Hawaii official now swears: No Obama birth certificate

[ericsnow]

Posted: January 24, 2011
8:48 pm Eastern

Former Hawaii elections clerk Tim Adams has signed an affidavit swearing he was told by his supervisors in Hawaii that no long-form, hospital-generated birth certificate existed for Barack Obama Jr. in Hawaii and that neither Queens Medical Center nor Kapi'olani Medical Center in Honolulu had any record of Obama having been born in their medical facilities.

http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=254401#ixzz1C0u5YVQ0

 

[Pericles]

In before the thread lock or move........

 

[ericsnow]

In before the thread lock or move........

Why? This is political news is it not?

 

[oyarde]

Why? This is political news is it not?

This will need to be moved to "Hot Topics " , think of it like detention when you were in high school : )

 

[nobody's_hero]

I say we run Daniel Hannan for president.

 

[idirtify]

Unless anyone has any reason to believe this is a hoax, I see no reason to claim it’s anything other than mainstream political news. Now we used to be able to just drop by snopes for our answer, but apparently we can’t even depend on them for the straight dope anymore. It looks legit to me. It looks like the vise is getting tighter, and tighter, and tighter… And the longer it goes, the tighter it gets and the more people it implicates.

 

[HazyHusky420]

Why are people more worried about his certificate than him re-approving the Patriot Act or him KILLING more Afghans (remember when people die they don't come back!) or him letting the bailouts pass?

 

[Kylie]

State at Large, KY?

What does that mean? On the notary stamp.

 

[Promontorium]

So birthers, do you support government mandated birth certs? SSNs before the baby leaves the hospital? Out of the womb serial numbers stamped on baby? National IDs?

This is why I find you people ridiculous. On the one hand you're a neocon fascist Hitlerbama if you think anyone should ever even have ID, or citizenship. And then the same people drinking at the same liberty parties think it's the Obamapocalypse if Barry might not have a birth cert from the hospital or that the horror he might not have been born on an island imperialist/corporatist America stole from the natives.

If I'm wrong, I never want to see a birther thread again, or an ID bitchfest thread. Or the two groups should fight to the death because this is just insane, like 1=1 having sex with 1+1=3.

 

[HazyHusky420]

So birthers, do you support government mandated birth certs? SSNs before the baby leaves the hospital? Out of the womb serial numbers stamped on baby? National IDs?

This is why I find you people ridiculous. On the one hand you're a neocon fascist Hitlerbama if you think anyone should ever even have ID, or citizenship. And then the same people drinking at the same liberty parties think it's the Obamapocalypse if Barry might not have a birth cert from the hospital or that the horror he might not have been born on an island imperialist/corporatist America stole from the natives.

If I'm wrong, I never want to see a birther thread again, or an ID bitchfest thread. Or the two groups should fight to the death because this is just insane, like 1=1 having sex with 1+1=3.

Birthers and those opposed to mandatory ID are usually not the same people. I'm an anarcho-capitalist who opposes mandatory drivers licenses and I roll my eyes everytime someone talks about Obama's birth. Even some constitutionalists roll their eyes because there are far more important issues.

Regardless +rep

 

[specsaregood]

State at Large, KY?

What does that mean? On the notary stamp.

The guy moved to bowling green, ky last year. This isn't new news, he has been saying it since before the last election. And IIRc, the guy isnt some bigwig, he was just a low-level paper pusher in HI. not much of a story, except for those that benefit from keeping it around.

 

[qh4dotcom]

This will need to be moved to "Hot Topics " , think of it like detention when you were in high school : )

The birther threads about Hawaiian governor Abercrombie survived being moved from general politics

 

[qh4dotcom]

Why are people more worried about his certificate than him re-approving the Patriot Act or him KILLING more Afghans (remember when people die they don't come back!) or him letting the bailouts pass?

You don't get it....the birth certificate issue is the fastest way to reverse all the damage Obama has signed into law...

 

[GunnyFreedom]

State at Large, KY?

What does that mean? On the notary stamp.

Understand that the following is regarding the superficial appearance of the affidavit itself, and not regarding the merits of Mr. Adams's argument.

