Paul campaign disavows anti-Huntsman ad

His daughters posted it and they probably thought they were being funny. I doubt they ever intended for it to get this far, but it did and now they're in deep deep trouble.
 
thoughtomator said:
His daughters posted it and they probably thought they were being funny. I doubt they ever intended for it to get this far, but it did and now they're in deep deep trouble.
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Do you have iron-clad proof of that? If not, then don't make things worse by making that claim. (without an 'IMO') They already love to call us 'conspiracy theorists' - let's not play into their hands.
 
people, the circle is coming around again on the main points. here we are again.

someone who is very clever with bread and has the bells and whistles can

take an existing account and ghost it. nothing so far is a proof positive.
 
http://aaai.org/AITopics/TuringTest we are inside an information revolution.

there may be a day when the net will not have human hands on a keyboard always.

we also know there are degrees of technological sophistication and adoirtness...
 
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This is crazy.

Mainstream news outlets and a Presidential candidate really got butthurt about a YouTube video?

I've been busy for most of today, so I haven't been keeping up on this. Incredible.
 
lilymc said:
Do you have iron-clad proof of that? If not, then don't make things worse by making that claim. (without an 'IMO') They already love to call us 'conspiracy theorists' - let's not play into their hands.
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They'll say whatever they want regardless of whether it has any relationship to the truth. I've long since stopped caring what disingenuous, interested political opponents might do.
 
Here's one point, not sure if it was brought up before:

If it was made by RP's campaign or a supporter, why is the video still up? If it was a supporter then he'd realise how much damage he'd done and would've taken down the video to try and limit damage. But the video is still there, right? Clearly the owner of this account wants this video to be viewed.

Ah, as cunning as Jon Huntsman's plan was, there are a few flaws in it when you think about it. :)
 
freneticentropy said:
I've only skimmed this thread, but it looks to me like the evidence it was the Huntsman campaign is VERY circumstantial. Also, a lot of people don't know what a 'referer' is on a youtube video. People making blog posts claiming 'proof' that Huntsman orchestrated some conspiracy - (a conspiracy which makes no logistical sense in the first place. Why would he take the risk of being found out? How did he know the ad wouldn't actually be effective? I'm sure there are plenty of primary voters who have feelings like that about China) - had better be damn sure what they are posting is accurate, because if they accuse Huntsman and they're wrong, it's going to look VERY bad.
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Why would Huntsman (or some anti-Paul group) put this out? Simple:
  • First, it makes Ron Paul's supporters look really bad to sane people.
  • Second, it opens Huntsman up to sympathy as the target of a grossly unfair attack.
  • Third, it garners FREE+positive+empathetic media attention for the otherwise irrelevant Huntsman.
  • Fourth, that attention is actually backhandedly/counterintuitively good for Huntsman's campaign, in addition to the sympathy aspect. Huntsman is depicted speaking Chinese, a task the majority of Americans would probably consider very difficult and therefore worthy of respect, he is depicted handling the Chinese adroitly, a trait most Americans would consider very useful, and his adopted Chinese daughters are mentioned, a trait most Americans would consider highly compassionate and laudable.
The video hits all the right notes yet looks rough/amateur on the surface. There's nothing amateur about the way this video was constructed or the effect it engenders. IMO, this video was created by a master propagandist (re: on par with karl rove).

Long story short, unless we're able to uncover the source (and prove it to be a false-flag op), this is only going to help Hunstman with everyone but Ron Paul supporters. So I'd say Mission Accomplished to the scumbag that manufactured this op.

I also think the media is going to use it as the 'reason' for tomorrow's (and/or Sunday's) poll which will show Huntsman "surging from an influx of undecided independents and former Ron Paul supporters".

And last but not least, I posted this early in the thread, but it's worth posting again for those who might have missed it. Pretty much sums up what's going on here:

How Rove has conducted himself while winning campaigns is a subject of no small controversy in political circles. It is frequently said of him, in hushed tones when political folks are doing the talking, that he leaves a trail of damage in his wake—a reference to the substantial number of people who have been hurt, politically and personally, through their encounters with him. Rove's reputation for winning is eclipsed only by his reputation for ruthlessness, and examples abound of his apparent willingness to cross moral and ethical lines.

In the opening pages of Bush's Brain, Wayne Slater describes an encounter with Rove while covering the 2000 campaign for the Dallas Morning News. Slater had written an article for that day's paper detailing Rove's history of dirty tricks, including a 1973 conference he had organized for young Republicans on how to orchestrate them. Rove was furious. "You're trying to ruin me!" Slater recalls him shouting. The anecdote points up one of the paradoxes of Rove's career. Articles like Slater's are surprisingly few, yet as I interviewed people who knew Rove, they brought up examples of unscrupulous tactics—some of them breathtaking—as a matter of course.

