My feelings on this race
- Thread starter pinkmandy
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pacelli
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The general election is the time to vote against the other party. The primary is the time to vote your heart.
scandinaviany3
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Romney has no chance of winning given his record of taking over companies and his firms and 1000's of job losses they forced because of reorganization and other "business and investor" decisions
You cant possible paint a bigger target on yourself in a year where the economy, home loss, etc. was pushed on a lot of people because of this very action.
He is a VERY DEAD candidate. Republican's dont bring up these issues...but Democrats will have this ad ready to run and drop the bomb when its most needed...
Walla hillary or most likely obama....victory...choose Romney
mccain has no chance let him try. He is the easiest for ron to take down.
Romney is much harder within the party.
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Only if you're loyal to a party and not ideals imo and anytime you aren't voting your heart you aren't voicing your opinion anyway. I won't vote for ideals I hate to prevent other ideals which I hate about the same for different reasons from winning. You can't do the same thing, over and over, and expect different results. I'm RP or 3rd party.
scandinaviany3
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huh?
interesting? I hear the fear in what you are saying. But have hope..that we must be sure on.
They are all two sides of the same coin except ron.
temper tantrum, no...Passion..yes.. like lets say a tea party, a declaration of independence...its called integrity, morals, virtues and a willingness to sacrifice for the greater good and your country against all enemies foreign and domestic.
Too many citizens are now too frustrated to ever again be tricked by the worser of two evils one trick at a time. They no longer want to roll over and play dead. Rather now they see they are dead if they do not fight and are now left with no choice but to just say NO!
History is repute with showing eternal vigilance is mandatory. It does not take very many people to change the fate of mankind. But if good and moral men and women do not stand tall and take on the evils of this world the blood of spirit, body and soul is on our hands if we do not act. This is something that the evils that fill the media, congress, try their darnedest to squish out of the people.
You are correct to in saying politics is not a exact science but at least a 80% agreement as Ronald Reagan stated is needed not a 30% like the rest of the candidates offer.
The VP questions is up to Ron. The presidential choice though is still up to us all.
interesting? I hear the fear in what you are saying. But have hope..that we must be sure on.
They are all two sides of the same coin except ron.
temper tantrum, no...Passion..yes.. like lets say a tea party, a declaration of independence...its called integrity, morals, virtues and a willingness to sacrifice for the greater good and your country against all enemies foreign and domestic.
Too many citizens are now too frustrated to ever again be tricked by the worser of two evils one trick at a time. They no longer want to roll over and play dead. Rather now they see they are dead if they do not fight and are now left with no choice but to just say NO!
History is repute with showing eternal vigilance is mandatory. It does not take very many people to change the fate of mankind. But if good and moral men and women do not stand tall and take on the evils of this world the blood of spirit, body and soul is on our hands if we do not act. This is something that the evils that fill the media, congress, try their darnedest to squish out of the people.
You are correct to in saying politics is not a exact science but at least a 80% agreement as Ronald Reagan stated is needed not a 30% like the rest of the candidates offer.
The VP questions is up to Ron. The presidential choice though is still up to us all.
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scandinaviany3
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agreed you are correct
This is the power of negotiation. If they choose to let the democrats win to get their anti US initiatives passed then at least we can show that 5% were not fooled.
This 5% will then come back with a vengence in the party and in the public every year until the next election to show they betrayed us and fooled the rest of america.
This is the power of negotiation. If they choose to let the democrats win to get their anti US initiatives passed then at least we can show that 5% were not fooled.
This 5% will then come back with a vengence in the party and in the public every year until the next election to show they betrayed us and fooled the rest of america.
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scandinaviany3
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curious to understand why you believe Romney???
Why do you believe that Romney would not go with all you say. He has the same group of goons working in his staff and advisors. Which means they will make the calls in his administration once they are put their to return the favor.
I am far, far more worried about non-ron paul supporters going violent. These are the people that talk about killing and winning in iraq and elsewhere. i have meet them..very different viewpoint on killing then civil soceity.
The US will not exist? Hard to say. But Romney is not the savior...most likely from the fruits of those that surround him ...very bad signs of the opposite.
Why do you believe that Romney would not go with all you say. He has the same group of goons working in his staff and advisors. Which means they will make the calls in his administration once they are put their to return the favor.
