[Milei WINS!] Javier Milei, Austrian econ. prof. & ancap, runs for president of Argentina

[ClaytonB]

Libertarians don't victimize people. That lets Maxwell out of the club. Sorry to burst your little bubble. If you ever come up with another idea someday, I hope that one's a good one.

You didn't know that everyone in prison is actually a libertarian?! They were just locked up for being too consistent and using "too much" liberty...

 

[acptulsa]

Agree, the message is so good....

...it has never failed to win before.

Oh, wait. It has often failed to win.

This moment's worth celebrating! A libertarian message won! Too bad all these people are pissing on us and telling us that's rain.

 

[ClaytonB]

...it has never failed to win before.

Oh, wait. It has often failed to win.

This moment's worth celebrating! A libertarian message won! Too bad all these people are pissing on us and telling us that's rain.

Indeed. And the even bigger lesson, here, is that we really do win by default. They (the Deep State, etc.) are the ones fighting gravity. They are the ones who have to inject us with 24x7 propaganda from every possible outlet, utilizing every known form of mind-control and weaponized psychology, at the cost of trillions of dollars per year, all to keep us from winning instantly. Should they be forced to withdraw even 10% of their propaganda and non-stop mind-control messaging, their entire house of cards will be in jeopardy of collapsing overnight. They are hanging by the thinnest of threads.

But when you talk to the NPC Chicken Little-bots that invade the forums whenever there is a disturbance in the geopolitical Force, they insist on a never-ending diet of black-pills... all is lost, they control everything, they already won, assimilation is inevitable, might as well just bend over, spread your cheeks and brace for the next injection because resistance is futile, etc. etc. etc. Keep your demoralization to yourself! Get out of here with that Sky Is Falling crap. If you've given up, that's your choice, go crawl into a fetal position in the corner and quietly sob like the little girl you are, but keep it down so that that the rest of us who are still fighting can think. We're already getting attacked on all sides by these execrable globalist reprobates, we don't need to get it in stereo from the little cowards who have given up on liberty and are just waiting for Xi to kick their doors in, vaxx them and chip them...

 

[vita3]

“Too bad all these people are pissing on us and telling us that's rain”

No, that’s what you are doing

Cheerleading a foreign unknown under the banner of “libertarian” used for political campaign.

Remember this man has NO history of leadership or protecting liberty.

NONE

We are paying close attention to who he is cozying up too.

& it’s a puke fest

 

[Swordsmyth]

THIS JUST IN!

The President-elect of Argentina is doing PRESIDENTIAL THINGS!

That's all we have for now, folks, but the moment we catch Milei drowning baby kittens, we'll be sure to get it on video and post it here so you can all finally see proof of what you all already know is true...

How is it presidential to meet with a hazbeen like slick Willy?
There is no above board excuse for it like there is for meeting with Biden.

We still need to watch and see, but things are not looking good.

 

[ClaytonB]

How is it presidential to meet with a hazbeen like slick Willy?
There is no above board excuse for it like there is for meeting with Biden.

We still need to watch and see, but things are not looking good.

This is the exact same things that the Left was screeching when Trump met with Un and others that they had designated as geopolitical unpersons. I have no idea why he's meeting with Clinton, but rubbing shoulders with bad characters is part of the job for any President, especially in Corrupcion Central: South America. Have you considered the possibility that Clinton may be the one begging for this meeting? Or maybe he's being forced? Folks really need to expand beyond the Left-Right paradigm. It never really made sense but in Clown World, you have to be insane to keep believing in Left-Right. The only real political dichotomy is slavery-vs-freedom. Everything else is a distraction.

PS: Keep in mind that sick Willy is slick Willy... of all the ex-POTUS's, he's probably the smartest and the most likely to betray The Club when it comes down to a choice between them, or his own skin. That certain people are only out for #1 can actually be a virtue in the sense that it makes them more predictable and doing a deal with them is more likely to hold up than with others who always think they're the smartest person in the room and they're going to figure out a sneaky way to rip you off...

 

[ClaytonB]

Remember this man has NO history of leadership or protecting liberty.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

If Milei had prior political experience, then the mantra from the anti-Milei worry-warts would be that he has XYZ associations with shady characters and 99.9% of his official colleagues are not libertarian, etc. etc. etc. He can't win for losing, with you guys. So who cares what points you raise, if things had been the other way, you would have made the opposite point and cited it as a slam-dunk argument that obviously Milei is just a big stinky liar and all those nasty things he's said about shit socialist libtards and the proven historical dangers of socialism are just "controlled-opp".

 

[Occam's Banana]

This seems about right. From what I understand, the established 'opposition party' failed to present a candidate and this is one of those situations where the libertarian candidate squeaked into office by process of elimination. But, now the man has center stage, it makes it much harder to just . . . ignore him.

