Rockwell: The Market Absurdity of Open Borders

Your chances are better than even that you'll get to re-elect someone who will give extend the border fence a little bit in order to placate you, make the overall problem worse through foreign policy, add in face scanning cameras in airports which has nothing to do with the problem he claims to be fixing and four years from now you'll be just as frustrated as you are right now. But okay. I want to see Brandon out too but for different reasons.

Wow, i thought you were better than that. I never said I wanted all that other stuff you added on and you know it. I also have said that to really fix it … I am not going to repeat it. You saw it and have read me saying the same for YEARS. I don’t even know about the wall, but I can see up close and personal what is happening and also know that our piece of crap government is encouraging it for a reason and they aren’t going to stop. So what is your suggestion beyond pontificating?
 
Wow, i thought you were better than that. I never said I wanted all that other stuff you added on and you know it. I also have said that to really fix it … I am not going to repeat it. You saw it and have read me saying the same for YEARS. I don’t even know about the wall, but I can see up close and personal what is happening and also know that our piece of crap government is encouraging it for a reason and they aren’t going to stop. So what is your suggestion beyond pontificating?

I think you misread me the same way you misread SwordSmyth. I know you don't want all of that other stuff but, based on the previous 4 years of Trump, you're going to get it. It just is what it is. You'll get a tiny fraction of what you want on the border and a lot of stuff that's either overkill (face scanning cameras) or that will make the problem worse. And yeah, I know you know that. Me, I really don't care about this election except that I hope everybody who says they'll leave if Trump wins will keep their word this time.
 
I think you misread me the same way you misread SwordSmyth. I know you don't want all of that other stuff but, based on the previous 4 years of Trump, you're going to get it. It just is what it is. You'll get a tiny fraction of what you want on the border and a lot of stuff that's either overkill (face scanning cameras) or that will make the problem worse. And yeah, I know you know that. Me, I really don't care about this election except that I hope everybody who says they'll leave if Trump wins will keep their word this time.

Well, you are right that I wouldn’t want that. I haven’t seen him recommending it either. But, since he isn’t grounded in constitutional principles, he could go along with something horrible like that. But, honestly, we don’t have any guarantee anyone won’t do that, besides Rand or Thomas.

So, you must be thinking Trump is some kind of big ‘ol fascist too?
 
Well, you are right that I wouldn’t want that. I haven’t seen him recommending it either. But, since he isn’t grounded in constitutional principles, he could go along with something horrible like that. But, honestly, we don’t have any guarantee anyone won’t do that, besides Rand or Thomas.

You didn't see Trump pushing for face scanning cameras back in 2017? https://www.theverge.com/2017/4/18/...facial-recognition-scanning-homeland-security

So, you must be thinking Trump is some kind of big ‘ol fascist too?

I think Trump is a Democrat in disguise / empty suit willing to morph into whatever will help him get ahead and/or stroke his ego in the moment. He campaigned for Hillary Clinton. The Clintons asked him to run for president. He pushed for an assault weapons ban in 2002 long before running for president and brought the idea up again in 2018 after being president. And yes, I get people can change. I used to be for gun control. I'm not anymore. But once turning against gun control I never flipped back. On gun control, the rest of the GOP is so against that I don't see Trump actually pushing it through. But face scanning cameras at airports and other things like that? The opposition in the GOP to that is so weak that frankly it will continue to go forward no matter who is president.

And....I guess that's my issue. Yep. Folks are upset about the illegals. So much so that Biden is trying to run on the Republicans killing his border control bill. (And yes I know he already had the tools to do something about the border and didn't.). Got it. Now who's going to push against all of the other nonsense that's getting pulled right along with it? It's like the whole "Trump's got immunity" thing. He could order an American citizen killed without trial. *gasp* Only Obama already did that and the GOP didn't impeach over it because they approved of what he did!

Singling out a particular politician for the label "fascist" misses the point. The entire system is fascist now. Both parties. Biden also supports face scanning cameras at airports so it's not like if Trump loses that will quit being implemented. In 2024 there was a letter written by 14 senators, Republican and Democrat, asking the Chuck Shumer and Mitch McConnell to limit their use. https://www.merkley.senate.gov/wp-content/uploads/2024_05_02_LTR-TSA-Freeze-to-Leadership.pdf

Note that Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders signed the letter. Rand Paul and Mike Lee's names are noticeably absent. Oh but Rand Paul signed the infamous Tom Cotton letter to undermine (in violation of the Logan Act) the Iran nuclear deal. Yeah, I get it. Rand was "playing politics." And it's not his fault if more people are screaming at his office about "Iran may get nukes" and "Make sure the repairman speaks English" than they are "Please protect our privacy from face scanning cameras."

