When Does Open Immigration Become An Invasion?

[Paul Or Nothing II]

I have. I just don't think they amount to a very important factor in the actual catching of them. And without requiring American citizens to have papers validating themselves as such, how much could really be done as a result of this kind of snitching?

Let's say that judges deem it as probably cause to sign search warrants to go find out if the named individuals really are illegal immigrants. What would they search for? Maybe agents just go talk to them and ask them if they are here legally, and then the people say, "Si." And that's that. There's nothing more to do.

Workplace enforcement is the most essential tool for government limiting of immigration, as you correctly hinted earlier in your post.

Are you really suggesting that the government can't find out who is & isn't an American citizen after getting the search warrant? Come on, man!

 

[fisharmor]

Are you really suggesting that the government can't find out who is & isn't an American citizen after getting the search warrant? Come on, man!

Are you really suggesting that the government should be able to issue warrants just to be able to find out whether someone is an American citizen?
Come on, man!

 

[erowe1]

Are you really suggesting that the government can't find out who is & isn't an American citizen after getting the search warrant? Come on, man!

It would sure be difficult. What kinds of things could they find that would prove someone's an illegal immigrant?

And how would they know what to search for in the first place? A search warrant has to name the specific item they're looking for.

There's no way to have serious immigration control without workplace enforcement.

 

[RonPaulGeorge&Ringo]

I have heard him say that he's against laws that make it possible for the federal government to catch anyone who does,

This is false. Ron (and Rand, last I checked) Paul is against the E-Verify system because it would require every new hire to be approved in advance by the feds and create a "no-work list" that could easily be abused.

But E-Verify -- which still isn't really a thing outside some pilot programs -- is not the only "possible" way to enforce the law against firms employing illegal aliens. The government can enforce that by using regular detective work and investigating firms that seem to be operating in a shady manner. That is how the INS has been doing it for decades -- or rather had been, when the federal government was actually interested in enforcing the law. Obama's DHS isn't much interested in that at all.

 

[RonPaulGeorge&Ringo]

It would sure be difficult.

Only for a moron.

1. Do you speak English?

If the answer is "no," move on to the next question:

2. Can I see your legally-valid work visa?

If the answer to both questions is "no," you have an illegal immigrant on your hands.

That's about 90% of the problem solved. Some illegal Irishmen might sneak by question 1. That's when additional detective work may come into play.

 

[Ender]

Only for a moron.

1. Do you speak English?

If the answer is "no," move on to the next question:

2. Can I see your legally-valid work visa?

If the answer to both questions is "no," you have an illegal immigrant on your hands.

That's about 90% of the problem solved. Some illegal Irishmen might sneak by question 1. That's when additional detective work may come into play.

Read much?

HERE is RP's stand on immigration:

https://www.lewrockwell.com/2015/08/...ass-migration/

 

[erowe1]

The government can enforce that by using regular detective work and investigating firms that seem to be operating in a shady manner. That is how the INS has been doing it for decades -- or rather had been, when the federal government was actually interested in enforcing the law. Obama's DHS isn't much interested in that at all.

But what INS has been doing for decades would not have been possible without the laws that have been in effect all those decades requiring employees to fill out W-2s, which Ron Paul has openly opposed for his entire career.

If it were legal for us to hire people to work for us without having to fill out any government paperwork, there would be no way for the government to enforce laws against hiring illegal immigrants.

 

[erowe1]

Only for a moron.

1. Do you speak English?

If the answer is "no," move on to the next question:

2. Can I see your legally-valid work visa?

If the answer to both questions is "no," you have an illegal immigrant on your hands.

That's not true. You don't have to be able to speak English to be an American citizen. Some natural-born American citizens can't speak any language at all.

Without requiring that citizens have papers, it's impossible to tell that someone's an illegal immigrant just on account of their lack of papers.

 

[RonPaulGeorge&Ringo]

You don't have to be able to speak English to be an American citizen.

Fuck that. That's globalist anti-American bullshit. Arizona became a state 100 years ago. There's no reason an American citizen in 2015 shouldn't speak English. (And you sure as shit souldn't be voting if you can't read the Constitution.)

Some natural-born American citizens can't speak any language at all.

No one is suggesting raiding homes for the deaf or the mentally retarded.

 

[RonPaulGeorge&Ringo]

But what INS has been doing for decades would not have been possible without the laws that have been in effect all those decades requiring employees to fill out W-2s.

I think you mean an "I-9." You seem confused.

And no, you wouldn't necessarily need the I-9 system to initiate an investigation, either. That's beside the point and just another lame distraction.

 

[LibertyEagle]

 

[erowe1]

Fuck that. That's globalist anti-American bullshit.

It's a true statement though. Are you saying you want to change the law to deport anyone who doesn't speak English, including those who are already citizens?

No one is suggesting raiding homes for the deaf or the mentally retarded.

You are suggesting that by saying that anyone who doesn't speak English is an illegal immigrant.

 

[erowe1]

I think you mean an "I-9." You seem confused.

And no, you wouldn't necessarily need the I-9 system to initiate an investigation, either. That's beside the point and just another lame distraction.

No, I mean a W-2, the kind of form I've always had to fill out for taxes. Or a 1099 for independent contractors. The I-9 is another example. But I'm talking about when there are no required forms at all.

How would you be able to catch people who employ illegal immigrants if you don't make everyone who works for them, including citizens, fill out some kind of government paperwork? What people today refer to as getting paid under the table would be normal and legal.

 

[LibertyEagle]

So what you are saying is that you want to conserve modern immigration laws and not those of the past. It's just more proof that your living document called the constitution and your standards of being a conservative can easily change over time to support tyranny.

No, I said what I said. Not your contorted version of it. You really should go get a job at FOX news; you spin things wonderfully.

 

[LibertyEagle]

Read much?

HERE is RP's stand on immigration:

https://www.lewrockwell.com/2015/08/...ass-migration/

Link much?

It doesn't work to copy a link that has been condensed for display.

 

[LibertyEagle]

Yes you did. Here's the quote:

lol. You are doing the same bs that Alex Jones frequently does. Run off at the mouth about a lot of things and then ask if you agree or disagree.

The conversation was here. People can check for themselves.
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showth...-An-Invasion&p=5968108&viewfull=1#post5968108

 

[LibertyEagle]

But what INS has been doing for decades would not have been possible without the laws that have been in effect all those decades requiring employees to fill out W-2s, which Ron Paul has openly opposed for his entire career.

If it were legal for us to hire people to work for us without having to fill out any government paperwork, there would be no way for the government to enforce laws against hiring illegal immigrants.

You know, once upon a time to immigrate here, you had to prove that you could be self-sufficient or be sponsored and be disease free.

I'm fine with you sponsoring illegal aliens you want to hire. And if they murder or harm anyone while here, it would be your head that was chopped off. Does that work for you?

 

[erowe1]

You know, once upon a time to immigrate here, you had to prove that you could be self-sufficient or be sponsored and be disease free.

And before that you didn't have to do anything at all other than set foot on the land.

I'm all for making sure people are either self-sufficient or sponsored. All that means is that we don't give them any tax-funded freebies (which nobody should be getting at all anyway, including citizens). It doesn't require a bigger and more powerful government burdening all of us with all kinds of regulations so that it can make sure we're not illegal immigrants and have its permission to work here.

 

[erowe1]

Link much?

It doesn't work to copy a link that has been condensed for display.

You can just go to lewrockwell.com. It's right on the front page today.

 

[puppetmaster]

yup