I am far, far more worried about non-ron paul supporters going violent. These are the people that talk about killing and winning in iraq and elsewhere. i have meet them..very different viewpoint on killing then civil soceity.
The US will not exist? Hard to say. But Romney is not the savior...most likely from the fruits of those that surround him ...very bad signs of the opposite.
Original_Intent
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Agreed.
scandinaviany3
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clinton won because bush seniors was out of touch with america
Bush senior was out of touch with america that is why he lost...
Trust me you all had nothing to do with it.
I was mortified, but learned later how many angry folk there were that felt he was wealthy and out of touch during the economic down turn.
HMMM....sound familiar...great parallel...
Clinton vs Bush Senior
and
Democrats vs Romney
We must be wise and learn not to repeat history and loose again and loose more of the congress.
Ron is the only hope to turn this around.
.
I went that route already. The woman has a deep seated fear of McCain. She said she would hate herself in the morning if Romney lost to McCain by only a few votes. BTW - my mother is 73 and I am 45. We've both been down this road before. When I voted for Perot in 92 (along with my dad and my brother) she
was pissed as hell at us for allowing "that Clinton guy" to win.
Bush senior was out of touch with america that is why he lost...
Trust me you all had nothing to do with it.
I was mortified, but learned later how many angry folk there were that felt he was wealthy and out of touch during the economic down turn.
HMMM....sound familiar...great parallel...
Clinton vs Bush Senior
and
Democrats vs Romney
We must be wise and learn not to repeat history and loose again and loose more of the congress.
Ron is the only hope to turn this around.
constitutional
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You have no idea... you would be better off voting for some communist party rather than voting for Obama.
LibertyEagle
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Voting for the lesser of 2 evils is what got the U.S. in this sad shape
Virgil,
Here's the deal. We got in this mess because the American people held their noses and voted for the lesser of two evils. When you do that, you still get an evil. That is exactly why our government has managed to accomplish every single one of the planks of the Communist Manifesto. Do you even realize that? It's true.
I will not now, nor will I ever again, sell my soul and vote for someone who will further the same policies that have just about destroyed this country! If you do otherwise, YOU ARE THE PROBLEM.
That said, if Ron Paul does not win the nomination, I will be writing him in. By the way, I am old enough to be the mother of a lot of people on this board. My mother was a delegate for Barry Goldwater, Sr., if that gives you any clue. I was young, but I remember going door-to-door handing out that literature.
So NOW, may I suggest that we GET BUSY and do everything within our power to make sure that Dr. Paul DOES get the nomination? Here are some Slim Jims, targeted to Seniors. Please get out there and hand them out.
http://www.unitedforliberty.com/assets/senior_sj_front.pdf
http://www.unitedforliberty.com/assets/senior_sj_back.pdf
Virgil,
Here's the deal. We got in this mess because the American people held their noses and voted for the lesser of two evils. When you do that, you still get an evil. That is exactly why our government has managed to accomplish every single one of the planks of the Communist Manifesto. Do you even realize that? It's true.
I will not now, nor will I ever again, sell my soul and vote for someone who will further the same policies that have just about destroyed this country! If you do otherwise, YOU ARE THE PROBLEM.
That said, if Ron Paul does not win the nomination, I will be writing him in. By the way, I am old enough to be the mother of a lot of people on this board. My mother was a delegate for Barry Goldwater, Sr., if that gives you any clue. I was young, but I remember going door-to-door handing out that literature.
So NOW, may I suggest that we GET BUSY and do everything within our power to make sure that Dr. Paul DOES get the nomination? Here are some Slim Jims, targeted to Seniors. Please get out there and hand them out.
http://www.unitedforliberty.com/assets/senior_sj_front.pdf
http://www.unitedforliberty.com/assets/senior_sj_back.pdf
MsDoodahs
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- 11,373
"it's is about compromise and trying to do the best you can for the most people."
That attitude is the problem.
"Would any of you support Ron Paul as a VP if he doesn't win the nomination? If not why"
No, I would not. Why? Because that is what the GOP would try to do in order to keep all this "new blood" in their "party." The GOP and its "party before country" types can go straight to the devil.
Maybe you can get her aware of her own perspective.
Ask her if she realizes that fear is what's ruining America. Fear mongering by politicians has led our country down this path, and fear is how the majority of these candidates will garner their votes.
