Obama's Birth Certificate - Still Missing

Uh no, its not. The burden of proof does not change depending whether criminal or civil. That difference is the AMOUNT of proof, not the burden of proof. When you sue someone it is your job to prove "by a preponderance of evidence" that the person is guilty. The burden of proof is on you. When someone is charged with a crime it is the state's job to prove "beyond a shadow of a doubt" that the crime was committed. The burden of proof is on the state. In other words, the burden of proof does not change, it is always on the accuser, only the amount of proof changes.

So having cleared that up, please demonstrate how the accuser has proved by a preponderance of evidence (meaning more likely than not) that Obama is not a US citizen?

So if someone applies for a job, the employer cannot ask for proof of citizenship because the burden of proof is on the employer to present evidence of non-citizenship?

Obama is applying for an elected position with the federal government of the United States. The founders of the nation (we, the people) have no right to ask for proof of qualifications for the position requested?
 
In defense of the Natural Born Citizen clause of the U.S. Constitution, and in the wake of last Friday's decision by a federal judge in Berg v Obama, we feel compelled to run a full-page ad in USA TODAY. Click here for a copy of the ad we intend to run if we are able to raise the money.








An Open Letter to Barack Obama:

Are you a Natural Born Citizen of the U.S.?

Are you legally qualified to hold the Office of President?
[FONT=&quot]
Dear Mr. Obama:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]On October 24, 2008, a federal judge granted your request to dismiss a lawsuit by Citizen Philip Berg, who challenged your qualifications under the “Natural Born Citizen” clause of the U.S. Constitution to legally hold the office of President of the United States of America. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Mr. Berg presented factual evidence to the Court in support of his claim that you are either a citizen of your father’s native Kenya by birth, or that you became a citizen of Indonesia, relinquishing your prior citizenship when you moved there with your mother in 1967. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]In your response to the lawsuit, you neither denied Mr. Berg’s claims nor submitted any evidence which would refute his assertions. Instead, you argued that the Court lacked the jurisdiction to determine the question of your legal eligibility because Mr. Berg lacked “standing.” [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] Astonishingly, the judge agreed, simply saying, “[Mr. Berg] would have us derail the democratic process by invalidating a candidate for whom millions of people voted and underwent excessive vetting during what was one of the most hotly contested presidential primary [sic] in living memory.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] Unfortunately, your response to the legal claim was clearly evasive and strikingly out of character, suggesting you may, in fact, lack a critical Constitutional qualification necessary to assume the Office of President: i.e., that you are not a “natural born” citizen of the United States or one who has relinquished his American citizenship. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] Before you can exercise any of the powers of the United States, you must prove that you have fully satisfied each and every eligibility requirement that the Constitution mandates for any individual’s exercise of those powers. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] Regardless of the tactics chosen in defending yourself against the Berg lawsuit, significant questions regarding your legal capacity to hold this nation’s highest office have been put forth publicly, and you have failed to directly refute them with documentary evidence that is routinely available to any bona fide, natural born U.S. Citizen.

