Estonia the most libertarain country

Pretty sure that Somaliland is the most libertarian area in the world right now. They've also seen explosion of growth, safety & security, and well...the most freedom and liberty of any peoples right now (That and the Xeer is based on restitution, not the eye for an eye everywhere else).

+1

I believe it's unrecognized because the world elite don't want people to know that a functioning, democratic, black, Muslim nation was built out of nothing on its own.

YouTube - ‪Places That Don't Exist: Somaliland Part 1‬‎
 
Good luck getting in. They have a really strict immigration policy. A good buddy of mine is from there and he told me that after a foreigner has been there too long, they'll put you on a boat and ship you away. Not sure if that was just rhetoric or not, but apparently getting citizenship is hard.

I've researched a bit, not seriously, but a bit. They have a quota system based off nationality and your job expertise. Southeast Asian immigrants are currently the most common immigrants and are also the ones they are cutting down on. With a degree, I'm sure it wouldn't be too hard for some Westerners to get in.

+1

I believe it's unrecognized because the world elite don't want people to know that a functioning, democratic, black, Muslim nation was built out of nothing on its own.

Shhh. Remember to never point out that Somalia has higher standards of living now then it did during the previous regime's rule. Yes it may be low, but it's something to point out.
 
Pretty sure that Somaliland is the most libertarian area in the world right now. They've also seen explosion of growth, safety & security, and well...the most freedom and liberty of any peoples right now (That and the Xeer is based on restitution, not the eye for an eye everywhere else).

+100

Costa Rica is pretty good, except they have a large welfare net which Libertario Movimento is trying to get rid of. All in all I'd say Costa Rica is in the best position because unlike any other nation, they abolished their standing armies, have a holiday for it, and have it outlawed.

Interesting... didn't know that about Costa Rica... looks like a good investment opportunity considering it's potential. And how the govt of Costa Rica allows a lot of private competition with it's govt-run companies, fairly well-educated demographics, and generally liberal markets, etc.
 
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Pretty sure that Somaliland is the most libertarian area in the world right now. They've also seen explosion of growth, safety & security, and well...the most freedom and liberty of any peoples right now (That and the Xeer is based on restitution, not the eye for an eye everywhere else). Costa Rica is pretty good, except they have a large welfare net which Libertario Movimento is trying to get rid of. All in all I'd say Costa Rica is in the best position because unlike any other nation, they abolished their standing armies, have a holiday for it, and have it outlawed.

now why doesn't the IMF mess with Costa Rica?
 
Interesting... didn't know that about Costa Rica... looks like a good investment opportunity considering it's potential. And how the govt of Costa Rica allows a lot of private competition with it's govt-run companies, fairly well-educated demographics, and generally liberal markets, etc.

I've heard a lot of good things about their privately run parks as well, pristine and well maintained.

Also the biggest GDP in that region besides the massive Mexico.
 
There is no place left to go:

In May 2009, the Committee on Fiscal Affairs decided to remove all three remaining jurisdictions (Andorra, the Principality of Liechtenstein and the Principality of Monaco) from the list of uncooperative tax havens in the light of their commitments to implement the OECD standards of transparency and effective exchange of information and the timetable they set for the implementation. As a result, no jurisdiction is currently listed as an unco-operative tax haven by the Committee on Fiscal Affairs.

http://www.oecd.org/document/57/0,3343,en_2649_33745_30578809_1_1_1_1,00.html
 
Costa Rica just got into the Drug War by letting U.S. troops begin exercises there. So any freedom is slowly going to disappear. Definitely since they have no standing army. Their new president thinks Obama is cute or something.
 
+1

I believe it's unrecognized because the world elite don't want people to know that a functioning, democratic, black, Muslim nation was built out of nothing on its own.

YouTube - ‪Places That Don't Exist: Somaliland Part 1‬‎

I just watched this whole BBC show on Somalialand.
It was sickening. :(
All pro-statist. The way the spun it was anarchy=warlordism and chaos, while government=peace and order. The fucking UN is training people there to become riot police.

Sorry but this is very far from liberty, it's tribalism mixed with some kind of democracy.

Estonia isn't a libertarian paradise either. Far from it. Mandatory "service" is tyranny. And you bet your ass that taxes will go up...and their currency will fall apart, especially as they go to the Euro.
 
Costa Rica just got into the Drug War by letting U.S. troops begin exercises there. So any freedom is slowly going to disappear. Definitely since they have no standing army. Their new president thinks Obama is cute or something.

I think this is still being fought.

CR has a libertarian streak, but they do love their government there. Nationalism is prevalent, and they have socialized healthcare. Great that they don't have a military. But they do have a lot of state sponsored violence internally.
 
The thing of it is there is no country that is 100% libertarian. In Hong Kong, 60 percent of the people lived in subsidized housing, mostly rented cheaply from the government, and some in Home Ownership Scheme flats, and as far as I know Hong Kong's health care system is almost completely controlled by government. Switzerland has compulsory health insurance.

But it could be safe to say places like Hong Kong, Estonia and Switzerland might be more free than the US with the expectation of the new regulations, TARP, subsidies and health care reform taking place in the next few years.

EDIT: Oh, and the 2012 tax raises too.

Oh yeah man. No place is perfect, but that's why we (liberty-minded folks) have to keep up the resistance no matter where we are. Hong kong, Estonia, Switzerland, costa rica (which is a great place) etc.

Im sure we (Americans) could help the costa ricans by ending the war on drugs and
getting our troops out of there.

Are there any nations ripe for getting some sort of commodity based currency?
 
