The Madness of Presidential Tariffs

[Swordsmyth]

The tariffs aren't strategic or tactical. Trump is disconnecting the USA from trade period to be fully self-sufficient. Exports won't materialize however as the rest of the world will be far too competitive and the USA will slowly become an economic backwater with technology 10 years behind everyone else.

But you will be 'soverign' as a nation if not as individuals. Because yeah the USA was such a victim before this lol.

The most annoying part is the victim mentality, and second the obfuscation. But thats because its not my economy being destroyed.

Although the standard playbook when the victimhood causes economic collapse is to blame external and inernal enemies and go on a rampage with everything dedicated to the war machine and revenge, so itsw going to suck for me too pretty soon.

LOL

Dream on.

 

[acptulsa]

Dream on.

Somebody says, "...it's going to suck for me too pretty soon", and that's your response?

Learn to read.

 

[Voluntarist]

A $6 Trillion Trump Tax Increase​

Mr. Trump’s chief trade adviser, Peter Navarro, is boasting about what he says will amount to a $6 trillion tax increase from the tariffs.

“Tariffs are going to raise about $600 billion a year, about $6 trillion over a 10-year period,” Mr. Navarro told Fox News on Sunday. This is on top of $100 billion a year from Mr. Trump’s car and truck tariffs. He also tried to claim that “the message is that tariffs are tax cuts.”

George Orwell, call your office. In the real economic world, a tariff is a tax. If you raise $600 billion more a year in revenue for the federal government, you are taking that amount away from individuals and businesses in the private economy.

By any definition that is a tax increase, and the $600 billion figure would be one of the largest in U.S. history. It amounts to about 2% of gross domestic product, and it would take the federal tax share of GDP above 19%. The average since 1975 is about 17.3%. Democrats, who love tax increases, haven’t dared pass such a large revenue heist.

 

[Swordsmyth]

A $6 Trillion Trump Tax Increase​

Oh NO! we're replacing a tax you can't avoid with a tax you can avoid!
Whatever shall we do?

 

[TheTexan]

But muh cheap shits!

 

[Leaning Libertarian]

As foreign nations maintain tariffs and subsidies against United States exports it's labeled as "trade imbalance." Trump announces plans to enact reciprocal tariffs and subsidies against such nations to match theirs and it's labeled as "trade war." OK, whatever then... "war it is." I understand traditionally foreign manufacturing jobs and factories won't magically appear overnight inside the USA; moreover, the foreign manufacturers WILL pass the tariff cost onto the consumer. I also understand as a consumer, I have the ultimate decision to purchase or not. Many such items, suddenly overpriced for the market, I will choose not. As much as people may disagree, I feel this hurts me way less than the foreign manufacturer. I don't get a product; however, what grand effect does this have on my livelihood? The manufacturer does not get a sale of their product, directly effecting their livelihood. As far as US "isolationism," with friends like them, who needs enemies? How many millions did North Korea rip off from the USA via unfair trade imbalance? None. The USA doesn't have diplomatic relations with North Korea. How many millions or even billions have "allied" nations siphoned from the USA via trade imbalances?

 

[TheTexan]

As far as US "isolationism," with friends like them, who needs enemies?

The globalists have been running a propaganda war against "isolationism" for a century or more, and the evidence of that can often be seen on these very forums.

But the truth is, there's nothing wrong with isolationism. America became great on the back of American industry. We don't need other countries' low quality shit.

 

[TheTexan]

Up until about the 1970's, American industrialization was in a state of constant improvement. It was increasing in quality, efficiency, volume, and technological ability.

And then we began the transition to cheap labor.

Instead of finding ways to make better products more cheaply, we started using cheap labor overseas.

And industrial improvement basically came to a stop.

We basically lost half a century of industrial progress to this free trade shit.

Totally unnecessary.

America lost decades of economic progress because of this foolishness, and put us in an extremely weak industrial economic position.

And some people here still ask themselves why our economy has seemed to stagnate for many decades now.

This is why.

 

[idiom]

Oh NO! we're replacing a tax you can't avoid with a tax you can avoid!
Whatever shall we do?

Protectionism makes the USA uncompetitive. So if you want the good stuff you have to pay the tax.

You can avoid the income tax by not having a job.

Do you dream up schemes to avoid paying rent or gas taxes?

 

[CaptUSA]

 

[CCTelander]

I know *I* feel liberated now. Don’t you?


ETA: SOON TO BE liberated anyway. Of a great deal more of my personal wealth.

 

[Voluntarist]

Four Senate Republicans join with Democrats to rebuke Trump tariff policy in key vote​

Four Senate Republicans joined with Democrats on Wednesday to deliver a rare bipartisan rebuke to President Donald Trump over trade policy.

The Senate adopted a resolution by a vote of 51 to 48 aimed at blocking the Trump administration’s proposed tariffs on Canadian imports. The four Republicans who voted with Democrats were: Sens. Rand Paul, who cosponsored the resolution, Susan Collins, Mitch McConnell and Lisa Murkowski.

The move amounts to rare bipartisan pushback against Trump in the GOP-led Senate and comes after Trump criticized the measure and urged Republicans to vote against it.

 

[Swordsmyth]

Protectionism makes the USA uncompetitive. So if you want the good stuff you have to pay the tax.

You can avoid the income tax by not having a job.

Do you dream up schemes to avoid paying rent or gas taxes?

I can buy American products, there is no other job I can get and still avoid the income tax.
Free trade has made America uncompetitive.

 

[Swordsmyth]

Four Senate Republicans join with Democrats to rebuke Trump tariff policy in key vote​

Rand votes with globalists who serve foreign interests and against the Average American.

 

[acptulsa]

Rand votes with globalists who serve foreign interests and against the Average American.

Rand votes his conscience and whoever votes with him for whatever reason. Conscience is a strange concept to bots, I know...

Only you would capitalize Average. Keep aspiring; you might rise to that level someday.

 

[Swordsmyth]

Rand votes his conscience and whoever votes with him for whatever reason. Conscience is a strange concept to bots, I know...

Only you would capitalize Average. Keep aspiring; you might rise to that level someday.

Rand is voting his donors on this, he's whining about the stock market and ignoring Main Street.

 

[acptulsa]

Rand is voting his donors on this...

Name them.

 

[TheTexan]

Rand votes with globalists who serve foreign interests and against the Average American.

I can still respect his position. He's wrong, but he's wrong for the right reasons. Libertarianism requires a default position of "no new taxes". To vote otherwise requires both a compelling ethical argument and a compelling economic argument. Tariffs meet both, but getting to that realization is understandably a difficult journey for anyone who values freedom.

 

[CaptUSA]

I know *I* feel liberated now. Don’t you?


ETA: SOON TO BE liberated anyway. Of a great deal more of my personal wealth.

I'm no fan of the tariffs, but I don't think many people looking at these charts would find them unreasonable.

10% across the board (which I think is ok if it offsets income taxes)
And 1/2 what other countries are charging their consumers to buy American goods.

It's the specific industry carve-outs that I find most objectionable.

 

[Brian4Liberty]

Name them.

As a supporter of Rand Paul, I know that he is coming from the "libertarian" angle on this.

But in all honesty, beltway libertarian organizations have always used this as an excuse. US Chamber claims "free trade" is their goal when they are really all about global crony corporatism. Various Koch organizations also get involved. And then Reason and Cato cheer it on.