As one who has ventured into the fray of public service of his own volition, seeking to possess the vast powers of the Office of President, it is not unreasonable to demand that you produce evidence of your citizenship to answer the questions and allay the concerns of the People. Indeed, as the one seeking the office, you are under a moral, legal, and fiduciary duty to proffer such evidence to establish your qualifications as explicitly mandated by Article II of the Constitution. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] Should you proceed to assume the office of the President of the United States as anything but a bona fide natural born citizen of the United States that has not relinquished that citizenship, you would be inviting a national disaster, placing our Republic at great risk from untold consequences. For example:[/FONT]
·[FONT=&quot] [/FONT] [FONT=&quot] Neither the Electoral College on December 15, nor the House of Representatives on January 6 would be able to elect you, except as a poseur - a usurper; [/FONT]
·[FONT=&quot] [/FONT] [FONT=&quot]As a usurper, you would be unable to take the required “Oath or Affirmation” of office on January 20 without committing the crime of perjury or false swearing, for being ineligible for the Office of the President you cannot faithfully execute the Office of the President of the United States; [/FONT]
·[FONT=&quot] [/FONT] [FONT=&quot]Your every act in the usurped Office of the President would be a criminal offense as an act under color of law that would subject the People to the deprivation of their constitutional rights, and entitling you to no obedience whatsoever from the People; [/FONT]
·[FONT=&quot] [/FONT] [FONT=&quot]as a usurper acting in the guise of the President you could not function as the Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy and of the militia of the several states, as such forces would be under no legal obligation to remain obedient to you; [/FONT]
·[FONT=&quot] [/FONT] [FONT=&quot]No one in any civilian agency in the Executive Branch would be required to obey any of your proclamations, executive orders or directives, as such orders would be legally VOID; [/FONT]
·[FONT=&quot] [/FONT] [FONT=&quot]Your appointment of Ambassadors and Judges to the Supreme Court would be VOID ab initio (i.e., from the beginning), no matter what subsequent actions the Senate might take as well as rendering any such acts by such appointed officials void as well; [/FONT]
·[FONT=&quot] [/FONT] [FONT=&quot] Congress would not be able to pass any new laws because they would not be able to acquire the signature of a bona fide President, rendering all such legislation legally VOID; [/FONT]
·[FONT=&quot] [/FONT] [FONT=&quot]As a usurper, Congress would be unable to remove you from the Office of the President on Impeachment, inviting certain political chaos including a potential for armed conflicts within the General Government or among the States and the People to effect the removal of such a usurper. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]As an attorney and sitting U.S. Senator, I’m sure you agree that our Constitution is the cornerstone of our system of governance. It is the very foundation of our system of Law and Order – indeed, it is the supreme law of the land. I’m sure you also agree that its precise language was no accident and cannot be ignored if Individual, unalienable, natural Rights, Freedoms and Liberties are to be protected and preserved.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]As our next potential President, you have a high-order obligation to the Constitution (and to those who have fought and died for our Freedom) that extends far beyond that of securing a majority of the votes of the Electoral College. No matter your promises of change and prosperity, your heartfelt intent or the widespread support you have garnered in seeking the highest Office of the Land, the integrity of the Republic and Rule of Law cannot, -- must not -- be put at risk, by allowing a constitutionally unqualified person to sit, as a usurper, in the Office of the President. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]No matter the level of practical difficulty, embarrassment or disruption of the nation’s business, we must -- above all -- honor and protect the Constitution and the divine, unalienable, Individual Rights it guarantees, including the Right to a President who is a natural born citizen of the United States of America that has not relinquished his American citizenship. Our nation has endured similar disruptions in the past, and will weather this crisis as well. Indeed, it is both yours and the People’s mutual respect for, and commitment to, the Constitution and Rule of Law that insures the perpetuation of Liberty. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]As a long time defender of my state and federal Constitutions, and in consideration of the lack of sufficient evidence needed to establish your credentials as President, I am compelled to lodge this Petition for Redress of Grievances and public challenge to you.

Make no mistake: This issue IS a Constitutional crisis. Although it will not be easy for you, your family or our Republic, you have it within your ability to halt this escalating crisis by either producing the certified documents establishing beyond question your qualifications to hold the Office of President, or by immediately withdrawing yourself from the Electoral College process. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]With due respect, I hereby request that you deliver the following documents to Mr. Berg and myself at the National Press Club in Washington, DC at noon on Monday, November 17, 2008:

(a) a certified copy of your “vault” (original long version) birth certificate;
(b) certified copies of all reissued and sealed birth certificates in the names [/FONT] [FONT=&quot]
Barack Hussein Obama[/FONT][FONT=&quot], [/FONT] [FONT=&quot]Barry Soetoro, Barry Obama, [/FONT] [FONT=&quot] [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Barack Dunham[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
and [/FONT] [FONT=&quot] Barry Dunham[/FONT][FONT=&quot];
(c) a certified copy of your Certification of Citizenship;
(d) a certified copy of your Oath of Allegiance taken upon age of maturity;
(e) certified copies of your admission forms for Occidental College, Columbia
University and Harvard Law School; and
(f) certified copies of any court orders or legal documents changing your name
from Barry Soetoro. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]In the alternative[/FONT][FONT=&quot], in defense of the Constitution, and in honor of the Republic and that for which it stands, please announce before such time your withdrawal from the 2008 Presidential election process.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]“In a government of laws, the existence of the government will be imperiled if it fails to observe the law scrupulously. Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a lawbreaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy.”
[/FONT]
Olmstead v. United States, 277 U.S. 438, 469-471.
[FONT=&quot] Thank you for your understanding and cooperation in this matter.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] Sincerely,
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] Robert L. Schulz,
Founder and Chairman, We The People Foundation for Constitutional Education, Inc. [/FONT]
 
So if someone applies for a job, the employer cannot ask for proof of citizenship because the burden of proof is on the employer to present evidence of non-citizenship?

Obama is applying for an elected position with the federal government of the United States. The founders of the nation (we, the people) have no right to ask for proof of qualifications for the position requested?

This lawyer would disagree:
http://www.karapetianlaw.com/CM/Cus...ludes/XSL/PortalPack/faq-single-questions.xsl

Most employers believe that their liability extends only to employment of an unauthorized alien. The INA does provide sanctions for knowingly hiring and retaining unauthorized noncitizens, but it is also illegal to hire anyone without performing employment verification procedures for each new worker. Every new hire, even if he or she claims U.S. citizenship, must produce proof of employable status for the employer's inspection. The employer must complete the federal Employment Eligibility Form, or I-9, which certifies that the employer did view the new employee's documentation. Employers may be liable for acceptance of illegal documentation in some instances. The employer should retain in original form or on microfiche completed I-9s. Employers may face sanctions for not completing this form whether or not any of their employees are unauthorized aliens.
 
oh, Harry Truman, they're passing the buck!

You are right about the burden of proof...OJ is a good example. He was found in his civil suit to have "been more likely than not to have caused the deaths of his wife and her boyfriend." Thus he was forced to compensate the families for the loss.

Having read the case, Berg vs. Obama/DNC, I believe there to be compelling evidence that Obama is NOT a U.S. citizen, and that he should produce such documentation that either proves or disproves Berg's alligations.

The judge dismissed it because, IMHO, he didn't have the balls to find in Berg's favor. I mean look at the gravity of the case...would you want to be the judge who removes the Messiah from the ballots?


devil21, nodope0695 answered your question to me just about right so I won't address that, I'll go to more important things... on nodope's comments.

about the judge's ruling, these lower level judges typically claim jurisdiction or standing issues to duck an issue and pass the buck, from my understanding. (note: I'm obviously not an attorney)

part of the proof, according to Mr. Berg, is that he has an affidavit from Obama's grandmother that he was born in Kenya and she witnessed the birth. enough to bring a question if the affidavit or tape truly exists.

lynn
 
saturation overcomes

The Obamacrimes site is down...I've been using this to access it, and while it worked earlier today, as of now it's not. http://www.obamacrimes.com/ Makes one wonder...


could just be the huge traffic the site is getting, or maybe a denial of service attack.

Alex Jones has to keep multiple sites up because of the number of internet attacks sustained in the past. expensive but effective.

lynn
 
Counting down....5,4,3,2,1....until a moon bat claims "it's still not real....this is just a vast conspiracy from TBTB" LOL
 
http://contrariancommentary.blogspot.com/

Saturday, November 01, 2008

State of Hawai'i backs Andy Martin in Obama birth certificate battle

Andy Martin lobs a grenade into the final weekend of the presidential campaign; the relentless Chicago corruption fighter exposes Barack Obama and mainstream media as liars.