So rather than voting for a candidate due to fear, ask her to vote for the candidate of truth & integrity.
I'm aware of the logical arguments & they're important, but maybe she'd be more persuaded by backing it up with your empathy of her feelings of fear, highlighting it, and offering her a different perspective.
gl
Carole
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Have her read this post I found on a Brits for Ron Paul forum:
De Facto Slavery
http://www.nabble.com/De-Facto-Slavery-to13465168.html
"In 1913 the U.S., UK, portugal, spain and France declared bankrupcy and all assets including birth certificates of citizens were signed over as collateral and all soveriengty was lost. You are de-facto slaves and property of the world bankers.
The Ron Paul Revolution is about ending that slavery. Learn the truth about the 1913 bankrupcy. You were born into slavery. Here is America's story. Just search under Bankrupt 1913. It's all there in public record. When you tell people this they will first label you a loon. But, it is nevertheless true. This is why the bank owned media are trying so hard to discredit and censure Ron Paul.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
On the night of December 23, 1913 the United States Congress passed the Federal Reserve Act and thereby committed the greatest act of TREASON in history. It surrendered this nation's sovereignty and sold the American people into slavery to a cabal of arch-charlatan international bankers who proceeded to plunder, bankrupt, and conquer this nation with a money swindle.
The "money" the banks issue is merely bookkeeping entries. It cost them nothing and is not backed by their wealth, efforts, property, or risk. It is not redeemable except in more debt paper. The Federal Reserve Act forced us to pay compound interest on thin air. We now use worthless "notes" backed by our own credit that we cannot own and are made subject to compelled performance for the "privilege."
From 1913 until 1933, the United States paid the "interest" with more and more gold. The structured inevitability soon transpired: the Treasury was empty, the debt was greater than ever, and the United States declared bankruptcy. In exchange for using notes belonging to bankers who create them out of nothing on our own credit, we are forced to repay in substance (labor, property, land, businesses, resources - life) in ever-increasing amounts. This may be the greatest heist and fraud of all time.
When a government goes bankrupt, it loses its sovereignty. In 1933 the United States declared bankruptcy, as expressed in Roosevelt's Executive Orders 6073, 6102, 6111, and 6260, House Joint Resolution 192 of June 5, 1933, confirmed in Perry v. United States, (1935) 294 U.S. 330-381, 79 L.ed 912, as well as 31 USC 5112, 5119, and 12 USC 95A.
The bankrupt United States went into receivership, reorganized in favor of 115 creditors and new owners. In 1913, Congress turned over America... lock, stock and barrel to a handful of criminals whose avowed intent from the beginning was to plunder, bankrupt, conquer, and enslave the people of the United States of America and eliminate this nation from the face of the earth. The goal was, and is, to absorb America into a one-world private commercial government, a "New World Order."
With the Erie R.R. v Tompkins case of 1938, the Supreme Court confirmed their success. We are now in an international private commercial jurisdiction in colorable admiralty-maritime under the Law Merchant. We have been conned and betrayed out of our sovereignty, rights, property, freedom, common law, Article III Courts, and... our Republic. The Bill of Rights has been statutized into "civil rights" in commerce.
America has been stolen. We have been made slaves, i.e. permanent debtors, bankrupt, in legal incapacity, rendered commercial "persons," "residents," and corporate franchisees known as "citizens of the United States" under the so-called "14th Amendment." Said "Amendment," which was never ratified - see Congressional Record, June 13, 1967; Dyett v. Turner, (1968) 439 P2d 266, 267; State v. Phillips, 1975 (affirmed) - created a citizenship for corporations, abstract statutory entities which are the products and definitions of the legislature and are fully taxable and regulatable thereby. Thomas Jefferson's prophecy has come to pass: "If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of currency... the banks... will deprive the people of all property until their children will wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered."
Since 1933 what is called the "United States Government" is a privately owned corporation of the Federal Reserve/IMF. It is merely an instrument whereby the banksters administer their ongoing subjugation and plunder of what was once considered "the last great hope of human freedom." All "public servants," officials, Congressmen, politicians, judges, attorneys, law enforcement officers, States and their various agencies, etc., are the express agents of these foreign principals - see Foreign Agents Registration Act of 1938; 22 USC 286 et seq, 263A, 185G, 267J, 611(C) (ii) & (iii); Treasury Delegation Order #91 - who have stolen the country by clever, intentional, and unrelenting fraud, trickery, treachery, non-disclosure, mis-representation, intrigue, coercion, conspiracy, murder (example: the murder of President John F. Kennedy and the continuing cover-up), etc. If there is a greater tragedy in human history it is hard to know what it is.
