**Official** Trayvon Martin thread

[jmdrake]

Uh, wasn't it just last week that there was a thread about someone getting sentenced to prison for firing a warning shot?

Yeah. She got 20 years. Some of the same folks defending Zimmerman thought it was okay for her to get 20 years for not shooting someone.

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showth...et-20-years-in-prison.&highlight=warning+shot

It's times like this that I'm glad there is a God who will sort all of this mess out in the final judgement.

 

[Danke]

Wow, again beyond stupid remarks. Watching over my neighborhood is now some unjustified pursuit. Tell that to the next cop u meet. I can and have been trained at both weapon retention and drawing then firing while being attacked.

 

[Ender]

Wow, again beyond stupid remarks. Watching over my neighborhood is now some unjustified pursuit. Tell that to the next cop u meet. I can and have been trained at both weapon retention and drawing then firing while being attacked.

That's baloney.

NW is observe and report. Period.

The police were on their way, which can only say that Zimmerman's actions, at the least, were stupid.

Also, finally released today:

Among the documents released was one filed with prosecutors by Sanford police two weeks after the shooting, urging Zimmerman's arrest.

"The encounter between George Zimmerman and Trayvon Martin was ultimately avoidable by Zimmerman, if Zimmerman had remained in his vehicle and awaited the arrival of law enforcement, or conversely if he had identified himself to Martin as a concerned citizen and initiated dialog (sic) in an effort to dispel each party's concern," the police request to arrest Zimmerman said. "There is no indication that Trayvon Martin was involved in any criminal activity."

If the police had been allowed to do their job, there would have been no racial/panthers garbage and most of us would never have heard of Zimmerman or Martin.

 

[jmdrake]

Wow, again beyond stupid remarks. Watching over my neighborhood is now some unjustified pursuit. Tell that to the next cop u meet. I can and have been trained at both weapon retention and drawing then firing while being attacked.

That's nice. Have you been trained in how to pull your weapon from under someone who's sitting on your arms without getting them off you first? Cause that's a really neat trick. I'm not saying that's not possible. Just I can't visualize it. And I think if you're in you've fled to your garage because some deranged man is trying to beat you up, you have a right to go back inside your house and fire a warning shot if you just don't have the stomach to kill him. After all the police and fire warning shots or pock mark a house full of holes with innocent people in there and not get in trouble. But when one woman fired a warning shot she got 20 years. I'm sure her lack of Zimmerman like connections had nothing to do with it. Like I said, I'm glad there is a God.

 

[RickyJ]

Wow, again beyond stupid remarks. Watching over my neighborhood is now some unjustified pursuit. Tell that to the next cop u meet. I can and have been trained at both weapon retention and drawing then firing while being attacked.

He was totally justified, even called the police to let them know about it. Man, would a killer bother calling the police before killing someone? I don't think so! This charge of murder is a joke and will be laughed right out of court.

 

[jmdrake]

He was totally justified, even called the police to let them know about it. Man, would a killer bother calling the police before killing someone? I don't think so! This charge of murder is a joke and will be laughed right out of court.

That he called the police somewhat refutes a first degree murder charge (though if that's the rule then people could always call the police first before murdering someone in order to set up a perfect alibi), but calling the police doesn't prove the shooting was justified. In fact the conversation along with the "we don't need you to do that" comment from the 9/11 operator undermines the justification claim. I agree with you that he was overcharged. Voluntary manslaughter was the right charge under the known facts. That's probably what the lead investigator would have charged Zimmerman with the night of the shooting if not for interference from higher ups.

 

[Ender]

He was totally justified, even called the police to let them know about it. Man, would a killer bother calling the police before killing someone? I don't think so! This charge of murder is a joke and will be laughed right out of court.

As a NW he was only justified in Observing and Reporting; that was his job and nothing more; he was NOT justified in following Martin- the cops were on their way and he knew it.

 

[Zippyjuan]

He was totally justified, even called the police to let them know about it. Man, would a killer bother calling the police before killing someone? I don't think so! This charge of murder is a joke and will be laughed right out of court.

You think Zimmerman was justified? I can't possibly buy that. He watched a kid walk down the street. That is all Zimmerman saw the kid doing. Walking and carrying some snacks. There was no reason to suspect him of having committed any crime whatsoever.

 

[DerailingDaTrain]

This thread is still alive?

Zimmerman could have avoided taking someone's life if he had done something as simple as identifying himself:

"The encounter between George Zimmerman and Trayvon Martin was ultimately avoidable by Zimmerman, if Zimmerman had remained in his vehicle and awaited the arrival of law enforcement, or conversely if he had identified himself to Martin as a concerned citizen and initiated dialog (sic) in an effort to dispel each party's concern," the police request to arrest Zimmerman said. "There is no indication that Trayvon Martin was involved in any criminal activity."

 

[RickyJ]

As a NW he was only justified in Observing and Reporting; that was his job and nothing more; he was NOT justified in following Martin- the cops were on their way and he knew it.

Was it his neighbourhood or not? If he can't take a stroll in his own neighbourhood when he is the neighbourhood watch captain then who can? Citizens have the right to defend their property without any help from the police. A guy walking slowly around in the rain at night off the path in the grass, yeah, they is very suspicious behaviour. I don't blame him one bit for following the guy.

 

[Danke]

What is this garbage. I loved grappling in Judo as a black belt without a firearm. Your legs are very powerful to get someone off of u. I now train to fight in an unexpected attack, retain my weapon and shoot.