The opposition coalition did field a candidate - several, in fact. Patricia Bullrich (a previous Minister of Security) was the front-runner among them. Sergio Massa was the leading Peronist coalition candidate. Those two and Milei (and some others) advanced to the October general election after the August primary. (Milei "won" the primary in the sense that he got more votes than anyone else - but a candidate only needed 1.5% in the primary to advance to the general.)

No one secured a majority In the October general election, so the top two vote-getters (Massa and Milei, in that order) went on to face off in a November runoff. Milei won, but to secure that victory and defeat Massa, he needed the support of the opposition coalition (Bullrich's faction) - and in order to do that, he had to come to terms with them.

[bold emphasis added]​

Have Argentine Voters FINALLY Chosen Liberty? Time Will Tell
https://mises.org/power-market/have-argentine-voters-finally-chosen-liberty-time-will-tell
{Octavio Bermudez | 20 November 2023}

[...]

Milei's plan is a moderate one if seen through ideal lenses but as I have already pointed out, it is the most libertarian program that could be advanced upon without being ostracized by the public and mainstream media. Compromises were made after the general elections. The Libertarian-Republican alliance was formed to confront the Peronist regime in the ballot boxes, Milei allied himself with his former competitor Patricia Bullrich and former president Mauricio Macri to rally the necessary votes to win in the ballotage against the leftist Peronist candidate Sergio Massa. The alliance succeeded in calling for the votes necessary to win. It was an epic campaign, thousands attended Milei's rallies crying out "Liberty!" In many parts of the country, shouts of joy and relief were heard when the Peronist candidate recognized his defeat on live TV. I of course joined the people in the cries for victory.

Bearing in mind the compromises made in the alliance to defeat Peronism, the most crucial libertarian proposals such as slashing public spending and taxes, deregulating the economy and labor market, free trade, privatization of public companies (like the oil company "YPF" and the state airline "Aerolineas Argentinas") and abolition of the central bank are going to be implemented, at least on paper. Milei, although an anarcho-capitalist has had to moderate in order to gain office, once taking the reins of the state we shall see how much of the freedom program he proposes is implemented.

Will it be a revolution of liberty? History will only tell.

IOW: Milei is not a unilateral dictator. He will have to accommodate the non-libertarian anti-Peronists who helped him win, and he cannot simply do as he would like (which would have been the case anyway, even if he had been able to win without the support of the opposition coalition). In fact, there will be times when he will have to do as he would not like. It remains to be seen how often and to what degree that is the case. That is the nature of politics (especially democratic politics) - and it is why politics is such a fraught and dicey venue in which to pursue liberty.

As I've said before:

If Milei wins, don't expect him to be able to work wonders. He almost certainly will not.

Their system will not "go gentle into that good night". They will do everything in their power to stymie, undermine, sabotage, and destroy any serious or significant challenges to their authority and control (up to and including doing massive damage to themselves and others, if they become desperate enough - as long as they still get to be in charge of whatever is left).

Milei's victory is certainly a heartening harbinger, and that is no small thing - but much more is required than just one man being elected to a single "top-down" position on the basis of a grab-bag of vague, inchoate, and often contradictory popular resentments (however deep or intense those resentments may be).

Of course he isn't gong to do all the things he promises. He won't be able to do them all.

The same thing would have been the case if Ron Paul had become POTUS.

I am [surprised] that Milei achieved victory in the election. I wasn't holding my breath for that to happen - and I will not be holding my breath waiting for Milei to succeed in implementing his agenda, either. To the extent that he achieves any significant success in doing so, I will be just as pleasantly surprised as I was at his electoral win.

They will do everything in their power to undermine, stymie, thwart, discredit, disrupt, and sabotage Milei's policies and endeavors.

[...]

But perhaps I will be pleasantly surprised in that regard as well. I hope so. We shall see.

 

[John-G]

Remember folks, he will bend his principles in order to make money.

Far-right Deputy-elect Javier Milei, whom many had likened to Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro, has been pictured taking what turned out to be his second dose of a COVID-19 vaccine, very much to the disappointment of his constituency who had hoped the soon-to-be MP would become a defender against a possible drive to make vaccination compulsory.Milei was elected on behalf of the City of Buenos Aires, while his fellow economist José Luis Espert was also voted into Congress on behalf of the same Libertarian Party but in the name of the Province of Buenos Aires. During a TV show over the weekend, Espert expressed his support for mandatory vaccination because “you're not giving any freedom to the others if you choose not to get vaccinated.”
Also in a TV show Monday, Milei said “I'm not an anti-vaxxer; I'm very much a provaxxer and I believe in science.” He also admitted he had taken two doses of the Sinopharm drug after thoroughly considering his options.
To his disillusioned voters, he also explained he needed to get jabbed to travel abroad where vaccines are required and where he makes money through his conferences as a liberal economist.“Those who branded me as anti-vaccines are exposed as liars and want to charge the issue (of vaccination) as a contradiction of mine. In that habit of putting everything in binary format, the easiest thing for progressives is to say that it was anti-vaccination,” Milei argued.
However, just a month ago, during a TV debate before the elections, he had spoken against being vaccinated “because I am not a risk group” and “not all vaccines are well proven.”
“Now I'm entering Congress, I am going to give up my diet (MP's salary), on December 10 I leave my job, I have to go to give talks to Uruguay, the United States, Chile and Spain and I cannot enter without vaccines. What do I do? Do I run out of income? What do I live on?,” Milei said in his defence.

