The Revolution needs you to vote for Obama

[Rangeley]

phree, I completely agree with you on an emotional level. After last night, I would love to see everyone that was up there get voted out of office after their smug show of self satisfaction. On an emotional level, seeking revenge by voting Obama is something I would love to do, even ignoring all of his stances.

But we can't get caught up in that emotional urge to get revenge the quick and easy way. The country doesn't just need McCain to lose, it needs to be steered in the right direction. A vote for Obama might help lead to a McCain loss, but it doesn't change the course - it just puts in another person that will follow it, who isn't in our party screwing with us but probably would be up there doing the same things if he was.

Voting for a third party candidate will send a message - not that we want revenge, but that we want true change towards a Constitutional government and not even tomfoolery to the degree that was pulled last night can change our focus from that goal. Thats ultimately how we really get back at them.

 

[phree]

Fuck You!! We dont' need to choose McCain or Obama!! Didn't that Ventura guy say there was a guy who said "If you choose the lesser evil, you are still choosing evil" Fucking god damn Obama spy get the fuck out of the forums before I slap you silly with the constitution.

It's emotional types like you that are the problem.

If you can't refute my logic then stfu.

 

[phree]

phree, I completely agree with you on an emotional level. After last night, I would love to see everyone that was up there get voted out of office after their smug show of self satisfaction. On an emotional level, seeking revenge by voting Obama is something I would love to do, even ignoring all of his stances.

But we can't get caught up in that emotional urge to get revenge the quick and easy way. The country doesn't just need McCain to lose, it needs to be steered in the right direction. A vote for Obama might help lead to a McCain loss, but it doesn't change the course - it just puts in another person that will follow it, who isn't in our party screwing with us but probably would be up there doing the same things if he was.

Voting for a third party candidate will send a message - not that we want revenge, but that we want true change towards a Constitutional government and not even tomfoolery to the degree that was pulled last night can change our focus from that goal. Thats ultimately how we really get back at them.

Go back and read my original post and then I'll be interested in what you think.

 

[Rangeley]

Go back and read my original post and then I'll be interested in what you think.

I read it, thank you.

 

[Warrior_of_Freedom]

Go back and read my original post and then I'll be interested in what you think.

Shut the fuck up, get out of here . We don't need your filth !

 

[phree]

I read it, thank you.

Then what's all that stuff about voting against the GOP out of spite. You clearly didn't read it carefully.

 

[dsentell]

I won't argue with your logic, but

Under no circumstances will I vote for Obama

I have principles

 

[phree]

Shut the fuck up, get out of here . We don't need your filth !

You are the last type of person anyone needs on their side in a fight. You're narrow minded and emotional.

You're certainly not a warrior.

 

[phree]

I won't argue with your logic, but

Under no circumstances will I vote for Obama

I have principles

Then I must assume that your principles are based on emotion and not logic. This is how we lose the battle and lose the war.

 

[gls]

Your logic makes no sense. Obama supporters want big government. If he wins, he will give them big government. Why you think that his supporters would turn around and join a movement toward Constitutionally limited-government - when they have shown nothing but disdain for it all along - is beyond me.

He has already sold out his supporters when it comes to war and civil liberties, and all they do is make excuses for him. An Obama presidency would be more of the same. It's much easier to be an apologist and redirect the blame than to admit one was wrong. It has already started and would continue throughout his administration.

 

[-lotus-]

You keep telling us to refute your logic, but where is the logic in saying 'Hey, the country's screwed up and the only way to bring about positive change is to let this guy win and screw the country up even more!'

Youre not even asking us to choose a lesser of two evils. Youre basically asking us to forget about everything we did this year, the money bombs, the rallies, the meetups, the letters we wrote, the money we donated, the caucases we won, the debates that we dominated.......and vote for our enemy? Are you stupid or have you been smoking something??

This is a no brainer right here folks. Stick to your principles or sell out and hope for the best.

 

[jdmyprez_deo_vindice]

my view

First, what message do we send to our fellow fighters for freedom and those casual observers out there if we abandon our principles and help to elect someone like Obama? No matter what reason you give, it will always seem like a temper tantrum to those on the outside looking in.

Second, If there is one massive lesson that I have learned from all of this it would be that I do not have to hold my nose and vote for the lesser of two evils. I will never enter a voting booth again and cast my vote for who I think might destroy America least.

Third, Ron Paul is right. Our best bet to get real change is through the Republican party. How many Bush Republicans out there woke up and realized what was going on? How many more are going to wake up when McCain goes down in flames in November? We need to stay the course and focus our energy on bringing the Republican party back to it's roots. If we stay Republicans and stay involved in the Republican party than we are going to slowly increase our leverage within that party. If we abandon the party and come back a few years from now than they are going to blackball us even more than they did this time. We need to keep making noise and always abide by our principles because they will not be able to ignore us forever and they will not want to ignore us when the Democrats run wild on them this November.