Anyhow, now you know about the face scanning camera issue. What you do with that is up to you. Me personally? I've got to decide what I'm going to do if I need to fly on a commercial airplane next year thanks to Tennessee Republican Marsha Blackburn's "Real ID Act." I'll have to either get a "compliant" drivers license or a new passport. (Sadly I didn't get my old one renewed in time). More fascism coming from the right in the name of stopping fascism from the left. I'll probably opt for the passport because that's a good thing to have anyway, and at least I can still use a normal drivers license for my day to day needs when I'm not flying or trying to leave the country. My little tiny bit of resistance.
 
No, I didn’t know that about the facial scanning. Thanks bud

And yes, I agree about both parties. Absolutely.

Note: That wasn’t for Americans, per the article. But, no, I don’t trust them that it wouldn’t shortly be.
 
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No. It's provably true. Amnesty was part of the 1986 bill that Ronald Reagan passed to fight the illegal immigration problem that Reagan helped create by destabilizing Central America. Ron Paul talks about that in the video I already posted. Here it is again.

That's nonsense.
The parts of the bill to increase enforcement never happened, and Amnesty is absolutely not part of fighting it, that was a compromise slipped into the bill.
 
That's nonsense.
The parts of the bill to increase enforcement never happened, and Amnesty is absolutely not part of fighting it, that was a compromise slipped into the bill.

It was part of the bill whether you like it or not. And the influx of migrants would have slowed to a trickle if Reagan had just quit funding contra rebels and right wing death squads. Trump's sanctions against Venezuela has also fueled mass migration.
 
It was part of the bill whether you like it or not. And the influx of migrants would have slowed to a trickle if Reagan had just quit funding contra rebels and right wing death squads. Trump's sanctions against Venezuela has also fueled mass migration.

Being part of the bill doesn't make it part of the efforts against illegal immigration and you know it.
And while sanctions against Venezuela may or may not have been a good idea, Chavez and Maduro did more than enough on their own to cause people to flee.
 
Being part of the bill doesn't make it part of the efforts against illegal immigration and you know it.
And while sanctions against Venezuela may or may not have been a good idea, Chavez and Maduro did more than enough on their own to cause people to flee.

That's the sausage on how bills are passed and you know it. And not nearly as many people would have fled if the sanctions hadn't been put on and you know it.

Edit: Also the Sinowala drug cartel is a direct result of efforts to restrict immigration.



To the extent that Mexican drug violence causes later waves of violence, immigration policy is responsible.
 
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Interesting video. But, having immigration laws is not the issue. Everyone knowing we don’t enforce them is. How many other 1st world countries allow foreigners to walk right in and go on the dole? In reality, ones I am thinking about are very selective on who they even admit. You have to have a skill they need and they determine that.

As far as drugs go, I believe most should be legalized and available over the counter. Of course, then the drug cartels would focus on something else.
 
Border-defense can be privately funded. Compare the security of a gated community to the security of most national borders. A stray cat cannot cross into the gated community at any time of day or night without their security knowing about it. So, libertarian defense is much stronger than public (tragedy-of-the-commons) defense. AKA be careful what you wish for...

What's to stop Jose from buying a piece of land on the mexican border and putting up a big "ENTER HERE" sign?

I'm against open borders but I'm not sure we need a wall to close the border.
 
What's to stop Jose from buying a piece of land on the mexican border and putting up a big "ENTER HERE" sign?

Any HOA with gated entrance is going to have rules about that. You can't remove a section of the outer wall, you can't remove the gate, you can't change the gate-code, you may not loan your code to someone else, you may not tailgate others, you may not allow others to tailgate you, certain types of visitors may have to follow a sign-in procedure, and so on, and so forth.

I'm against open borders but I'm not sure we need a wall to close the border.