A typical instance occurred in the hard-fought 1996 race for a seat on the Alabama Supreme Court between Rove's client, Harold See, then a University of Alabama law professor, and the Democratic incumbent, Kenneth Ingram. According to someone who worked for him, Rove, dissatisfied with the campaign's progress, had flyers printed up—absent any trace of who was behind them—viciously attacking See and his family. "We were trying to craft a message to reach some of the blue-collar, lower-middle-class people," the staffer says. "You'd roll it up, put a rubber band around it, and paperboy it at houses late at night. I was told, 'Do not hand it to anybody, do not tell anybody who you're with, and if you can, borrow a car that doesn't have your tags.' So I borrowed a buddy's car [and drove] down the middle of the street … I had Hefty bags stuffed full of these rolled-up pamphlets, and I'd cruise the designated neighborhoods, throwing these things out with both hands and literally driving with my knees."

The ploy left Rove's opponent at a loss. Ingram's staff realized that it would be fruitless to try to persuade the public that the See campaign was attacking its own candidate in order "to create a backlash against the Democrat," as Joe Perkins, who worked for Ingram, put it to me. Presumably the public would believe that Democrats were spreading terrible rumors about See and his family. "They just beat you down to your knees," Ingram said of being on the receiving end of Rove's attacks. See won the race.
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the possibility of someone else wanting the two campaigns to lit into each other tomorrow is still in my mind
 
The referral from jon2012.com at views=1 looks like the smoking gun to me. My only question is that I can't see this information when I click on the statistics from the YouTube page. It looks like this history is too far back to display. Does anyone know if this record is still publicly accesible?

Otherwise, how can people be assured that the screenshot is real?

And I don't think Ron Paul should personally accuse the Huntsman camp of this, as it puts him directly in the line of fire. It would be ideal if this story makes it big without him having to directly make the charges. Plus, Ron Paul can barely remember what the iPad is called... just imagine him trying to explain this YouTube stuff!
 
FYI - The video in question was embedded by an administrator on the official Jon Huntsman Campaign site on January 4, 2012. The Huntsman site did not receive a tweet about the video until one day later. My question is how/why did the official Huntsman Campaign embed a video on their site one day before Huntsman claims he knew about it?

The other issue for me is even more obvious. If this is an RP supporter as the presttitues claim then why has that supporter not removed the video now that is being used all over the net to smear the guy the media says he supports?
 
Furthermore, why the fuck is a supposed Ron Paul supporter talking about being tough on China, when Ron has voted several times, on a lone vote, not to condemn China for various actions? When Ron wants to lower tariffs and open trade with all countries, China included?
 
nova1248 said:
The referral from jon2012.com at views=1 looks like the smoking gun to me. My only question is that I can't see this information when I click on the statistics from the YouTube page. It looks like this history is too far back to display. Does anyone know if this record is still publicly accesible?
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To the point that the first referral to the video is from jon2012.com. Huntsman campaign spokesperson Tim Miller, "All tweets that tag @JonHuntsman show up on our site. So someone saw it here."
 
airborne373 said:
FYI - The video in question was embedded by an administrator on the official Jon Huntsman Campaign site on January 4, 2012. The Huntsman site did not receive a tweet about the video until one day later. My question is how/why did the official Huntsman Campaign embed a video on their site one day before Huntsman claims he knew about it?

The other issue for me is even more obvious. If this is an RP supporter as the presttitues claim then why has that supporter not removed the video now that is being used all over the net to smear the guy the media says he supports?
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The Twitter account has the first post being Jan 4. (http://twitter.com/#!/NHLiberty4Paul) There is a follow up the next day, but at 10:35 Jan 4, this was sent to Jon Huntsman Twitter which was viewed from a Twitter feed from his website. This is a probable account of what happened. Why a Ron Paul supporter would do that...I don't know.
 
guyjohn59 said:
To the point that the first referral to the video is from jon2012.com. Huntsman campaign spokesperson Tim Miller, "All tweets that tag @JonHuntsman show up on our site. So someone saw it here."
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The problem with Jon Huntsman's spokesman is:

The video was embedded on jon2012 on the 4th of January and the tweet was sent on the 5th. You can view the screen shots at various places on this thread.
 
guyjohn59 said:
The Twitter account has the first post being Jan 4. (http://twitter.com/#!/NHLiberty4Paul) There is a follow up the next day, but at 10:35 Jan 4, this was sent to Jon Huntsman Twitter which was viewed from a Twitter feed from his website. This is a probable account of what happened. Why a Ron Paul supporter would do that...I don't know.
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The link of the tweets you posted say 5 January not 4 January. What am I missing?
 
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