State of Hawai'i backs Andy Martin in Obama birth certificate battle
CNN, Factcheck.org and Obama campaign exposed as liars
"Internet Powerhouse" Andy Martin drops a grenade in the final weekend of the presidential campaign
ANDY MARTIN
Executive Editor
ContrarianCommentary.com

“Factually Correct, Not
Politically Correct”

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE:

ATTENTION DAYBOOK/ASSIGNMENT EDITORS

ANNOUNCEMENT OF SATURDAY NEWS CONFERENCE IN CHICAGO

Internet powerhouse Andy Martin wins a major victory in Hawai'i as state officials examine and confirm the existence of Barack Obama's secret birth certificate

CNN and Factcheck.org are embarrassed; Martin demands retractions and apologies for their misleading reports

Andy vows to keep up the battle whatever happens on November 4th; a court hearing is scheduled in Honolulu for November 18th and Andy says, "I'll be there."

Martin's birth certificate litigation victory will roil the final weekend of the presidential campaign; the Internet Powerhouse is set to hold a Saturday news conference in Chicago and disclose new attacks on Obama

Martin issues challenge to Barack Obama: Stop lying to the American people and immediately authorize the release of your original, typewritten 1961 birth certificate

Internet warrior Martin returns home to Chicago on Saturday after one month of "combat patrols" fighting the "Obama Gang"

"Barack Obama has been lying to the American people," Andy says

Fox News faces lawsuit for sliming its source


(HONOLULU)(November 1, 2008) Internet powerhouse Andy Martin has ignited a firestorm in Hawai'i over Barack Obama's bogus "original" birth certificate. Martin won a stunning victory Friday afternoon (October 31st) when the State of Hawai'i backed his assertion that there was an original, "typewritten, 1961" birth certificate, called a "Certificate of Live Birth" or "COLB" in Hawai'i, that no one has previously seen. Hawai'i officials retrieved and examined the document after Martin filed a lawsuit seeking access to the historic 1961 original.

Obama has falsely claimed to have placed the "original" on the Internet. Factcheck.org has falsely claimed to have seen this document and posted it on the Internet; that is not true. CNN has falsely ridiculed Martin.

Hawai'i officials have now refuted Obama's false assertion.

Martin's victory in Honolulu will roil the final weekend of the presidential campaign. Internet chatter is expected to explode as the issue moves to the front page over Saturday and Sunday. Swing voters may be swayed by the exposure that Obama has brazenly been lying to the American people. "We just lobbed a grenade into the final weekend of the presidential campaign," says Andy.

"I am ecstatic. I called Obama a liar. I called Factcheck.org 'ObamaLies.org.' I said CNN was sloppy and lazy and wrong. And I was right. The State of Hawai'i has now backed me up. Whew. I knew I was right, but I feel a lot more comfortable knowing that I have started to get the machinery moving in state government. The original document is now obviously protected and safe from any tampering by Obama.

"My lawsuit started a firestorm in Hawai'i. The circuit judge has set a hearing for November 18th (a report in the Honolulu Advertiser for November 1st for an earlier hearing date of November 7th is inaccurate; that date was cancelled).

"CNN also has egg on its face, because, once again, Hawai'i backs my contention that the original document has never surfaced in public. CNN tried to demean me by contradicting my accurate claim.

"Now Obama, Factcheck.org and CNN have been exposed as liars. I said there was a 'secret,' original, typewritten birth certificate that had never been disclosed, and that document was the original COLB, not the phony 'original' that CNN placed before its viewers.

"Why would Hawai'i officials review the vault document at the Eleventh Hour if my lawsuit wasn't causing a furor in Hawai'i state government? Why? The Friday before the election?

"Mine is the only logical, rational, properly prepared lawsuit that has been filed to open Obama's secret records. I sued in the proper state in the proper court against the proper officials for the proper remedy. And they are responding properly. The judge has properly, although not as quickly as I would have preferred, set a hearing to consider my claims. I have not filed outrageous or exaggerated pleadings.