Sure, it may be possible to have a wall-less border (that is also secure). But the deeper issue is that if you want to achieve Goal X, you have to choose a tool from among the set of available tools that can actually accomplish Goal X. If Goal X is to dig a powerline ditch but you choose Tool A which is a children's sandbox scoop, have fun trying to dig a ditch with that. You need to choose an appropriate tool, such as a proper steel shovel, or a Ditch-Witch, or whatever.

The government is the wrong tool for almost everything that modern man wants to use it for. He says, "I will now dig a ditch (or seal the border)" and he proceeds to grab the plastic toy sand-shovel of the government. He does so with great ceremony and pomp, as though he were a priest performing some ancient liturgy. But no matter how deeply he believes in his heart that this plastic toy shovel will help him dig a 5-foot deep, mile-long trench, it will not help him at all. He would do just as well scratching at the dirt with his bare paws. If you want to dig a ditch, use a proper shovel. If you want to seal a border, have proper security. If your political apparatus makes it impossible to have public security agencies do the job, then contract it out. If the contractors are corruptible, then privatize the whole system. The root problem in almost all public policy failures is tragedy of the commons... no one individual has any vested interest in the outcome, so the outcome is never achieved. Privatization is not magic pixie-dust. What makes it work is what economists call internalization of costs and benefits. When I fix up my house, I am the beneficiary in two ways. First, I get to live in a nicer house, because I just fixed it up. And when I sell it, it will get a better price (because I fixed it up). So, almost all the benefits of fixing my house up go to me. For this reason, nobody needs to pass a law saying, "People need to fix up their houses. There need to be at least 10,000 remodels per year." Nobody needs to do that because the incentives are already aligned -- everyone who can benefit from fixing up their house has already done so, because it was the most beneficial thing they could do with their spare money. Therefore, everyone who doesn't fix up their house must have had some other, more pressing thing to spend their money on.

When you collectivize resources (e.g. parks, roads, borders, etc.) you break internality. You make both the costs and benefits of maintaining that resource into an externality. Since nobody in particular benefits, nobody in particular has an interest in seeing to it that that resource is maintained. And so you get blight. The US southern border is exactly such a blight. The Democrats are the main beneficiary of that particular blight, which is why the Republicans bitch and moan about it so much. But there are plenty of other blights that the Republicans benefit from (e.g. the MIC), and you will never hear them complain about those. And it is precisely because of this root hypocrisy (the desire to "keep the good thing going") that the Republicans will never take a principled stand on the border. They will not enforce it, neither will they allow local polities to enforce it in their place. They don't actually want change, they just want you to think they want change, so they make a big show of complaining about it. And nothing ever changes.

This is a MUST-WATCH video, it's just 2 minutes. Everyone go watch it!

 
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Any HOA with gated entrance is going to rules about that.

But HOAs are small areas of land that are completely filled by occupied parcels and their appurtenant streets, parks, right-of-ways, and other such things. And rightly so.

The ethical justification for putting up a wall around such an area can't be extrapolated to justify putting one up around a land mass the size of the USA, complete with all its empty and unused land.
 
That deserves a re-post of the entire article.
[MENTION=40029]PAF[/MENTION]


The Absurdity of “Open Borders”
Torn fence
07/04/2024

Power & Market

Llewellyn H. Rockwell Jr.
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Some libertarians argue that libertarianism requires support for “open borders,” but this is a mistake. “Open borders” is the view in the existing world of states, the state ought to admit as many people who want to come to the United States as possible. Of course, you don’t have the right to occupy property that is privately owned. But much of the property in the United States is “public,” which means that it is up to those who run the state to decide what to do with it. Of course, this is an unsatisfactory situation and we should do what we can to bring about a world with no “public” property and no state, but for now the question is what to do: open borders or not?

The answer is quite clear. “Open borders” would be a disastrous mistake. The policy would subject the United States to hordes of people with alien ideologies and cultures. As the great Ludwig von Mises pointed out, it would have made no sense to allow immigration from Germany and Japan during World War II. “Neither does it mean that there can be any question of appeasing aggressors by removing migration barriers. As conditions are today, the Americas and Australia in admitting German, Italian, and Japanese immigrants merely open their doors to the vanguards of hostile armies.” We face exactly the same situation today. We have a hard enough problem coping with the alien ideologies and cultures that are already here. Why compound our problem?