An insidious aspect of this is that "officials" like you may think you are "public servants," or upholding the "law," or other hoaxes. In truth you are conscientiously and assiduously serving the arch-enemies of yourselves, your own rights, your fellow citizens, continued... human rights, life, and freedom in general. YOU are seditiously administering the plunder, bankruptcy, conquest, destruction, dismantling, and elimination of your country. YOU are systematically defrauding, extorting, impoverishing, and injuring human life on the basis of crimes and lies of such magnitude, depth, and proportions as to be beyond human comprehension.
By so doing, you are committing TREASON and PERFIDY so immense as "to make the angels weep." If you and your fellow "officials" do not understand the real situation, you are ignorant, naive, deceived, and conned. You are sheer dupes. If you do know and are parties to it, you are guilty of evil and heinous BETRAYAL. You are in such case TRAITORS and CRIMINALS. All of you "in power" are therefore, either fools or knaves, either of which eminently invalidates your "authority" and renders null and void absolutely all moral obligation to pay allegiance or to obey the TREASONOUS SYSTEM you enforce with such mechanical viciousness.
If, you, "public servants" had any shred left of humanity, awe, heart, clarity, sanity, access to your true being and conscience, you would instantly resign and do everything possible to inform the American people of their plight and help us retrieve our rights and our country. Only by such means can you even begin to atone for your endless crimes against humanity, the lives you so arrogantly and mindlessly butcher with the "meat-grinder of the law."
You DID NOT CREATE the lives you "legally" assault; they DO NOT belong to you. Ignorance of the law - moral and natural law - is no excuse. You cannot engage in bringing harm to life and, like the Nazi's defense at Nuernberg, presume that because you do so under the "authority" of an imaginary, abstract, unreal legal fiction called "government" you are freed of the consequences of your acts. Moral and natural law are not obviated by ignorance, hubris and self-righteous militancy. Your entire system - from the ground up - is deceit and fraud. It is illicit in essence and ab initio. As Broom's Maxims 297, 729 put it: "A right of action cannot arise out of fraud." Honor is earned by honesty and integrity, not under false and fraudulent pretenses. The color of the cloth one wears cannot cover up the usurpations, lies, and treachery. "When black is fraudulently declared to be white, not all will live in darkness."
More and more people are awakening to the truth. What do you think the American people will do as they discover that they have no more country, that they are slaves to mortal enemies, that they have been tricked and betrayed by their "leaders" who sold them out? what do you think they will do when they realize that all their alleged "public servants" are willing or stupidly compliant parties to the plunder, bankruptcy, subjugation, and ruin of their lives and country?
Thomas Jefferson wrote: "An honest man can feel no pleasure in the exercise of power over his fellow citizens." Lincoln said: "Just as I would not be a slave, neither would I be a master." I will not participate in your corrupt, arrogant, and cruel fraud, either as perpetrator or victim. The great Indian poet Tagore wrote: "Power takes as ingratitude the writhing of its victims."
I will no longer sit here and writhe. The TYRANNY over this nation MUST END! If you continue with this course, you will have natural and moral law and higher powers to answer to, not to mention all those you have wronged under phony color of law. You will also have your own laws turned against you, as you have turned the law against us. To transform the shield of protection into a sword of exploitation, subjugation, and plunder is perfidy. You have now been placed on notice. All further actions on your part will be willful! "
Signed: All Rights Reserved Without Prejudice.
_________________________________________, Sui Juris.
Resolutely, an American who demands his country back.
CICERO
Power and law are not synonymous. In truth, they are frequently in opposition and irreconcilable. There is God's Law from which all Equitable laws of man emerge and by which men must live if they are not to die in oppression, chaos and despair. Divorced from God's eternal and immutable Law, established before the founding of the suns, man's power is evil no matter the noble words with which it is employed or the motives urged when enforcing it. Men of good will, mindful therefore of the Law laid down by God, will oppose governments whose rule is by men, and if they wish to survive as a nation they will destroy the government which attempts to adjudicate by the whim of venal judges.
