**Official** Trayvon Martin thread

BlackTerrel said:
I have ears man.

You're asking me to ignore what my own ears tell me and take a leap of faith that he was commenting on the weather. What next? Zimmerman actually said "it's partly cloudy with a 70% chance or precipitation".
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My own ears heard it as well- several times. I'd say it's pretty plain.
 
Ender said:
My own ears heard it as well- several times. I'd say it's pretty plain.
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Did you hear the stripped-down, isolated audio recently produced by CNN? Secondly, their producer got fired for selectively editing the 911 call to infer Zimmerman was on a racial crusade to start trouble with Martin.

 
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My favorite comment from youtube. Coons. Of all words to use with all the freedom in the world and he used coons? ROFL. Where is Richard Dawson? The top 5 go-to racial epithet in the heat of passion is (you guessed it) COONS! Please.

Why would any self respecting grown man use a word that was only used like in the 1950's if he wanted say something racial and didn't care who was listening I'm sure he could have though of other clearer words he could have used.
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BlackTerrel said:
Do you really hear cold? Really? That's what your ears say?
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I wasn't there. I can't make out what it says. There are probably a dozen words that could be extracted from that garbled tape. It was raining and barely 60 degrees, hence the hoody. Cold isn't that far of a stretch, especially for someone living near the tropics.
 
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TexanRudeBoy said:
Zimmerman assumed he didn't when he called 9/11 on him, then confronted him.

You can approach me, sure, and I can ignore you because you have no legal right to stop me, detain me, or otherwise interview me. If you don't approach me but follow me suspiciously, then chase me when I understandably fear you, you can expect a confrontation.
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Nobody is suggesting Martin's corpse be charged with a crime. This could indeed have all been one big misunderstanding and both men were perfectly justified in their actions. The question is whether Zimmerman committed a crime, and so far there doesn't seem to be any evidence he did. It's not surprising to hear that Zimmerman has gone in to deep hiding. If I were him, I'd high tail it to Peru until after the Presidential election is over. So long as Obama needs him as a poster boy to stir up racial tensions, his life is in danger over here.
 
AuH20 said:
Did you hear the stripped-down, isolated audio recently produced by CNN? Secondly, their producer got fired for selectively editing the 911 call to infer Zimmerman was on a racial crusade to start trouble with Martin.
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They don't make a big deal about it, but it sounds like "f**king" is preceded by "It's". Interesting.
 
RonPaulMall said:
Nobody is suggesting Martin's corpse be charged with a crime. This could indeed have all been one big misunderstanding and both men were perfectly justified in their actions. The question is whether Zimmerman committed a crime, and so far there doesn't seem to be any evidence he did. It's not surprising to hear that Zimmerman has gone in to deep hiding. If I were him, I'd high tail it to Peru until after the Presidential election is over. So long as Obama needs him as a poster boy to stir up racial tensions, his life is in danger over here.
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I didn't insinuate anyone suggested Martin be charged with anything...

If you illegally confront someone, resulting in a physical altercation to which you then must use lethal force to "defend" yourself from, then yes you have committed a crime. You aren't defending yourself if you initiated the altercation. So there certainly is indication he could have committed a crime. Obviously there's gray area from the lack of details, but this is my view of it.

Its like if someone broke into a house, got into a fight with the homeowner and shot them fearing for their life. One could argue they acted in self defense, but realistically they only needed to defend themselves because they violated someone else's rights to begin with.
 
TexanRudeBoy said:
I didn't insinuate anyone suggested Martin be charged with anything...

If you illegally confront someone, resulting in a physical altercation to which you then must use lethal force to "defend" yourself from, then yes you have committed a crime. You aren't defending yourself if you initiated the altercation. So there certainly is indication he could have committed a crime. Obviously there's gray area from the lack of details, but this is my view of it.

Its like if someone broke into a house, got into a fight with the homeowner and shot them fearing for their life. One could argue they acted in self defense, but realistically they only needed to defend themselves because they violated someone else's rights to begin with.
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This X10

The only one standing his ground that night was Trevon Martin, and he was killed while standing his ground. A man with a gun is following him, stalking him, and Trevon stood his ground and was murdered. Unreal.
 
Gary4Liberty said:
This X10

The only one standing his ground that night was Trevon Martin, and he was killed while standing his ground. A man with a gun is following him, stalking him, and Trevon stood his ground and was murdered. Unreal.
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Who cares if he had a gun? I have shoelaces that I could strangle you with.

