CFL Spent $350,000 on a pro-war Colorado candidate

[MsDoodahs]

Um...is it the end of the day yet?

 

[Mini-Me]

Um...is it the end of the day yet?

Maybe they forgot it's Thirsty Thursday until they realized they had to run out the door, and they'll get back to us around 3:45 in the afternoon tomorrow.

 

[catdd]

Ron Paul wouldn't endorse McCain even when he was being pressured by the GOP, so I know he wouldn't donate money to a pro war politician.
No way.

 

[JK/SEA]

Um...is it the end of the day yet?

couple more minutes...

tick tock...

if i miss american idol waiting for this i'm gonna get really really mad...

 

[GunnyFreedom]

Done
$25 sent to Gunny.

thanks specs!

No, the liberty movement is not about money, but money is indeed a means of communication. I don't mean in the sense that if you get a 6 million dollar moneybomb you will make the news, but in the sense that money enables the production of handbills, flyers, slimjims, radio and television spots.

There are more people at the ground level who respons to this message than we can scarcely believe -- people who may be easily led by the nose from a controlled media because they were too busy with work or hobbies.

But because of the current economic crisis, that work and those hobbies are being stripped away and leaving angry confused people searching for explanations.

This is where it becomes more critical than ever that we all step in and provide not only the explanation they seek, but positive and proactive solutions to escape from the problems we have become immersed in.

Mini, Klamath, I get it, I really do. giving money is hard. I know -- I gave my very last dime to Ron Paul 4 times, twice in 2007, and twice in 2008. It's hard, and when it doesn't bear fruit it's even harder.

But please remember that without money, people like Rand Paul, Adam Kokesh, Peter Schiff, and Ron Paul will not have the opportunity to represent us. The fact of it makes me sick to my soul, but the bottom line is that if we are going to restore the Constitutional Order, we have to elect Constitutionalists to public office, and to elect anybody to public office, sadly, requires money. At this point there is no way to get around that.

Perhaps term limits will significantly reduce the opportunity for lobbyist corruption, and therefore reduce the cash profile needed to run for office. In TRUTH, if you remove all the lobbyist influence, US Congress should only need about $200k and State House should only need about $20k. Enough for the materials your volunteers will use during the campaign, period.

But until we plug that hole, this is the world we live in, and if we want to change it, we have to put our people in the position to do that. I have learned, first hand, that we just can't do that without money. I wish it were otherwise, but it isn't.

 

[Mini-Me]

thanks specs!

No, the liberty movement is not about money, but money is indeed a means of communication. I don't mean in the sense that if you get a 6 million dollar moneybomb you will make the news, but in the sense that money enables the production of handbills, flyers, slimjims, radio and television spots.

There are more people at the ground level who respons to this message than we can scarcely believe -- people who may be easily led by the nose from a controlled media because they were too busy with work or hobbies.

But because of the current economic crisis, that work and those hobbies are being stripped away and leaving angry confused people searching for explanations.

This is where it becomes more critical than ever that we all step in and provide not only the explanation they seek, but positive and proactive solutions to escape from the problems we have become immersed in.

Mini, Klamath, I get it, I really do. giving money is hard. I know -- I gave my very last dime to Ron Paul 4 times, twice in 2007, and twice in 2008. It's hard, and when it doesn't bear fruit it's even harder.

But please remember that without money, people like Rand Paul, Adam Kokesh, Peter Schiff, and Ron Paul will not have the opportunity to represent us. The fact of it makes me sick to my soul, but the bottom line is that if we are going to restore the Constitutional Order, we have to elect Constitutionalists to public office, and to elect anybody to public office, sadly, requires money. At this point there is no way to get around that.

Perhaps term limits will significantly reduce the opportunity for lobbyist corruption, and therefore reduce the cash profile needed to run for office. In TRUTH, if you remove all the lobbyist influence, US Congress should only need about $200k and State House should only need about $20k. Enough for the materials your volunteers will use during the campaign, period.