"I merely sought access to a document based on its scholarly and news value and because I had been tipped by my sources inside state government that Obama was lying. My network of informants within state government helps me and guides me. Others filed lawsuits outside Hawai'i that have either been dismissed or discredited. My 'little engine that could' is chugging along.

"I have an outstanding record of high-profile public interest litigation, as recognized by the Pennsylvania Supreme Court five years ago when they allowed me to represent a U. S. Marine in a landmark lawsuit." See www.AndyMartin.com and www.FirstRespondersOnline.us

In a Honolulu news conference on October 22nd Martin disclosed that Frank Marshall Davis was the biological father of Barack Obama, not Barack Obama senior. The Obama campaign has not denied Martin's claim.

"Over the past month I have been on combat patrol from coast to coast for the truth and for the United States Constitution," says Andy. "I have not the slightest link to John McCain. I am connected to the Constitution and nothing else. I have waged relentless war against Barack Obama's lies. And on the eve of the final weekend in the presidential campaign Hawai'i government has backed me by confirming that officials have examined the original, typewritten 1961 document, and confirmed that the document released by the Obama campaign was a facsimile, not the original.

"I have won a major victory: I proved Obama was lying about what he had posed on the Internet and falsely portrayed as 'the original.' 'Barry, we caught you with your pants down. We caught you lying, again.

"Saturday it will be my pleasure to return home to Chicago after one of the most successful independent political battle operations in media history, to wage the final weekend of war for the truth and Constitution and against the Daley Machine and Obama Gang. I have successfully been exposing and fighting Daley Family corruption for over forty years. Barry Obama is part of the second generation Daley Machine. He is a member in good standing of this criminal operation.

"The Machine doesn’t like me. But I have a history of coming up with the truth, and a history of embarrassing powerful people. In retaliation, they try to smear me. The disclosure that Hawai'i officials have examined the true original COLB, and that Obama lied to the American people by falsely claiming he had posted the original 1961 document, is going to spread like wildfire between Saturday and Tuesday night.

"This election is bizarre because the presidential candidate of the Democratic Party, the Party's leader, is from the Daley Machine in Chicago. And the leader of the Internet Army opposing Obama and working to defeat him and the Daley Machine is also from Chicago. My Senator would be proud.

Martin is expected to announce Saturday that he is suing Fox News as well as the New York Times, for defamation of character. The lawsuit will be released Monday morning.

"For Fox News to treat me as they did is beneath contempt," says Martin. "I am respected around the world for accuracy, honesty and integrity. We know the New York Times is a corrupt media operation. But Fox News? Well, Ruppert Murdock may want to kow'tow to Barack Obama, but I will not kow'tow to Ruppert Murdock. The crass executives deserve to be sued for their malicious attacks on me. Someone ought to stand up for me: I helped expose Bill Ayers and Khalid Al-Mansour. A slimy 'vice president' that probably never worked a case or a story had the nerve to demean me. What a compete corporate moron.

"How dare these media imposters and blowhards smear me with lies, when I have worked tirelessly to expose the truth about Barack Obama—and succeeded," Martin will charge.
http://www.youtube.com/v/RgjQhnDEGSk

"I'll be happy to face the Fox jerk, Vice President Bill Shine, in court and defend my good name against Obama's mud merchants, the New York Times and Ruppert Murdock. Ruppert Murdock's daughter is backing Obama, for Chrissake.

"I also plan Saturday to thank Dr. Chiyome Fukino for confirming my factual allegation that there was/is an original, typewritten 1961 'vault' COLB that has not been made public and that the true 'original' COLB is in official files. That confirmation makes Barack Obama a liar, on the last weekend of the campaign. Thank you, doctor.