Milei voters were mocked on social media after most of them had relied on the economist's alleged freedom of choice stance regarding vaccination when deciding their votes. And while Milei has not said he was particularly in favour of mandates, another deputy-elect from his party has.

"Argentine Bolsonaro" not quite so after taking second dose of Covid-19 vax — MercoPress

 

[ClaytonB]

Remember folks, he will bend his principles in order to make money.

As a libertarian, I support the right of Javier Milei to inject whatever gunk into his body he chooses. As a medical decision, I think it's stupid. But people have the right to make mistakes, be stupid or act recklessly... that's called freedom as in, "VIVA LA LIBERTAD!"

 

[John-G]

As a libertarian, I support the right of Javier Milei to inject whatever gunk into his body he chooses. As a medical decision, I think it's stupid. But people have the right to make mistakes, be stupid or act recklessly... that's called freedom as in, "VIVA LA LIBERTAD!"

See, there is nothing wrong with changing your mind, but when you are a leader that millions look up to, it is important to explain your change in position.

However, just a month ago, during a TV debate before the elections, he had spoken against being vaccinated “because I am not a risk group” and “not all vaccines are well proven.”

First, during the COVID-19 pandemic, Milei was one of the most ferocious critics of lockdowns and restrictions imposed by the government. He openly states he is not vaccinated and that he won’t take the shot because the vaccines are not proven to be fully effective. That statement made him the idol of the marginal but noisy anti-vaccine movement in the country.[
Libertarian and/or Populist Right? A New Actor at the Argentinian Parliament | illiberalism.org

 

[acptulsa]

See, there is nothing wrong with changing your mind, but when you are a leader that millions look up to, it is important to explain your change in position.

I don't see a change in position. Not all vaccines are well proven and the vaccines are not proven to be fully effective sounds pretty close to identical to me. What difference do you see there? I'm curious.

 

[ClaytonB]

See, there is nothing wrong with changing your mind, but when you are a leader that millions look up to, it is important to explain your change in position.

What change?!

However, just a month ago, during a TV debate before the elections, he had spoken against being vaccinated “because I am not a risk group” and “not all vaccines are well proven.”

OK? And?

First, during the COVID-19 pandemic, Milei was one of the most ferocious critics of lockdowns and restrictions imposed by the government. He openly states he is not vaccinated and that he won’t take the shot because the vaccines are not proven to be fully effective. That statement made him the idol of the marginal but noisy anti-vaccine movement in the country.

What change!

Look, let's assume you're 100% right -- Milei is a WEF sleeper-agent and is secretly not a libertarian, etc. etc. What is the harm that is coming to me by supporting his message? What is the 17-trillion dimensional hyper-chess mistake that I'm making here?! There isn't any, because Milei's messaging is plumbline libertarianism... you couldn't get it any better from Rothbard himself. Milei isn't just quipping. He isn't just reciting talking-points, he's spitting accessible summaries of Austrian economic theory and libertarian philosophy on broadcast national TV, to jam-packed stadiums. That's not "controlled-opp". If he is DS, then he and his handlers are committing suicide because this is, as I noted before, Satan casting out Satan. You can't spit the full-length, unadulterated truth on live TV and call that "controlled-opp"... that's just "opp".

In other words, even if you turn out to be right, it doesn't matter until then. If Milei turns or flips, he will be paved under a metric ton of anti-Milei memes. We will get more meme-age out of his betrayal than we did from his support. That the DS is sneaky is a matter of course. That they're always pulling stunts is a matter of course. Who cares? When my enemy gives me an opening, I'm taking it. Even if he has "ambush plans" down the road, so what, I'm already prepared either way, because I know they're a den of snakes. There's no minority report on this, which is OB's point... if he's controlled-opp, we need more of this kind of controlled-opp. When the libertarian message wins a national Presidential election, the black-pillers suddenly appear out of the woodwork and change the subject to the personality of Milei. Is Milei unstable? Is he converting to Judaism? Is he controlled by the Democrat party? Or Israel? I don't know, and it doesn't matter, because what won in Argentina is Milei's message which is libertarianism, aka VIVA LA LIBERTAD...