But until we plug that hole, this is the world we live in, and if we want to change it, we have to put our people in the position to do that. I have learned, first hand, that we just can't do that without money. I wish it were otherwise, but it isn't.

I think you misread my intent, Gunny. I know that money helps, and when it's spent in the right places, it translates into slim-jims and such. I was just trying to be uplifting and everything and basically say that none of this is the end of the world, even if our national fundraising schtick died out. (Well, I was also making the point that focusing so much on money has made us lose sight of some things, but I was mostly referring to the CFL anyway and their constant nagging emails...)

 

[dannno]

Ron Paul wouldn't endorse McCain even when he was being pressured by the GOP, so I know he wouldn't donate money to a pro war politician.
No way.

Well the organization used some sort of test and scored them.

Listening to this guy's speech, he believes that ALL of these wars we are fighting should be declared... where he disagrees with Ron Paul is that we should be going out and killing these people.. So he probably got some points on the test for the declaration of war issue, and past the fiscal positions with flying colors.

 

[catdd]

A neo-constitutionalist is better than a neocon but just as crazy. Seems that nearly every politician has accepted the fact that they must be pro war if they want elected.

 

[GunnyFreedom]

I think you misread my intent, Gunny. I know that money helps, and when it's spent in the right places, it translates into slim-jims and such. I was just trying to be uplifting and everything and basically say that none of this is the end of the world, even if our national fundraising schtick died out. (Well, I was also making the point that focusing so much on money has made us lose sight of some things, but I was mostly referring to the CFL anyway and their constant nagging emails...)

It was really more from Klamath than you from whom I was getting the "don't ever give money, to anybody" vibe -- I'm trying to avoid being too specific. I also truly understand Klamath's frustration here. Setbacks are inevitable in life, and especially in a war...and this is a war, a war for the soul of our nation.

Our soldiers and militia had many many more setbacks than victories in the Revolution, but they pressed on. Had they given up then we would still be on our knees before the British Crown today, probably with outright gun bans and CCTV on every corner in America.

They did not give up, and neither can we. Sometimes we want to, Lord knows that sometimes I wonder if it's really even possible for me to face a rich country club Dem when I'm at $2200 at a point when I should be at $12,000. I feel the edge of panic creeping in and then I remember those cold soldiers at Valley Forge enduring far worse than I can even imagine on the eve of one of their finest victories in the entire war.

It is when things are the darkest that the brightest light is able to shine. The indomitable American spirit lives on -- through US -- as we sweat blood and tears to wake the sheeple from their coma.

We can and we will win this war, simply because we must.

 

[klamath]

thanks specs!

No, the liberty movement is not about money, but money is indeed a means of communication. I don't mean in the sense that if you get a 6 million dollar moneybomb you will make the news, but in the sense that money enables the production of handbills, flyers, slimjims, radio and television spots.

There are more people at the ground level who respons to this message than we can scarcely believe -- people who may be easily led by the nose from a controlled media because they were too busy with work or hobbies.

But because of the current economic crisis, that work and those hobbies are being stripped away and leaving angry confused people searching for explanations.

This is where it becomes more critical than ever that we all step in and provide not only the explanation they seek, but positive and proactive solutions to escape from the problems we have become immersed in.

Mini, Klamath, I get it, I really do. giving money is hard. I know -- I gave my very last dime to Ron Paul 4 times, twice in 2007, and twice in 2008. It's hard, and when it doesn't bear fruit it's even harder.

But please remember that without money, people like Rand Paul, Adam Kokesh, Peter Schiff, and Ron Paul will not have the opportunity to represent us. The fact of it makes me sick to my soul, but the bottom line is that if we are going to restore the Constitutional Order, we have to elect Constitutionalists to public office, and to elect anybody to public office, sadly, requires money. At this point there is no way to get around that.