"Now you know why Obama and Axelrod and Gibbs call me the 'Internet Powerhouse' that can’t be stopped. Barack Obama will be bleeding through election night because of this massive lie exposed on the eve of their election. I work for the American people, not John McCain or the Republican Party. Friday, truth arrived in Honolulu, and in the remaining 100 hours that truth is going to be spread from coast-to-coast.

"Obama lied."

Martin lands in Chicago at noon, and will proceed to his office, for an afternoon news conference.

Martin is also soliciting financial support to fund his litigation in Hawai'i.

NEWS CONFERENCE DETAILS:

WHO:

Internet Powerhouse and national anti-Obama leader, Author/Editor/Internet Columnist Andy Martin

WHAT:

National anti-Obama leader Andy Martin thanks Hawai'i officials for confirming his claims and exposing Barack Obama as a liar and lays out his battle plan for the final 72 hours of the presidential campaign.

WHERE:

Southeast corner of Huron and Wabash Streets, Chicago

WHEN: Saturday, November 1, 3:00 P. M.

MEDIA CONTACT: (866) 706-2639; CELL (917) 664-9329
 



header_wnd.gif
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]ELECTION 2008[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Palatino, Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif][SIZE=+2]Obama's aunt living in U.S. illegally[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Palatino, Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif][SIZE=+1]56-year-old residing in Boston slum ignored judge's order 4 years ago[/SIZE][/FONT]
[SIZE=-1]Posted: November 01, 2008
3:40 am Eastern

[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1] © 2008 WorldNetDaily [/SIZE]
onyango200.jpg

[COLOR=blue ! important][COLOR=blue ! important]Obama's[/COLOR][/COLOR] aunt Zeituni Onyango
Barack Obama's aunt, revealed this week to be dwelling in a Boston slum, is living in the United States illegally, refusing to leave the U.S. for her Kenyan homeland when a judge rejected her request for asylum four years ago, the Associated Press is reporting.

A person familiar with the case told AP that 56-year-old Zeituni Onyango was told to leave America by a U.S. [COLOR=blue ! important][FONT=&quot][COLOR=blue ! important][FONT=&quot]immigration[/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR][/COLOR] judge in 2004.

Two separate sources, one of them a federal law enforcement official, disclosed and confirmed information about the deportation case.

Speaking to a reporter with the London Times, outside her home, Zeituni Onyango, 56, confirmed she was indeed the "Auntie Zeituni" so affectionately described in Obama's best-selling memoir, "Dreams From My Father."

In the memoir, Obama wrote: "If Jane or Zeituni ever felt ill, if their companies ever closed or laid them off, there was no government safety net. There was only family, next of kin, people burdened by similar hardship. Now I was family, I reminded myself. Now I had responsibilities."

Onyango declined to answer most other questions about her relationship with the [COLOR=blue ! important][FONT=&quot][COLOR=blue ! important][FONT=&quot]presidential[/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR][/COLOR] contender until after the Nov. 4 election.

"I can't talk about it, I just pray for him, that's all," she told the Times, adding: "After the 4th, I can talk to anyone."

Obama campaign spokesman Reid Cherlin confirmed to the Boston Herald yesterday that Onyango, who lives on Flaherty Way in South Boston, is Obama's aunt on his father's side.

The AP could not reach Onyango immediately for comment. It was unclear why her request for asylum was rejected in 2004.

It was not immediately clear how Onyango might have qualified for public housing with a standing deportation order.
(Story continues below)





Boston Housing Authority spokesman Bill McGonagle told the Herald she received a small stipend over the past year for working six hours a week as a volunteer resident health advocate in her complex.

"Auntie Zeituni" recently made a $260 [COLOR=blue ! important][FONT=&quot][COLOR=blue ! important][FONT=&quot]campaign [/FONT][COLOR=blue ! important][FONT=&quot]contribution[/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/COLOR]
to her nephew's presidential bid from a work address in the city. She proudly displays photos of Obama, including some that appear as old as 25 years, inside her first-floor apartment, McGonagle said.