The situation is even worse than we have so far portrayed. Because of the “woke” control that now prevails, members of “protected” groups such as racial minorities are immediately eligible for reparations, “set-asides,” affirmative action, and other schemes to mulct the American people. Why should our hard-earned tax money go to support people who have no ties to our country? As I said in 2015, “In other words, it’s bad enough we have to be looted, spied on, and kicked around by the state. Should we also have to pay for the privilege of cultural destructionism, an outcome the vast majority of the state’s taxpaying subjects do not want and would actively prevent if they lived in a free society and were allowed to do so?”

Aside from the “woke” problem, there is something else. Those who come here because of “open borders” can immediately benefit from the welfare state. A massive number of people could come here just to live from welfare payments. Why bankrupt our economy? The well-known free market economist Milton Friedman, hardly an extremist, said, “You cannot simultaneously have a free market and a welfare state.”

You might counter this by pointing out that welfare benefits aren’t very lavish. But this is true only if you are thinking of the standards of living of the American upper and middle classes. (Actually, though, these benefits are quite substantial and give the lie to claims that America has been marked by rising “inequality” in recent decades.) Because America is much more prosperous than the places the immigrants are coming from, living from American welfare payments would be a good deal for millions of potential immigrants.

Some fanatical libertarian supporters of “open borders” have come up with a response to this point that has to be characterized as one of the worst arguments in the past few decades. Robert Rector mentions this argument here: “The grant of citizenship is a transfer of political power. Access to the U.S. ballot box also provides access to the American taxpayer’s bank account. This is particularly problematic with regard to low-skill immigrants. Within an active redistributionist state, as Friedman understood, unlimited immigration can threaten limited government.

“Many libertarians respond to this dilemma by asserting that the real problem is not open borders but the welfare state itself. The answer: dismantle the welfare state. The libertarian Cato Institute pursues a variant of this policy under the slogan, ‘build a wall around the welfare state, not around the nation.’. . . Borders should be open, but immigrants should be barred from accessing welfare and other benefits. , , . In a recent debate with Dan Griswold of the Cato Institute, I pointed out this paradox. Griswold replied that the key was to grant amnesty and open borders now and work on ‘building a wall around welfare’ at some point in the future.” See this.

It has to be said that this is utterly stupid. It would be like saying that you need to take two medications. If you take only one, you’ll die. Therefore, you should take one of them and worry about getting the other one later.

There is yet another problem with “open borders,” that gets to the root of why we support the free market. As Mises again and again pointed out, the free market replaces the Darwinian struggle of the natural world, in which some animals survive at the expense of others. In the free market, people can benefit without harming others. There is a harmony of long term interests among people.

But with open borders this is no longer true. Immigrants will take jobs by undercutting American workers, because even very low paying American jobs are better than what they are getting in their home countries. This process will take place until wages reach a common level, and given the vast number of potential immigrants compared with American workers, the wage that results will be close to the immigrants’ standard. American workers could rightly say, “What about us? Your “free market” makes our condition worse.” But of course it isn’t the “free market” that does this. It’s “open borders,” which is an anti-market principle, that does this. Insisting that “open borders” makes everybody better off makes libertarianism seem ridiculous, because a great many people are hurt by the policy.

Some “left libertarians” will object that the free market does indeed mandate “open borders”. But it doesn’t. The libertarian non-aggression principle leaves it up to us to determine what to do in a society with so-called “public” property.

We need to confront another objection. Wouldn’t an attempt to close the border require that we lock up illegal immigrants in concentration camps? Wouldn’t this be a drastic infringement on their liberty? But a closed border doesn’t require this. All that we need to do is to build a wall and prevent immigrants from entering. We don’t have to jail them. All we need to do is to turn them away.

Also, building a wall would be easier if states can build walls around their own territory. This greatly reduces the cost of building a wall. Closing the border gives the people in each state or local community a choice about accepting immigrants. Closed borders and secession go hand-in hand

Let’s do everything we can to end the hoax of “open borders.” Doing so is a step in the preservation of Western civilization and the American heritage.
 