That Mr. Adams and the notary public who witnessed and verified his signature on the affidavit reside in Kentucky? The top of the affidavit specifies that Mr. Adams now resides in Bowling Green Kentucky, so it seems only natural that a notary public of his choosing would reside in that same state. I am not stating any kind of opinion one way or the other as to the merits of his argument, but the affidavit itself appears to be superficially legitimate, assuming that Mr. Adams is in fact who he claims to be, and excepting that I do not see a notary commission number or serial number on the imprinting device itself.

Whether the statement he has sworn to in the affidavit itself is true or false, will be up to the determination of a court, should an offended party (Mr. Adams, President Obama, or one of several Hawaii administrators or bureaucrats) choose to pursue legal action for libel. The fact that the notary stamp reveals the notary is from Kentucky is irrelevant to the legitimacy of the affidavit itself.

Bottom line is that there are only four possibilities here:

1) the affidavit is faked, and this is not the Tim Adams who (allegedly) worked as a senior official of the Hawaii Board of Elections
2) the affidavit is real, but Mr. Adams is lying and has therefore subjected himself to serious liability to include fines and imprisonment
3) the affidavit is real, and Mr. Adams is telling the truth as he personally understands it, but he has misinterpreted the evidence
4) the affidavit is real, and Mr. Adams is telling the truth as he personally understands it, which is a correct interpretation of the evidence.

I, for one, will withhold judgment on the merits of the argument, and state simply that after having reviewed the PDF scans of the affidavit itself, it superficially appears to be genuine, assuming that the (alleged) notary-verified signature belongs to the same Tim Adams as being the Tim Adams (who we must assume) was a senior election official in Hawaii in 2008.

The one thing that leads me to suspect the possibility of this being faked, is the lack of a commission number in the notary's signing statement, or a serial number in the notary's seal. Most states, such as North Carolina, require the presence of a commission mumber, or Montana, the attachment of a serial number to the notary's seal imprint.

There is simply no such number anywhere in the notary block of this document. Maybe Kentucky is one of the few states who require only the notary's name, seal, and signature alone? There is a reason that most States require a commission number or a seal serial number, as a primary protection against fraud. Perhaps someone here more familiar with Kentucky can enlighten us as to the State requirements for commission numbers or seal serial numbers?

 

[HazyHusky420]

You don't get it....the birth certificate issue is the fastest way to reverse all the damage Obama has signed into law...

Then shouldn't Bush have been impeached over the patriot act? Shouldn't Obama have been impeached over the patriot act? Why haven't either of them been tried for the things they have done? Are Americans really that dumb and nationalistic that we have to try and disprove Obama's birthplace when for all we know he was born in America? Don't we have more on Obama than just birthplace? Shouldn't killing innocents be enough to impeach over?

 

[angelatc]

You don't get it....the birth certificate issue is the fastest way to reverse all the damage Obama has signed into law...

To me, if there isn't a birth certificate, then it just goes to show what a slimy conniving bastard he is.

 

[Anti Federalist]

The one thing that leads me to suspect the possibility of this being faked, is the lack of a commission number in the notary's signing statement, or a serial number in the notary's seal. Most states, such as North Carolina, require the presence of a commission mumber, or Montana, the attachment of a serial number to the notary's seal imprint.

There is simply no such number anywhere in the notary block of this document. Maybe Kentucky is one of the few states who require only the notary's name, seal, and signature alone? There is a reason that most States require a commission number or a seal serial number, as a primary protection against fraud. Perhaps someone here more familiar with Kentucky can enlighten us as to the State requirements for commission numbers or seal serial numbers?

Perhaps because she is a "Notary at Large"?

Something I had never heard of before.

 

[HazyHusky420]

To me, if there isn't a birth certificate, then it just goes to show what a slimy conniving bastard he is.

You know he's just a puppet right?

 

[idirtify]

So birthers, do you support government mandated birth certs? SSNs before the baby leaves the hospital? Out of the womb serial numbers stamped on baby? National IDs?