If Zimmerman had brandished the weapon, then it would be a different story and I'd totally concur with your conclusion. However, on the periphery, this whole angle of stalking with a lethal weapon strikes me as hyperbole. I'm sure George Zimmerman got out of bed that morning and was determined to kill "darky" under some obscure loophole in Florida's Stand Your Ground Law, all the while escaping trial. That was the devious plan and he executed it flawlessly, with the exception of the numerous death threats and roaming mobs. :)
 
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TexanRudeBoy said:
If you illegally confront someone, resulting in a physical altercation to which you then must use lethal force to "defend" yourself from, then yes you have committed a crime. You aren't defending yourself if you initiated the altercation. So there certainly is indication he could have committed a crime. Obviously there's gray area from the lack of details, but this is my view of it.
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But that's exactly the point. There is no evidence he illegally confronted someone, nor is there any evidence he committed a crime. Obviously it is possible he committed a crime. Maybe he is lying about what happened and when he and Martin came face to face he's the one who initiated a fight. Nobody is denying it is possible a crime may have been committed. That's what an investigation is for. But as of now, there is evidence that we know of to support such a theory. The Race Hustlers want to turn the justice system on its head. They an arrest before finding probable cause. That's what makes this a "libertarian" issue.
 
RonPaulMall said:
But that's exactly the point. There is no evidence he illegally confronted someone, nor is there any evidence he committed a crime. Obviously it is possible he committed a crime. Maybe he is lying about what happened and when he and Martin came face to face he's the one who initiated a fight. Nobody is denying it is possible a crime may have been committed. That's what an investigation is for. But as of now, there is evidence that we know of to support such a theory. The Race Hustlers want to turn the justice system on its head. They an arrest before finding probable cause. That's what makes this a "libertarian" issue.
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First off, I couldn't care less about what the "Race Hustlers" want to do to anything. I'm talking about how this pertains to the central libertarian principle of non-aggression.

The only facts we have are that Zimmerman saw someone who in his mind looked suspicious. He called 9/11 while following him, but the conversation ended. A confrontation ensued, resulting in Zimmerman shooting Martin after a fist fight.

What you aren't understanding is that Zimmerman created the situation by following him and confronting him period, regardless of who initiated the actual physical conflict. Martin had every right to be where he was, doing what he was doing. Zimmerman had no right to confront him in any way. Him being some random stranger, if he was following me I would most certainly view it as an act of aggression and be prepared to defend myself, with violence if necessary.

In our society we have agreed that we will allow officers of the law to detain or question those who are under reasonable suspicion to have committed a crime(I don't want to get into a discussion about the merit of this, but this is the way it is). Anyone else who wants to stop me and ask me who I am, what I'm doing, where I'm going, etc can fuck off, provided I'm not on their private property.
 
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TexanRudeBoy said:
First off, I couldn't care less about what the "Race Hustlers" want to do to anything. I'm talking about how this pertains to the central libertarian principle of non-aggression.

The only facts we have are that Zimmerman saw someone who in his mind looked suspicious. He called 9/11 while following him, but the conversation ended. A confrontation ensued, resulting in Zimmerman shooting Martin after a fist fight.

What you aren't understanding is that Zimmerman created the situation by following him and confronting him period, regardless of who initiated the actual physical conflict. Martin had every right to be where he was, doing what he was doing. Zimmerman had no right to confront him in any way. Him being some random stranger, if he was following me I would most certainly view it as an act of aggression and be prepared to defend myself, with violence if necessary.

In our society we have agreed that we will allow officers of the law to detain or question those who are under reasonable suspicion to have committed a crime(I don't want to get into a discussion about the merit of this, but this is the way it is). Anyone else who wants to stop me and ask me who I am, what I'm doing, where I'm going, etc can fuck off, provided I'm not on their private property.
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Regardless of whatever you believe the facts are of the case, we have every right to police our own neighborhood. People like you want to change this country so we cannot approach our neighbors for a discussion or people passing through the neighborhood.

What, only your beloved government can do that? What if I just wanted to talk to a neighbor to say hello, but they get spooked because this new America you want to create we cannot do that and deserve to be attacked.

I have been living in my neighborhood for much longer than a new neighbor that decided he was neighborhood watch, followed me and questioned me. I was not happy about it but that does not give me the right to beat him and if I did he would have every right to defend himself.

This is really depressing seeing more posts in this liberty forum that we can no longer speak to people in our neighborhood and if we do we have committed a crime and they allowed to attack us. People in a Ron Paul forum basically cheer leading complete submission to government.
 
BamaAla said:
Regardless of the facts, the dude is going to fry. That prosecutor is going to make her career, guns and self defense laws will be on trial as well, and the blacks will be pacified. Get ready for some justice!
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But no charges for first degree murder anticipated. They have no case for that type of leap. He's going to probably get manslaughter and I suspect he may deserve it based on the evidence and witness testimony.

http://www.examiner.com/newport-news-conservative-in-norfolk/source-zimmerman-will-not-be-charged
 
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