De Facto Slavery
http://www.nabble.com/De-Facto-Slavery-to13465168.html
"In 1913 the U.S., UK, portugal, spain and France declared bankrupcy and all assets including birth certificates of citizens were signed over as collateral and all soveriengty was lost. You are de-facto slaves and property of the world bankers.
The Ron Paul Revolution is about ending that slavery. Learn the truth about the 1913 bankrupcy. You were born into slavery. Here is America's story. Just search under Bankrupt 1913. It's all there in public record. When you tell people this they will first label you a loon. But, it is nevertheless true. This is why the bank owned media are trying so hard to discredit and censure Ron Paul.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
On the night of December 23, 1913 the United States Congress passed the Federal Reserve Act and thereby committed the greatest act of TREASON in history. It surrendered this nation's sovereignty and sold the American people into slavery to a cabal of arch-charlatan international bankers who proceeded to plunder, bankrupt, and conquer this nation with a money swindle.
The "money" the banks issue is merely bookkeeping entries. It cost them nothing and is not backed by their wealth, efforts, property, or risk. It is not redeemable except in more debt paper. The Federal Reserve Act forced us to pay compound interest on thin air. We now use worthless "notes" backed by our own credit that we cannot own and are made subject to compelled performance for the "privilege."
From 1913 until 1933, the United States paid the "interest" with more and more gold. The structured inevitability soon transpired: the Treasury was empty, the debt was greater than ever, and the United States declared bankruptcy. In exchange for using notes belonging to bankers who create them out of nothing on our own credit, we are forced to repay in substance (labor, property, land, businesses, resources - life) in ever-increasing amounts. This may be the greatest heist and fraud of all time.
When a government goes bankrupt, it loses its sovereignty. In 1933 the United States declared bankruptcy, as expressed in Roosevelt's Executive Orders 6073, 6102, 6111, and 6260, House Joint Resolution 192 of June 5, 1933, confirmed in Perry v. United States, (1935) 294 U.S. 330-381, 79 L.ed 912, as well as 31 USC 5112, 5119, and 12 USC 95A.
The bankrupt United States went into receivership, reorganized in favor of 115 creditors and new owners. In 1913, Congress turned over America... lock, stock and barrel to a handful of criminals whose avowed intent from the beginning was to plunder, bankrupt, conquer, and enslave the people of the United States of America and eliminate this nation from the face of the earth. The goal was, and is, to absorb America into a one-world private commercial government, a "New World Order."
With the Erie R.R. v Tompkins case of 1938, the Supreme Court confirmed their success. We are now in an international private commercial jurisdiction in colorable admiralty-maritime under the Law Merchant. We have been conned and betrayed out of our sovereignty, rights, property, freedom, common law, Article III Courts, and... our Republic. The Bill of Rights has been statutized into "civil rights" in commerce.
America has been stolen. We have been made slaves, i.e. permanent debtors, bankrupt, in legal incapacity, rendered commercial "persons," "residents," and corporate franchisees known as "citizens of the United States" under the so-called "14th Amendment." Said "Amendment," which was never ratified - see Congressional Record, June 13, 1967; Dyett v. Turner, (1968) 439 P2d 266, 267; State v. Phillips, 1975 (affirmed) - created a citizenship for corporations, abstract statutory entities which are the products and definitions of the legislature and are fully taxable and regulatable thereby. Thomas Jefferson's prophecy has come to pass: "If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of currency... the banks... will deprive the people of all property until their children will wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered."
Since 1933 what is called the "United States Government" is a privately owned corporation of the Federal Reserve/IMF. It is merely an instrument whereby the banksters administer their ongoing subjugation and plunder of what was once considered "the last great hope of human freedom." All "public servants," officials, Congressmen, politicians, judges, attorneys, law enforcement officers, States and their various agencies, etc., are the express agents of these foreign principals - see Foreign Agents Registration Act of 1938; 22 USC 286 et seq, 263A, 185G, 267J, 611(C) (ii) & (iii); Treasury Delegation Order #91 - who have stolen the country by clever, intentional, and unrelenting fraud, trickery, treachery, non-disclosure, mis-representation, intrigue, coercion, conspiracy, murder (example: the murder of President John F. Kennedy and the continuing cover-up), etc. If there is a greater tragedy in human history it is hard to know what it is.