This is why I find you people ridiculous. On the one hand you're a neocon fascist Hitlerbama if you think anyone should ever even have ID, or citizenship. And then the same people drinking at the same liberty parties think it's the Obamapocalypse if Barry might not have a birth cert from the hospital or that the horror he might not have been born on an island imperialist/corporatist America stole from the natives.

If I'm wrong, I never want to see a birther thread again, or an ID bitchfest thread. Or the two groups should fight to the death because this is just insane, like 1=1 having sex with 1+1=3.

To equate controls put on government by the people with controls put on the people by the government is a MASSIVE FAIL in these circles. Understand this: the former is GOOD; the latter is NOT. And understand this: the government and the people are two opposing concepts. Did you know that? And here’s another thing you should know/learn: the people questioning their government (what we are doing here) is GOOD. Yet, you have preferred to call it/us “ridiculous”. Amazing! Depressing!

 

[GunnyFreedom]

Perhaps because she is a "Notary at Large"?

Something I had never heard of before.

Same here. I was wondering where her county was, and just wondering what the heck a "notary at large" for a whole state was. Then i found this website:

http://www.sos.ky.gov/adminservices/notaries/atlarge/

and apparently a "Notary At large" is a specific post designed to notarize items that may be used out of the State of Kentucky. Thus, the appropriate notary for this document would indeed be a "Kentucky Notary Public State at Large."

From the website:

Instructions for Notary Public State at Large


You are applying for a Kentucky Notary Public State at Large. A Kentucky Notary Public State at Large is a resident or nonresident of Kentucky who is appointed to perform notarial acts within the state of Kentucky, but these documents can go to other states for recording. The application process for new appointments and reappointments is the same.

After the application has been processed by the Secretary of State, your Certificate of Appointment will be sent to the county clerk in the county of application. For a Kentucky resident, the county of application is the county where the applicant resides or is principally employed as designated in line 5. For an applicant who is not a resident of Kentucky, but is employed in Kentucky, the county of application is the county in which the non-resident is principally employed. At the same time the Secretary of State sends the Certificate of Appointment to the county clerk, a written notice will be sent to you stating that your Certificate of Appointment is in the county clerk’s office. Within thirty (30) days of receiving your notice, you must go to the county clerk’s office and (1) Post Bond, (2) Take the Oath of Office, and (3) File and record your commission in the office of the county clerk.

For specific information regarding the bonding and oath process, you should make direct contact with your county clerk. Failure to post bond and take the oath will cause your commission to become void. This will necessitate the submission of a new application and fee to become a commissioned notary.

Doing further research into your question, it does appear that one Mrs Hesterlene Whitfield is a current notary at large in the State of Kentucky, and not associated with any county:

Record Detail:

Record ID: 350677 Applicant ID: 350677 Certificate ID: County: Warren
Name: Hesterlene Whitfield Address: This address is not available online.Date of Appointment: 7/11/2007 Date of Application: 6/26/2007State at Large: Yes Special Commission: No Applied for Reappointment: Yes Certificate Returned to SOS From Clerk: No Void: No Rejected: No Certificate Issued By County Clerk: No Date Issued by County Clerk:

curiouser and curiouser. Plus I just read the 19 page notary handbook found here:

http://www.sos.ky.gov/adminservices/notaries/

and nowhere in it is the notary required to reference a commission number, or to have a serial number in their imprint device.

The assumption then must be that the affidavit is genuine, baring the appearance of the real Mrs Hesterlene Whitfield to protest.

So either Mr Adams himself is a fake (and convincingly defrauded Mrs Whitfield with a false identity), or one of items 2, 3, or 4 in my first post are true.

Enough of the pieces fall correctly into place, so I think we can assume at least, that the affidavit itself is genuine. Therefore either Mr Adams is 1) lying, 2) telling the truth but is mistaken, or 3) is telling the truth and is correct. The possibility that the affidavit itself is fraudulent would now seem ruled out.

I didn't actually care enough to do that research before you asked

now that it appears the affidavit is absolutely genuine, it will be interesting to see if anybody takes action against him for libel, or if warrants are issued from a court on account of it. My guess is neither will happen and the story will languish and die.