A message left at Onyango's apartment was not returned.

McGonagle asked that the media respect Onyango's privacy.

"She is feeling very put upon," he said.




http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=79743
 
i guess I don't understand what difference it makes if Hawaii has either a birth certificate or a certificate of live birth.(nor do I care whether whether they are separate things or the same thing) He lost whatever citizenship he had by attending school, which the act of doing required he be that country's citizen at the time.
So, aside from the forgery and bs, what's the point?
 
And still, for some reason, Obama is exempt from producing proof of eligibility for employment and some people are okay with that. It's a crazy world.

Look, the only people concerned about this are people pulling for McCain now, hoping and praying for some "divine intervention" (probably literally) to keep Obama from winning. OK so Berg presented an affidavit supposedly from Obama's grandmother. That sure makes a compelling case to stop a presidential election. :rolleyes: That's suspect unto itself. Why would Obama's own grandma want to kill his campaign? It just doesn't pass the smell test. And considering all the garbage trotted out by McCainiacs against Obama this election, is it any wonder that people like me will just roll my eyes at this "issue"? How many B-girl type episodes can we really pursue? I wonder how many of you that are pursuing this citizenship issue also thought the B-girl incident was truthful at first. I called bullshit on that off the top (and was right) and Im doing the same on this.

Call me a cynic and a doubter if you will but this reeks of desperation and it's just par for the course considering how McCain's campaign and supporters have acted. Let's throw this turd at the wall to see if it sticks. Funny how no one ever questioned Obama's citizenship until he was about to win the Presidency. You'd think that maybe McCain's campaign would have been pursuing it out in the open if it's really a serious issue...or maybe whoever Obama beat for his state AND US Senate seats would have pursued it. But no, not a peep. Hammer the guy for his politics all you like but this just doesn't pass the smell test.
 
i guess I don't understand what difference it makes if Hawaii has either a birth certificate or a certificate of live birth.(nor do I care whether whether they are separate things or the same thing) He lost whatever citizenship he had by attending school, which the act of doing required he be that country's citizen at the time.
So, aside from the forgery and bs, what's the point?

I don't know how he lost his citizenship when attending school. Could you elaborate? I don't doubt you, I just don't read every single story about this subject. :confused:
 
look, the only people concerned about this are people pulling for mccain now, hoping and praying for some "divine intervention" (probably literally) to keep obama from winning. Ok so berg presented an affidavit supposedly from obama's grandmother. That sure makes a compelling case to stop a presidential election. :rolleyes: That's suspect unto itself. Why would obama's own grandma want to kill his campaign? It just doesn't pass the smell test. And considering all the garbage trotted out by mccainiacs against obama this election, is it any wonder that people like me will just roll my eyes at this "issue"? How many b-girl type episodes can we really pursue? I wonder how many of you that are pursuing this citizenship issue also thought the b-girl incident was truthful at first. I called bullshit on that off the top (and was right) and im doing the same on this.

Call me a cynic and a doubter if you will but this reeks of desperation and it's just par for the course considering how mccain's campaign and supporters have acted. Let's throw this turd at the wall to see if it sticks. Funny how no one ever questioned obama's citizenship until he was about to win the presidency. You'd think that maybe mccain's campaign would have been pursuing it out in the open if it's really a serious issue...or maybe whoever obama beat for his state and us senate seats would have pursued it. But no, not a peep. Hammer the guy for his politics all you like but this just doesn't pass the smell test.

qft
 
citizen Kane? nope - citizen Obama

I don't know how he lost his citizenship when attending school. Could you elaborate? I don't doubt you, I just don't read every single story about this subject. :confused:


supposedly, he attended school in Indonesia and they only let citizens of Indonesia attend school, so Barry's new father would have had to adopt him to let that happen and Barry becomes an Indonesian citizen. also, supposedly, Barry went to Pakistan on an Indonesian passport in his late teens or early 20's.

lynn
 
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