Rand Paul: Trump is a "Chameleon"

[AuH20]

I think Jefferson would support Rand on both immigration and trade. In fact if anything, it bothers me greatly that Rand panders to people like you on these issues. How is expanding H-1B visas hurting hospitals? Rand believes in basic free market economics.

Rand isn't an economically illiterate socialist like your buddy Trump. Trump thinks Japan is getting the best of us on trade. Japan is the perfect example of the failure of his isolationist trade and immigration policies. Their stock market broke even from 1983 to 2012. They are a decaying stagnant culture devoid of entrepreneurs and risk takers.

James Madison and Thomas Jefferson were both two of the most strident anti-immigration voices in the early days of the nation. They saw the danger of a unrestrained immigration policy that would plant the seeds for potential unrest. Madison even went as far to state the following:

When we are considering the advantages that may result from an easy mode of naturalization, we ought also to consider the cautions necessary to guard against abuse. It is no doubt very desirable that we should hold out as many inducements as possible for the worthy part of mankind to come and settle amongst us, and throw their fortunes into a common lot with ours. But why is this desirable? Not merely to swell the catalogue of people. No, sir, it is to increase the wealth and strength of the community; and those who acquire the rights of citizenship, without adding to the strength or wealth of the community are not the people we are in want of.

James Madison on Rule of Naturalization, 1st Congress, Feb. 3, 1790.

Now regarding H1-B visas, how can you seriously even contemplating bringing them in with such a glut of unemployed (100 million who refuse to work, are incapable or cannot find a job)? What is the upside? Are you seriously telling me that the U.S is deficient in this area? I think it's more about bending the payscale of American workers to their will.

 

[AuH20]

I'm sure there are some Democrats who are against illegal immigration because they believe it drives down wages. As I said, Rand should be the best choice for those people, as he's been a staunch advocate of securing our nation's borders.

See Mickey Kaus.

 

[Brett85]

See Mickey Kaus.

???

 

[AuH20]

???

A democrat who is heavily anti-immigration. Kaus is one of the many old time democrats that has been left behind his globalist party.

 

[Brett85]

A democrat who is heavily anti-immigration. Kaus is one of the many old time democrats that has been left behind his globalist party.

Why would anyone be "anti immigration?" It seems like we've reached the point where it's not even enough to be against illegal immigration, but you have to even be against legal immigration as well.

 

[Ronin Truth]

Donald Trump: Paul is "hard of hearing".

 

[Smitty]

That was epic.

I expect Trump to hire Jesse Benton to be his new campaign advisor any minute, now.

 

[RandallFan]

Attacking Trump during at this point in time is stupid. Attacking Christie was good.

As if every other pundit and candidate has used a similar description of Trump. They all failed.

 

[Krugminator2]

James Madison and Thomas Jefferson were both two of the most strident anti-immigration voices in the early days of the nation. They saw the danger of a unrestrained immigration policy that would plant the seeds for potential unrest. Madison even went as far to state the following:



Now regarding H1-B visas, how can you seriously even contemplating bringing them in with such a glut of unemployed (100 million who refuse to work, are incapable or cannot find a job)? What is the upside? Are you seriously telling me that the U.S is deficient in this area? I think it's more about bending the payscale of American workers to their will.

Rand is hardly an open borders guy. There are no shortage of pro-immigration quotes from Jefferson.

I don't talk in terms of gluts and neither do free market economists. That is a Paul Krugman word. A working immigrant raises the average standard of living. If you want to make the case that immigrants vote Democrat or they wreck the culture or they might displace workers in specific industries, that's fine. What they don't do is lower wages in general or hurt the economy. They help the economy by making it more productive.

 

[AuH20]

Why would anyone be "anti immigration?" It seems like we've reached the point where it's not even enough to be against illegal immigration, but you have to even be against legal immigration as well.

He is a very principled man. Check this out.

http://www.politico.com/blogs/media...daily-caller-after-tucker-carlson-204135.html

The blogger Mickey Kaus has quit his job at The Daily Caller after the conservative site's editor-in-chief, Tucker Carlson, pulled a critical column about Fox News from the site, Kaus told the On Media blog on Tuesday.

"It's pretty simple," Kaus said in an interview, "I wrote a piece attacking Fox for not being the opposition on immigration and amnesty -- for filling up the airwaves with reports on ISIS and terrorism, and not fulfilling their responsibility of being the opposition on amnesty and immigration.... I posted it at 6:30 in the morning. When I got up, Tucker had taken it down. He said, 'We can't trash Fox on the site. I work there.'"