Fourth, Obama is basically worshipped in this country.. do you honestly think he needs our help?

 

[dsentell]

you keep telling us to refute your logic, but where is the logic in saying 'hey, the country's screwed up and the only way to bring about positive change is to let this guy win and screw the country up even more!'

Youre not even asking us to choose a lesser of two evils. Youre basically asking us to forget about everything we did this year, the money bombs, the rallies, the meetups, the letters we wrote, the money we donated, the caucases we won, the debates that we dominated.......and vote for our enemy? Are you stupid or have you been smoking something??

This is a no brainer right here folks. Stick to your principles or sell out and hope for the best.

+1776

 

[Warrior_of_Freedom]

Then I must assume that your principles are based on emotion and not logic. This is how we lose the battle and lose the war.

Why hasn't anyone banned this Obama troll yet?

 

[phree]

Your logic makes no sense. Obama supporters want big government. If he wins, he will give them big government. Why you think that his supporters would turn around and join a movement toward Constitutionally limited-government - when they have shown nothing but disdain for it all along - is beyond me.

He has already sold out his supporters when it comes to war and civil liberties, and all they do is make excuses for him. An Obama presidency would be more of the same. It's much easier to be an apologist and redirect the blame than to admit one was wrong. It has already started and would continue throughout his administration.

You underestimate Obama's chances of failure if elected. His followers think he's anti-war, will end racism, will fight for regular people. They aren't as stupid as you think they are. They want change and when Obama fails to provide it they will be bitter. That benefits the real agents of change, the Revolution.

 

[porcupine]

Don't be an idiot. Voting for Obama is getting all the neo-con foreign policy with a large dose of socialism AND a hatred for the 2nd Amendment AND judges who will let it all happen. And at the end of it all, if we continue our current dispersed strategy, we won't be able to wield much influence on this party anyway.

 

[phree]

You keep telling us to refute your logic, but where is the logic in saying 'Hey, the country's screwed up and the only way to bring about positive change is to let this guy win and screw the country up even more!'

Youre not even asking us to choose a lesser of two evils. Youre basically asking us to forget about everything we did this year, the money bombs, the rallies, the meetups, the letters we wrote, the money we donated, the caucases we won, the debates that we dominated.......and vote for our enemy? Are you stupid or have you been smoking something??

This is a no brainer right here folks. Stick to your principles or sell out and hope for the best.

I'm not high or stupid. I'm thinking in terms of what will grow the revolution in the fastest way. Protest votes and votes for McCain won't do that.

Sometimes people need to be shocked to realize the need for (real) change. The best person to win this election is arguably the worst candidate, Obama.

 

[Rangeley]

Then what's all that stuff about voting against the GOP out of spite. You clearly didn't read it carefully.

Actually, phree, I think you are misunderstanding my post. Nowhere did I impugn your reasoning - I merely said that I would agree with you on an emotional level.

And that is the absolute truth.

The second portion of my post delved into the simple logic that a vote for Obama is simply a vote to stay on the same course with someone else as captain. I see no logical reason to do that. McCain and Obama will both lead us in the wrong direction. Therefore, neither gets my vote.

Counting on Obama to somewhow alienate people to our cause all by himself is no more logical then counting on McCain to somehow alienate people to our cause all by himself. No matter how the cards fall, we will have someone in power that is doing the wrong things. It is up for us to show there is another way - that not all politicians flip flop and some actually stand for the principles that made our country great. We have to bring that message to them.

How, now, is it logical to purposely soil that message by showing we are just like anyone else, abandoning principles in supporting one bad idea over another?

 

[hillertexas]

Phree,

Here's my logic when faced with war (McCain) or socialism (Obama):

An anti-war "faction" is much easier to grow than an anti-socialism one. Once you go socialist, it is hard to go back because of the welfare characteristics of socialism. Big picture/long term, I think Obama could fuck us over far worse than McCain...although I am completely undecided as to where to cast my vote at the moment (and no I will not just be picking between Obama and McCain). Definitely not Obama, though.

Just as it is childish to vote for Obama to spite the GOP...it seems far more reckless to vote for Obama to "let america crumble" or "let them see how bad it can get".

I am open to hearing everyone's arguments and would love it if we could all get on the same page...who knows, maybe it is I that am on the wrong one...but I thought I would let everyone know my opinion on the matter as of today.

 

[phree]

Why hasn't anyone banned this Obama troll yet?

Because I have a good point which is aimed at furthering the aims of the Revolution.