 

[ClaytonB]

List re-updated:

Official Milei Predictions List (will update over time):

• Milei is going to invade the Falklands
• Milei is going to send money/weapons/troops to Ukraine
• Milei is going to send money/weapons/troops to Israel
• Milei is going to invade the ME (since he's a "neocon" and that's the true definition of a neocon...)
• Milei is going to institute CBDCs
• Milei is going to "socialize" Argentine Airlines, or sell it to the oligarchs
• Milei is going to become Jewish
• Milei is in cahoots with the Democrats
• Milei supports the vaxx and lockdowns and will probably institute them once he is in power
• ...

 

[Swordsmyth]

This is the exact same things that the Left was screeching when Trump met with Un and others that they had designated as geopolitical unpersons. I have no idea why he's meeting with Clinton, but rubbing shoulders with bad characters is part of the job for any President, especially in Corrupcion Central: South America. Have you considered the possibility that Clinton may be the one begging for this meeting? Or maybe he's being forced? Folks really need to expand beyond the Left-Right paradigm. It never really made sense but in Clown World, you have to be insane to keep believing in Left-Right. The only real political dichotomy is slavery-vs-freedom. Everything else is a distraction.

PS: Keep in mind that sick Willy is slick Willy... of all the ex-POTUS's, he's probably the smartest and the most likely to betray The Club when it comes down to a choice between them, or his own skin. That certain people are only out for #1 can actually be a virtue in the sense that it makes them more predictable and doing a deal with them is more likely to hold up than with others who always think they're the smartest person in the room and they're going to figure out a sneaky way to rip you off...

Un was a current head of state.

 

[Swordsmyth]

What change?!

"he had spoken against being vaccinated"

To:

"Javier Milei, whom many had likened to Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro, has been pictured taking what turned out to be his second dose of a COVID-19 vaccine"


Trump got vaccinated, but not after saying he was against this vaccine.

 

[John-G]

I don't see a change in position. Not all vaccines are well proven and the vaccines are not proven to be fully effective sounds pretty close to identical to me. What difference do you see there? I'm curious.

However, just a month ago, during a TV debate before the elections, he had spoken against being vaccinated “because I am not a risk group” and “not all vaccines are well proven

He said he was not in the risk group and the vaccines are not proven. So does he now think hes in the risk group and when in his mind did he believe the vaccine was proven.

I am trying to show that the man just talks and says things which he thinks is popular but has yet to deliver. Heck, Bush, Obama and Trump ran on anti war policies and yet none of them ended any wars. How was the fact that their election proving that anti war policy is popular helped with anything. Political ideology is important but acting on it is 1000x more important.

 

[CaptUSA]

I am trying to show that the man just talks and says things which he thinks is popular but has yet to deliver.

That's not what I'm seeing. An Austrian economist wins the presidency of a major country vehemently professing the ideas of liberty and limited government and you are actively hoping he fails to prove your hot take right.

Not a good look.

 

[nobody's_hero]

I am trying to show that the man just talks and says things which he thinks is popular but has yet to deliver.

An-cap ideas are popular now?

I mean, of all the platforms that would help you get elected, that's not a winner in most countries. Hell, he could have ran on "At least I'm not Peron" and it probably would have worked. He didn't have to dive in with both feet on a still-relatively-obscure campaign message. Most people in the USA think "an-cap" is some sort of headwear. At least in the USA, "I'll give you free ponies" is still the best way to get voters easily. He could have gone with: "I'm better at giving away free ponies."

And, if these ideas *are* becoming popular in Argentina, who is to blame for that? How does a country that has lived, breathed, and worshiped socialism for 2-3 generations even learn what libertarianism is? This guy might be the worst controlled opposition ever because he's maybe too good at spreading a message.

Let's say that Milei fails miserably in his presidency . . . he's still spent the better part of the campaign season actively trying to convince the Argentinian populace that they don't need politicians as much as politicians need them. That would be the worst kind of people to try to control.

I get that there are lousy messengers out there. The message is solid and I fail to see how it helps the elites.

 

[nobody's_hero]

List re-updated:

Official Milei Predictions List (will update over time):

• Milei is going to invade the Falklands
• Milei is going to send money/weapons/troops to Ukraine
• Milei is going to send money/weapons/troops to Israel
• Milei is going to invade the ME (since he's a "neocon" and that's the true definition of a neocon...)
• Milei is going to institute CBDCs
• Milei is going to "socialize" Argentine Airlines, or sell it to the oligarchs
• Milei is going to become Jewish
• Milei is in cahoots with the Democrats
• Milei supports the vaxx and lockdowns and will probably institute them once he is in power
• ...

I'll add one because I do actually have reservations about it:

His plan to replace the peso with the fiat dollar is going to end in disaster (for various reasons, but mostly because he has an opportunity to replace it with something of real value but seems fixated on choosing the US Dollar).