Carlson, who co-founded The Daily Caller in 2010, is a conservative contributor to Fox News and the host of its weekend edition of "Fox & Friends."

Kaus says when he told Carlson he needed to be able to write about Fox, Carlson told him it was a hard-and-fast rule, and non-negotiable.

 

[AuH20]

Rand is hardly an open borders guy. There are no shortage of pro-immigration quotes from Jefferson.

I don't talk in terms of gluts and neither do free market economists. That is a Paul Krugman word. A working immigrant raises the average standard of living. If you want to make the case that immigrants vote Democrat or they wreck the culture or they might displace workers in specific industries, that's fine. What they don't do is lower wages in general or hurt the economy.

You really can't believe that. A 100 years ago? Yes. Today? No. For one, there is a saturation point that you reach in terms of unskilled labor. There are a finite amount of lawns that can be cut and toilets that can be cleaned. Number two, there are significant residual costs that are dispersed throughout the population. A human being in our modern society is not like a robot that returns to it's box after it's work is completed.

 

[r3volution 3.0]

You really can't believe that. A 100 years ago? Yes. Today? No.

The laws of economics have not changed.

 

[dude58677]

Nothing says liberty like overburdened hospitals and corporate welfare. Yea for liberty! Paying for others to breed?!?! Yea for liberty! Even Thomas Jefferson would be laughing at Rand right now. Rand is no antifederalist. He's a fraud if he believes such things.

Maybe you need eye surgery because you just can't see what is wrong with Donald Trump? If you are broke Rand won't charge you.

 

[AuH20]

The laws of economics have not changed.

The regulatory state has banned the law of economics in some instances.

 

[Brett85]

Attacking Trump during at this point in time is stupid. Attacking Christie was good.

As if every other pundit and candidate has used a similar description of Trump. They all failed.

I don't know about that. Trump really crossed the line with what he said about Megyn Kelly. This might be the best time to attack him.

 

[nikcers]

I can't believe there are people especially on this forum who don't think that Donald Trump isn't more like Mitt Romney then Ron Paul. Even Ron Paul said it, so I have to think that they are probably either getting paid to say these things or they never really understood what he was trying to do. Ron Paul was anti establishment, but only in the sense where he wanted to steer the republican mainstream into more constitutional governing not destroy the government, but having less government that follows the constitution. Donald trump is a business man who bankrupts his businesses then blames the market, not his poor business strategies. Who do you think he will blame if he bankrupts the country? He said the lenders are corrupt so they deserve to lose money, do you think china and japan will just say ah shucks if he bankrupts the country?

 

[jj-]

I don't know about that. Trump really crossed the line with what he said about Megyn Kelly.

What? 'blood coming out of her eyes' now crosses a line?

 

[Krugminator2]

You really can't believe that. A 100 years ago? Yes. Today? No. For one, there is a saturation point that you reach in terms of unskilled labor. There are a finite amount of lawns that can be cut and toilets that can be cleaned. Number two, there are significant residual costs that are dispersed throughout the population. A human being in our modern society is not like a robot that returns to it's box after it's work is completed.

http://econlog.econlib.org/archives/2006/04/free_trade_equa_1.html From an actual economist not someone named Pat Buchanan or Donald Trump:

"There is an isomorphism between immigration, outsourcing, and free trade in general. In each case, overall economic efficiency is increased, due to the law of comparative advantage. There are distributional effects, to be sure, but no nation has been able to demonstrate an ability to use trade restrictions of any sort to reduce overall poverty.

Immigration, like all other forms of trade, is positive-sum game. All forms of trade restrictions hurt the economy.

But why let a little economics get in the way of a folk-Marxist story?"

 

[Brian4Liberty]

You really can't believe that. A 100 years ago? Yes. Today? No. For one, there is a saturation point that you reach in terms of unskilled labor. There are a finite amount of lawns that can be cut and toilets that can be cleaned. Number two, there are significant residual costs that are dispersed throughout the population. A human being in our modern society is not like a robot that returns to it's box after it's work is completed.

Come on, don't be so alarmist. There will soon be over 3 billion people in Asia. It won't hurt for a billion or so to move to the US. Nothing will change. Your quality of life will increase. Your TV screen will get bigger and have higher resolution. What else could you ask for? Heating costs decrease when you live in a hive. And that toilet water is perfectly potable after a little filtering.

 

[Brett85]

What? 'blood coming out of her eyes' now crosses a line?

He said "blood coming out of her wherever." It was obvious what he was talking about.