making people think their vote counts. It doesn't. They know it doesn't. That's why they flip-flop and try to identify with "the winner" so much. The real success of TPTB is making you think the office itself counts for anything. It doesn't. Not without someone of impeccable principle occupying it. Rand is the only one who even passes the smell test on this count.

The thing is that I care about more issues than just the liberty issues. I'm also a Christian conservative and care about issues like banning abortion and preserving religious liberty, and Cruz is great on those issues. (Far better than likely Libertarian Party candidate Gary Johnson) I do have some strong disagreements with Cruz on foreign policy, but for me it's just a question of whether those foreign policy disagreements trump all of the other issues that I agree with Cruz on. I do understand those who say they can't vote for Cruz because of his foreign policy, and I'm still undecided on whether I can support him or not due to the foreign policy he supports. But what I don't understand is those who say, "Ted Cruz sucks, and I agree with him on nothing." That just makes no sense to me. He's obviously in line with the liberty movement on some issues.

But as I said, I'm supporting Rand as long as he remains in the race.
 
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I am going to back Cruz.

Rand is still in the race...

I really can't believe you of all people are missing the point. Nobody cares what your second choice is. If Rand doesn't make it I will never vote for trump but I might vote for Carson, Cruz of Kasich. As long as Rand is running I will support him and shout down people trying to promote ANY other candidate over Rand. If I quit supporting Rand I will do the honorable thing and leave and find a place that supports the candidate I pick. I won't try and stay at a place that started in support of the Pauls and still supports the Pauls by 96 percent and pick fights and try and destroy the efforts of the 96% that are trying to help Paul.
 
I stuck by Rand in the hopes he could pull it off but it is not happening and it is not going to happen.
Now it is flat out a choice between Cruz Trump Hillary Rubio or Bernie. To fend off the possibility of having to choose between Hillary Rubio, or Bernie over Trump, I have to back Cruz.
Rubio is rapidly going to collect the neoconservative branch and a good portion of the religious right. He is going to surge in NH and the news is going to run with that. Last thing I want is to get stuck in California with a choice between Trump and Rubio. As of now the era of the Paul's is over.
I respect the people sticking by Rand and salute you all for taking a hard stand for the most principled and honorable man running and out of respect to you all and Rand and Ron, I won't be posting anything about Cruz and I probably won't be around much at all anymore. It has been a wild ride these last 9 years Sometime euphoric and sometimes not so great but it has been a life experience.

Honestly Cruz isn't a whole lot worse than Rand... they both advocate a VAT tax would should be an automatic disqualifier- Cruz is of course worse on the military... bad on the drug war... neither can clearly oppose the minimum wage... klamath I guess you were no libertarian to begin with.
 
The idea that your support is meaningful is laughable unless you choose to passionately become an activist for the Canadian Carpetbomber. Cruz isn't winning the nomination and your hatred of the left has blinded you from first principles.
 
I understand being fed up with the constant losing you have to endure being a liberty minded individual. It's sickening and being the underdog in nearly every battle is rough and takes a toll on every man and woman involved.

What I don't understand is immediately giving up on your principles, your integrity, your humanity, in the off chance you can join a "winning" team, to gain some sense of satisfaction in the short term.

We all know who and what Ted Cruz is now, and it is not the things that liberty minded people cherish or believe in. You are free to do what you want, however, so.. enjoy your decision.
 
Honestly Cruz isn't a whole lot worse than Rand... they both advocate a VAT tax would should be an automatic disqualifier- Cruz is of course worse on the military... bad on the drug war... neither can clearly oppose the minimum wage... klamath I guess you were no libertarian to begin with.

I don't believe that either Cruz or Rand's tax plans actually contain a VAT tax.
 
I'm curious if any potential Cruz supporters have watched the video in the thread I posted at this beginning of this thread? It pretty thoroughly discredits Cruz as a liberty candidate, someone with any consistent views and as a human being as far as I'm concerned.
 
I'm curious if any potential Cruz supporters have watched the video in the thread I posted at this beginning of this thread? It pretty thoroughly discredits Cruz as a liberty candidate, someone with any consistent views and as a human being as far as I'm concerned.

The interesting thing is now that Cruz won the Iowa caucus, the media is coming after him in full force. Sure, they did before, but with even more fervor now that he's in the limelight instead of Trump. Though given how Cruz has railed against the media before, I wonder if it will have any sort of impact.

http://thehill.com/blogs/congress-blog/presidential-campaign/267777-cruz-prince-of-darkness

Sen. Ted Cruz (R-Texas) is a rightist ideologue, arguably much more conservative than Barry Goldwater in 1964. He vows to destroy the “corrupt Washington-Wall Street cartel.” His rhetoric is dark, apocalyptic, and nativist. If elected president, his policies would make U.S. politics even more toxic and polarized, exacerbating intractable problems at home and abroad.
 
THIS!!!! as i posted in another thread, i am so pissed at our supporters in iowa so much i can barely see. fucking lazy asses cant get out for one day and cast a damn vote??? this day could have sealed the deal for rand. instead, its going to be more of the same uphill battle hoping that others drop out first. fucking hell i dont know how anyone could have missed the god damned vote today!
Maybe their mothers wouldn't let them out of their basements...
 
But it's still lower than what the current business tax is, so it amounts to a tax cut.

Opening a new tax base is extremely dangerous- even if rates start out slightly lower overall. Just like opening the income tax base in 1913 was extremely dangerous... even though it was marketed as a tiny tax.
 
B
ut when you have a coalition, which you need if you want any hope of winning a presidential election, you're going to have people with different sets of priorities. All things considered, Cruz is closer to Rand in most policies than any of the other Republican candidates. Rand and Cruz have a history of being allies, and hopefully can continue tha

You don't understand...I am anti-war...there is no way I will ever vote for a neocon for any reason and I do not make coalitions with the devil.
 
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