Ron Paul's position from 2007:

The talk must stop. We must secure our borders now. A nation without secure borders is no nation at all. It makes no sense to fight terrorists abroad when our own front door is left unlocked. This is my six point plan:


  • [*=left]Physically secure our borders and coastlines. We must do whatever it takes to control entry into our country before we undertake complicated immigration reform proposals.
    [*=left]Enforce visa rules. Immigration officials must track visa holders and deport anyone who overstays their visa or otherwise violates U.S. law. This is especially important when we recall that a number of 9/11 terrorists had expired visas.
    [*=left]No amnesty. Estimates suggest that 10 to 20 million people are in our country illegally. That’s a lot of people to reward for breaking our laws.
    [*=left]No welfare for illegal aliens. Americans have welcomed immigrants who seek opportunity, work hard, and play by the rules. But taxpayers should not pay for illegal immigrants who use hospitals, clinics, schools, roads, and social services.
    [*=left]End birthright citizenship. As long as illegal immigrants know their children born here will be citizens, the incentive to enter the U.S. illegally will remain strong.
    [*=left]Pass true immigration reform. The current system is incoherent and unfair. But current reform proposals would allow up to 60 million more immigrants into our country, according to the Heritage Foundation. This is insanity. Legal immigrants from all countries should face the same rules and waiting periods.

http://archive.is/XoV0h#selection-311.1-349.26


"I remember I got into trouble with Libertarians because I said there may well be a time when immigration is like an invasion and we have to treat it differently." - Ron Paul on Meet The Press 23 Dec 2007

That was reason Number One why I jumped in whole hog supporting him back in 2007.

His "absolutist" position on the guns and the 2nd was my second reason.
 
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Offering them incentives to come here illegally, is why they come. Free education, free healthcare, birthright citizenship, etc. It is never going to stop until these goodies are taken away.

But, when I get really pissed off at this, I imagine having a double wall, with coin or debit card operated guns mounted atop the most inside wall. Where fathers can take their sons to teach them to shoot. “No son. You have to lead them a bit. Try again.” Seriously, I am sick of letting our country be overrun by all kinds of countries and who knows how many terrorists and diseases long ago eradicated here, that are being brought in. At least let Texas citizens go deal with the issue, if government won’t!!!!

We are just sitting on our asses while our country has been driven off of a cliff. I am getting older. At this point, I just hope the country doesn’t finish falling while I am still alive. But, we are leaving young people and their kids with far less than we were born into. It is sad.

If we stand any chance at all, we need a whole lot of more people that do what Thomas Massie did, all over our state and local governments. But, it is going to require more than being a keyboard warrior. The question is, how badly do we really want to turn this around? Are we willing to go all out like Thomas did?

Well, I suggested mines, they are cheap, reliable and send a powerful message to the next invader in line behind the first one that just got turned into hamburger.

But everybody lost their shit and I got shouted down.
 
But HOAs are small areas of land that are completely filled by occupied parcels and their appurtenant streets, parks, right-of-ways, and other such things. And rightly so.

HOAs -- rightly understood[1] -- are just miniature city-states. The entirety of Christendom was once almost one giant patchwork of city-states and surrounding rural supports. The rural support was defended by the security apparatus of the city-state to which it belonged. This was not always a strictly territorial arrangement, as in feudalism. People who needed more security stayed in the urban area. People who could live with less security could stay in rural areas (often because they were poor, or they could provide their own security).

The ethical justification for putting up a wall around such an area can't be extrapolated to justify putting one up around a land mass the size of the USA, complete with all its empty and unused land.

*shrug -- then it doesn't make sense for it to be policed in that way, and it's a waste of money to spend the public treasure on such a venture. That doesn't mean you have to accept illegal entry, you just have to capture and deport them, etc.

Note that the single biggest reason we have an issue with the border is welfare. We have trillions in free handouts in the US. People are "immigrating" here illegally to dip their bowl in some of the free pork which is constantly streaming out of DC. Before we had the world's largest welfare state (in absolute dollars, if not percentage), we had no issue with people climbing over fences and walls to get in here. So, shut off the magnet, and the problem would be solved overnight. But no Republican will ever talk about that because 2024 Republicans are equivalent to circa 1994 Democrats. The Republicans have always been about 30 years behind the Democrat party, but in lock-step with the globalist Agenda, all the same. So, we will have a big knock-down-drag-out political fight about "border versus no-border" but we will never talk about the actual cause. It's like a morbidly obese person trying to tell the doctor they're sure it's a thyroid issue and the doctor is telling them, "No, you just eat way too much. Stop over-eating and lose weight." So, we'll continue arguing about our thyroid southern border instead of the Federal Reserve money fountain and the DC special-interest pork-barreling that is causing it...