An insidious aspect of this is that "officials" like you may think you are "public servants," or upholding the "law," or other hoaxes. In truth you are conscientiously and assiduously serving the arch-enemies of yourselves, your own rights, your fellow citizens, continued... human rights, life, and freedom in general. YOU are seditiously administering the plunder, bankruptcy, conquest, destruction, dismantling, and elimination of your country. YOU are systematically defrauding, extorting, impoverishing, and injuring human life on the basis of crimes and lies of such magnitude, depth, and proportions as to be beyond human comprehension.
By so doing, you are committing TREASON and PERFIDY so immense as "to make the angels weep." If you and your fellow "officials" do not understand the real situation, you are ignorant, naive, deceived, and conned. You are sheer dupes. If you do know and are parties to it, you are guilty of evil and heinous BETRAYAL. You are in such case TRAITORS and CRIMINALS. All of you "in power" are therefore, either fools or knaves, either of which eminently invalidates your "authority" and renders null and void absolutely all moral obligation to pay allegiance or to obey the TREASONOUS SYSTEM you enforce with such mechanical viciousness.
If, you, "public servants" had any shred left of humanity, awe, heart, clarity, sanity, access to your true being and conscience, you would instantly resign and do everything possible to inform the American people of their plight and help us retrieve our rights and our country. Only by such means can you even begin to atone for your endless crimes against humanity, the lives you so arrogantly and mindlessly butcher with the "meat-grinder of the law."
You DID NOT CREATE the lives you "legally" assault; they DO NOT belong to you. Ignorance of the law - moral and natural law - is no excuse. You cannot engage in bringing harm to life and, like the Nazi's defense at Nuernberg, presume that because you do so under the "authority" of an imaginary, abstract, unreal legal fiction called "government" you are freed of the consequences of your acts. Moral and natural law are not obviated by ignorance, hubris and self-righteous militancy. Your entire system - from the ground up - is deceit and fraud. It is illicit in essence and ab initio. As Broom's Maxims 297, 729 put it: "A right of action cannot arise out of fraud." Honor is earned by honesty and integrity, not under false and fraudulent pretenses. The color of the cloth one wears cannot cover up the usurpations, lies, and treachery. "When black is fraudulently declared to be white, not all will live in darkness."
More and more people are awakening to the truth. What do you think the American people will do as they discover that they have no more country, that they are slaves to mortal enemies, that they have been tricked and betrayed by their "leaders" who sold them out? what do you think they will do when they realize that all their alleged "public servants" are willing or stupidly compliant parties to the plunder, bankruptcy, subjugation, and ruin of their lives and country?
Thomas Jefferson wrote: "An honest man can feel no pleasure in the exercise of power over his fellow citizens." Lincoln said: "Just as I would not be a slave, neither would I be a master." I will not participate in your corrupt, arrogant, and cruel fraud, either as perpetrator or victim. The great Indian poet Tagore wrote: "Power takes as ingratitude the writhing of its victims."
I will no longer sit here and writhe. The TYRANNY over this nation MUST END! If you continue with this course, you will have natural and moral law and higher powers to answer to, not to mention all those you have wronged under phony color of law. You will also have your own laws turned against you, as you have turned the law against us. To transform the shield of protection into a sword of exploitation, subjugation, and plunder is perfidy. You have now been placed on notice. All further actions on your part will be willful! "
Signed: All Rights Reserved Without Prejudice.
_________________________________________, Sui Juris.
Resolutely, an American who demands his country back.
CICERO
Power and law are not synonymous. In truth, they are frequently in opposition and irreconcilable. There is God's Law from which all Equitable laws of man emerge and by which men must live if they are not to die in oppression, chaos and despair. Divorced from God's eternal and immutable Law, established before the founding of the suns, man's power is evil no matter the noble words with which it is employed or the motives urged when enforcing it. Men of good will, mindful therefore of the Law laid down by God, will oppose governments whose rule is by men, and if they wish to survive as a nation they will destroy the government which attempts to adjudicate by the whim of venal judges.
mysticgeek
Member
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- Jan 15, 2008
- Messages
- 652
If no one gets 51% at the convention ... all bets are off.
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