Perhaps term limits will significantly reduce the opportunity for lobbyist corruption, and therefore reduce the cash profile needed to run for office. In TRUTH, if you remove all the lobbyist influence, US Congress should only need about $200k and State House should only need about $20k. Enough for the materials your volunteers will use during the campaign, period.

But until we plug that hole, this is the world we live in, and if we want to change it, we have to put our people in the position to do that. I have learned, first hand, that we just can't do that without money. I wish it were otherwise, but it isn't.

You are right Gunny, money can spread the message. I have always been a donater to individual candidates as that is the only way you can somewhat have control of the issues it is being spent on. I am not a member nor have I donated to CFL for that reason. I can fully understand the frustration of those members that have donated to an organization that supports what appears to be a candidate that is in pretty bad conflict with RP's ideals. If the ideals of CFL have drifted that far from RP's then the donor base will dry up rightfully so.
But when people start implying that it is embezellment and crookery in their feeding frenzy they better realize that if they are right they will find it a pretty sad day of gloating how right they were, when the stories about RP in the MSN are about the embezlement trial of RP's CFL.

 

[gls]

http://coloradoindependent.com/46727/ken-buck-campaign-ad-stirs-up-supporters-and-speculation

Ken Buck campaign ad stirs up supporters and speculation

By JOHN TOMASIC 1/28/10 2:40 PM

The U.S. Senate campaign for Weld County D.A. Ken Buck reportedly knew nothing of the ad before it aired and even now isn’t sure where the ad is running. “I heard it’s playing on the networks. I think I found that out from the [Denver] Post,” Spokesperson Owen Loftus told the Colorado Independent. “It was made by that 527, so we had no contact before it ran, and we can’t have any contact with them now.”

Loftus said the appearance of the ad was a pleasant surprise in that it dovetailed with a tour Buck has taken around the state recently. “I think it has helped getting Ken’s name out,” he said, adding that it may have also helped fuel the bump in contributions the campaign has seen in the last couple of weeks. The ad has definitely fueled speculation that powerful forces are lining up behind Buck to defeat GOP frontrunner Jane Norton.

The organization behind the ad, Campaign For Liberty, told TPM that the ad is not a strict candidate endorsement, which would violate the law. The ad is intended instead to promote the libertarian/conservative group’s candidate issues surveys.

“We want every candidate to answer our surveys. So as soon as another candidate answers our survey, we’ll probably do another ad stating that,” said spokesperson Gary Howard.

At conservative website Rocky Mountain Right, speculation is that the ad may have come out of a national strategizing conference call hosted in November by the Senate Conservatives Fund, founded by RedState’s Erick Erickson and Sen. Jim DeMint. The main point was to decide which U.S. Senate primaries were the most important ones to watch. “The Colorado race was near the top of the list,” writes the RMR blogger.

Soon the Buck campaign was encouraging supporters to send messages to the fund making the case for Buck. Is the Senate Conservatives Fund behind the new Buck ad?

That’s not the only theory. In the comments thread of a Colorado Independent story this week, a Norton supporter offered a preview of the kind of whispering attacks that Buck might come under as his grassroots candidacy builds steam. The commenter suggests the ad was the work of wealthy Colorado gay-rights activist Tim Gill who, the theory goes, is supporting Buck because last year Buck chose to prosecute the murder of transgender Greeley resident Angie Zapata as a hate crime. The prosecution was a victory for the Zapata family and the gay community that rallied around the trial.

Compared to the speculation it’s generating, the campaign ad itself is pretty vanilla. It features a montage of photos running behind a low-tone voiceover that hits on predictably vague strongly worded talking points:

“Career politicians are stealing our liberty and bankrupting our country.”

“[Buck’s] a tough prosecutor who will take on the D.C. insiders.”

 

[wwwresearcher]

Buck says we need to be in Afghanistan for another 10 years. We've already been there 8 years. Why does he think we should believe when he says we're going to leave in 10yrs. Seems to me, we'll never leave.

"We are told this effort will take at least 10 years."