[1] - This qualifier is required because the BlackRock version of "HOA"s is just another statist corruption of a formerly valuable private arrangement.
 
HOAs -- rightly understood[1] -- are just miniature city-states.


I think there is an essential difference between a miniature city state that is confined to contiguous fully occupied land and a very large one. The difference is not just in size.

I also think this claim relies on a debatable definition of a state. Ideally all participants in an HOA voluntarily and explicitly sign contracts agreeing to the arrangement. A state on the other hand is, by definition, imposed on people without their consent through violent coercive means. States originate by violent conquest and they maintain their power by the sword. It may be that HOA's have a tendency to cross ethical lines into being state-like, but this is not inherent to them.
 
I think there is an essential difference between a miniature city state that is confined to contiguous fully occupied land and a very large one. The difference is not just in size.

I also think this claim relies on a debatable definition of a state. Ideally all participants in an HOA voluntarily and explicitly sign contracts agreeing to the arrangement. A state on the other hand is, by definition, imposed on people without their consent through violent coercive means. States originate by violent conquest and they maintain their power by the sword. It may be that HOA's have a tendency to cross ethical lines into being state-like, but this is not inherent to them.

Sure, I'm not saying they're identical, just similar. The HOA is consensual, a city-state is not necessarily consensual (although we may safely assume it has large majority consent from its constituents due to its geographic and hereditary compactness.) There is no clear line-of-distinction between the two... a city-state can be thought of as a very large HOA, an HOA as a small city-state, and somewhere between the two is the line-of-distinction between the two.

While I'm anti-State, I'm a "compass-heading anti-statist" rather than a "destination anti-statist" -- I care much more that we (as a country) move away from statism than that we "abolish the State" all in one fell swoop (which has never worked). As long as we keep making incremental moves away from Progressivism and the omnipotent-State, we are moving in the right direction. The faster we sail in that direction, the better. But it's the compass-heading that matters the most to me. Ideological litmus-testing and ideological purism are uninteresting to me because they are just quagmires for ideologues.

Thus, if we move towards increasingly allowing people to form semi-autonomous HOAs and easing restrictions against those, we are moving in the right direction. In America, the state-level government was originally architected to be the primary level of government, i.e. we were supposed to be a union of largely independent governments who are bound into an open-borders agreement with each other (and any other disputes to be resolved by the Federal courts or Federal law). Instead, we have a single, monolithic, occupying tyranny in DC and all state and local governments have been gutted for the express purpose of centralizing all power in DC. Let's reverse course and let's move back to the original model of this country. And if we have to go all the way back to city-states in order to accomplish that, so be it. Complaining on the Internet has changed nothing and will change nothing...
 
Sure, I'm not saying they're identical, just similar. The HOA is consensual, a city-state is not necessarily consensual (although we may safely assume it has large majority consent from its constituents due to its geographic and hereditary compactness.) There is no clear line-of-distinction between the two... a city-state can be thought of as a very large HOA, an HOA as a small city-state, and somewhere between the two is the line-of-distinction between the two.

While I'm anti-State, I'm a "compass-heading anti-statist" rather than a "destination anti-statist" -- I care much more that we (as a country) move away from statism than that we "abolish the State" all in one fell swoop (which has never worked). As long as we keep making incremental moves away from Progressivism and the omnipotent-State, we are moving in the right direction. The faster we sail in that direction, the better. But it's the compass-heading that matters the most to me. Ideological litmus-testing and ideological purism are uninteresting to me because they are just quagmires for ideologues.

Thus, if we move towards increasingly allowing people to form semi-autonomous HOAs and easing restrictions against those, we are moving in the right direction. In America, the state-level government was originally architected to be the primary level of government, i.e. we were supposed to be a union of largely independent governments who are bound into an open-borders agreement with each other (and any other disputes to be resolved by the Federal courts or Federal law). Instead, we have a single, monolithic, occupying tyranny in DC and all state and local governments have been gutted for the express purpose of centralizing all power in DC. Let's reverse course and let's move back to the original model of this country. And if we have to go all the way back to city-states in order to accomplish that, so be it. Complaining on the Internet has changed nothing and will change nothing...

And you will never move towards no state or a minimal state if you allow every big statist in the world to waltz across your borders.

When the whole world is libertarian you can talk to me about open borders.
 
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