 

[Captain Shays]

Yeah. She got 20 years. Some of the same folks defending Zimmerman thought it was okay for her to get 20 years for not shooting someone.

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showth...et-20-years-in-prison.&highlight=warning+shot

It's times like this that I'm glad there is a God who will sort all of this mess out in the final judgement.

Let's hope so. I know I have a lot to answer for but someone is going to answer to deliberate and preducial injustice for sure.

 

[Bruno]

As a NW he was only justified in Observing and Reporting; that was his job and nothing more; he was NOT justified in following Martin- the cops were on their way and he knew it.

Neither was Martin justified in throwing the punch that took Zimmerman to the ground on the way back to his vehicle.

 

[DerailingDaTrain]

Neither was Martin justified in throwing the punch that took Zimmerman to the ground on the way back to his vehicle.

Still going with the sneak attack eh?

 

[Zippyjuan]

Was it his neighbourhood or not? If he can't take a stroll in his own neighbourhood when he is the neighbourhood watch captain then who can? Citizens have the right to defend their property without any help from the police. A guy walking slowly around in the rain at night off the path in the grass, yeah, they is very suspicious behaviour. I don't blame him one bit for following the guy.

It was both of their neighborhoods- both lived in the area.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...tes-struggle/2012/05/17/gIQAxw6HXU_story.html

Martin was walking home to the house where he was staying inside the gated Retreat at Twin Lakes — where Zimmerman also lived — when the incident occurred.

Consider if you were Treyvon. Walking home from the corner store in the rain. You see somebody staring at you and talking on the phone- possibly about you. You stare back. Then you get nervous and take off. He runs after you (as was documented on the 9/11 tape). Would you think that the other guy was acting in self defense?
I guess you are not allowed to take a stroll through your own neighborhood after dark.

Self defense depends on your being threatened. If one person is persuing the other with no cause given, who was the agressor and who was most likely trying to defend themselves? If they are coming towards you in a threatening manner, it is defense. If you are going after them, it is not.

 

[jmdrake]

What is this garbage. I loved grappling in Judo as a black belt without a firearm. Your legs are very powerful to get someone off of u. I now train to fight in an unexpected attack, retain my weapon and shoot.

Danke, you're missing the point. I've put it in bold. Did Zimmerman get Trayvon off of him before shooting him? If yes that undermines his self defense claim. If no then how did he get to his gun? Again, Zimmerman said Trayvon was sitting on his arms. Now with Zimmerman being in pretty good shape and outweighing Trayvon by about 60 lbs, I'm sure Zimmerman could get Trayvon off of him. In fact, that's my point.

 

[Bruno]

Still going with the sneak attack eh?

As opposed to what? What am I missing? True, we don't have the dead young man's story, but we do have documentation of head and face injuries to Zimmerman, reports of seeing him on his back yelling for help with Martin on top of him "punching him MMA-style". What is your assertion?

It was both of their neighborhoods- both lived in the area.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...tes-struggle/2012/05/17/gIQAxw6HXU_story.html


Consider if you were Treyvon. Walking home from the corner store in the rain. You see somebody staring at you and talking on the phone- possibly about you. You stare back. Then you get nervous and take off. He runs after you (as was documented on the 9/11 tape). Would you think that the other guy was acting in self defense?

Staying with your dad for a week because you are suspended from school isn't "living in the neighborhood", imo, but did he have a right to be there? Yes, he was a family guest at the least.

 

[Captain Shays]

This thread is still alive?

Zimmerman could have avoided taking someone's life if he had done something as simple as identifying himself:

It seems you missed one little word in that quote. "IF".

IF Zimmerman stayed in his car. The notion that he didn't go back to his vehicle after the dispatcher told him to is all based upon an assumption and that assumption is usually drawn from a deliberate attempt by the media to sway opinion. The editer from NBC actually got fired for editing the recording of the 911 call.
What of the timeline? When in the course of events did the two men encounter each other and under what circumstances? Who approached who is key to this whole case.
Only if Zimmerman acosted Martin would it be relavant because of the attachment of the stand your ground law and it's implications. If there are no witnesses of the moment the men actually encountered each other Zimmerman walks because it's his story is of the only other person who was there or saw it.

 

[Danke]

That's baloney.

NW is observe and report. Period.

The police were on their way, which can only say that Zimmerman's actions, at the least, were stupid.

Also, finally released today:

Among the documents released was one filed with prosecutors by Sanford police two weeks after the shooting, urging Zimmerman's arrest.

"The encounter between George Zimmerman and Trayvon Martin was ultimately avoidable by Zimmerman, if Zimmerman had remained in his vehicle and awaited the arrival of law enforcement, or conversely if he had identified himself to Martin as a concerned citizen and initiated dialog (sic) in an effort to dispel each party's concern," the police request to arrest Zimmerman said. "There is no indication that Trayvon Martin was involved in any criminal activity."

If the police had been allowed to do their job, there would have been no racial/panthers garbage and most of us would never have heard of Zimmerman or Martin.

I don't want cops or cowards like u in my neighborhood

 

[Captain Shays]

Danke, you're missing the point. I've put it in bold. Did Zimmerman get Trayvon off of him before shooting him? If yes that undermines his self defense claim. If no then how did he get to his gun? Again, Zimmerman said Trayvon was sitting on his arms. Now with Zimmerman being in pretty good shape and outweighing Trayvon by about 60 lbs, I'm sure Zimmerman could get Trayvon off of him. In fact, that's my point.

He could have also temporarily got one arm loose and down to his hip or holster or wherever the gun was on his body. I could see that.