 

[specsaregood]

The commenter suggests the ad was the work of wealthy Colorado gay-rights activist Tim Gill who, the theory goes, is supporting Buck because last year Buck chose to prosecute the murder of transgender Greeley resident Angie Zapata as a hate crime. The prosecution was a victory for the Zapata family and the gay community that rallied around the trial.

That guy is mentioned in 2 threads on rpfs:
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?p=2083848

A recent Blade report raised questions about the extent of influence that Tim Gill, a wealthy gay Democratic donor, has over the organization. Sources said Gill Action Fund contributed $250,000 annually to the organization in 2007 and 2008 — about one-third of the group’s budget — and that Gill Action was involved in decision-making at Log Cabin.

And evidently he is a huge political donor.
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?p=549750

 

[Meatwasp]

what does Dr. paul say about it all? Anyone heard?

 

[LittleLightShining]

But when people start implying that it is embezellment and crookery in their feeding frenzy they better realize that if they are right they will find it a pretty sad day of gloating how right they were, when the stories about RP in the MSN are about the embezlement trial of RP's CFL.

Well, we shall see. There is a board of directors and if they care about him AT ALL they were thinking of him and kept him out of this debacle.

I don't want Dr. Paul to be dragged through the mud but I REALLY don't trust this group of people running C4L. I don't think they give a rat's ass about wht kind of damage they're doing with this whole thing. I don't think they care because they don't care about the principles of the organization they are working for. Debbie Hopper busted up the CP over abortion and she could care less whether Rothfeld agrees with us on foreign policy. Foreign Policy is the one plank of our platform that should never be compromised. It is what binds all of us. left and right, together in our support of Ron Paul.

If Debbie is quick to dismiss my concerns and try to shut me down-- little old me-- what makes anyone think she gives a rat's ass about what any of us think? They weren't making any money til Rothfeld came on board. The people who were there before they made money was us. apparently it wasn't enough to have a motivated group of fired up activists ready to go. They needed money. And when Rothfeld proved he could get the money without the activists that was the end of that.

 

[nobody's_hero]

I still want to know what kind of survey is worth $350,000.

Survey: "Question 1: Are you a neocon?"

Buck: "Answer: Yes"

CFL: "Wow, cool. Here's three-hundred and fifty thousand dollars."


I mean, really, what the hell?

 

[wwwresearcher]

deleted

 

[LittleLightShining]

That guy is mentioned in 2 threads on rpfs:
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?p=2083848


And evidently he is a huge political donor.
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?p=549750

Holy crap! Tim Gill poured money into all kinds of organizations in VT before the gay marriage vote. This is part of how I know where to look for non-profit organizations. This is insane.

 

[GunnyFreedom]

You are right Gunny, money can spread the message. I have always been a donater to individual candidates as that is the only way you can somewhat have control of the issues it is being spent on. I am not a member nor have I donated to CFL for that reason. I can fully understand the frustration of those members that have donated to an organization that supports what appears to be a candidate that is in pretty bad conflict with RP's ideals. If the ideals of CFL have drifted that far from RP's then the donor base will dry up rightfully so.
But when people start implying that it is embezellment and crookery in their feeding frenzy they better realize that if they are right they will find it a pretty sad day of gloating how right they were, when the stories about RP in the MSN are about the embezlement trial of RP's CFL.

I misunderstood then and I apologize.

I think there is a lot of frustration to go around right now, and it is my sincere hope that we all can recognize that frustration -- for whatever reason -- can cloud judgement, and therefore we do not allow any hard feelings to persist after the controversy at the heart of this thread is finally resolved.

 

[AuH2O]

Holy crap! Tim Gill poured money into all kinds of organizations in VT before the gay marriage vote. This is part of how I know where to look for non-profit organizations. This is insane.

Gill is also famous for knocking out a slew of conservative state legislators in Iowa to install a pro-homosexual marriage backstop to protect their supreme court's gay marriage ruling. Plus he pretty much single-handedly took out Marilyn Musgrave in 2008.