Costa Rica just got into the Drug War by letting U.S. troops begin exercises there. So any freedom is slowly going to disappear. Definitely since they have no standing army. Their new president thinks Obama is cute or something.
The accuracy of this report is in question.

Yes, the U.S. has a maritime presence in the area to combat the drug trade ( I'm not sure if this is Pacific, Caribbean or both ) but this is unrelated to Costa Rica. The recent agreement was to allow these ships into Costa Rican waters solely to grant shore leave to these seamen and marines.

There is still some political fallout from this decision, but it does not allow an armed U.S. presence into the country. And there will be an economic benefit to the nation.
 
... Nationalism is prevalent, and they have socialized healthcare...
My information is about 3 years old, but my understanding is that they don't have totally socialized healthcare. They have a private healthcare system working along with the government funded system. People go to the private facilities for the common, everyday aches, pains, injuries and illnesses. The socialized system is a safety net for catastrophic illness beyond the ability of individuals and family to pay for on their own.

There are waits and delays typical of socialized systems; and using the private system is quicker and more efficient. This is the economic incentive to encourage use of the private system to the greatest extent possible. It works far better than the European model.
 
and that says it, being libertarian is not solely what motivates you to want to live in a country.
You are right. I would feel very uncomfortable with all the other socialist countries bearing down on me. I do feel fairly comfortable with only 2 other countries bordering ours. Even though one is a socialist police state and the other is 3/4 full of crazy ignorant baboons.

I like Somaliland. I would move there if it wasn't so mono racial or if I were black. I do admit my inherent racial identification precludes me from living in many countries. I can see how sticking out like a sore thumb would make people feel uncomfortable.

I always found it fascinating in the Star Trek shows where you had all those other planets with mono-racial populations. The Vulcan planet, the Klingon planet, the Ferenge planet, and all those other alien mono-racial planets. Then you had the Earth planet where all different kinds of aliens and races were running around acting like every one on Earth was on a Sunday picnic. I could understand on the alien planets having total racial harmony, but I couldn't understand it always being like a picnic on Earth. The people on Earth must have all been lobotomized in the show. There are no racial tensions in the mono-racial countries like Somaliland and Japan.
 
I just watched this whole BBC show on Somalialand.
It was sickening. :(
All pro-statist. The way the spun it was anarchy=warlordism and chaos, while government=peace and order. The fucking UN is training people there to become riot police.

Sorry but this is very far from liberty, it's tribalism mixed with some kind of democracy.

Estonia isn't a libertarian paradise either. Far from it. Mandatory "service" is tyranny. And you bet your ass that taxes will go up...and their currency will fall apart, especially as they go to the Euro.

I am looking more into somalia, and don't quote me on this (unless you are refuting it, but this is what I have gotten so far:

After the central government in somalia fell, Competition and free markets thrived. Conditions, as bad as they are, have become much better for somalians. Even our own government and CIA have admitted it. Infastructure actually began to thrive.

quickly the thriving buisness communities began suppling power and water to villages that once had none. The communications industry thrived, with the growing number of news industries, telecommunications (international plan $10/month), and others's growing competitiviness. A country that once had 1 plane, now had 16 airfields and multiple airline companies with increasingly lower prices.

The growing buisness also began to hire security companies in order to combat the feudal warlords.

Then Charity from outside coutries, began funding certain religious organizations that offered their services as judicial moderators to somalians. Their justice system was based on islamic law. When these judicial orginazations where artificially proped up, they joined together to become the UIC. Secular warlords in the area began to opose the islamic courts. Our CIA, fearing ties between the UIC and Al'queda began funneling money to the secular warlords in the area.

When the secular warlords began recieving funds, Islamic militias formed inorder to back the UIC. The secular warlords then began attacking the UIC. The UIC was winning until the Ethiopian militia backed by the UN and US imposed and ousted the UIC. Former States men of the last central government, reimposed themselves with the backing of Nato forces.

Or basically, the world decided to intervene, and slowly began screwing things up.

Of course this is all from an hour of reading which is pretty shallow for analysis of an entire country between 1990's and today. I'm looking for a book or two on the subject. It seems as if it would be very interesting.

Also in regard to Estonia, I agree its no paradise of liberty, it just seemed intriguing as being much closer than many other countries. I don't know if there is a government in the world without injustice, Estonia just appears to have less on average. Also the libertarianish party there has 30 seats of 101. They premote the end to involuntary service. Hopefully for Estonia, they will suceed in ending that tyranny. I don't know much more than that about it though.

And as for taxes, Sales tax is going up 2% in their attempt to keep their budget balanced, which has grown a little more expensive than projected due to to the recession. So you called that correctly... unfortunatly they didn't when they made the call to raise taxes. And pegging to the Euro is going to hurt them later on if not already, I'm sure we all agree. It seems as if they were so close, yet so far.

Still for a minority in congress, the liberals could be doing much worse. I remain optimistic for them when comparing them to most of the world.
 
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You are right. I would feel very uncomfortable with all the other socialist countries bearing down on me. I do feel fairly comfortable with only 2 other countries bordering ours. Even though one is a socialist police state and the other is 3/4 full of crazy ignorant baboons.

I like Somaliland. I would move there if it wasn't so mono racial or if I were black.

thats exactly why i fear somalia, of course i could be naive and ignorant
 
I just watched this whole BBC show on Somalialand.
It was sickening. :(
All pro-statist. The way the spun it was anarchy=warlordism and chaos, while government=peace and order. The fucking UN is training people there to become riot police.

Sorry but this is very far from liberty, it's tribalism mixed with some kind of democracy.

I didn't get that. I had to remind myself I was watching something from the BBC. It really seemed like they were promoting the fact that a bare bones government was running the country effectively. Libertarianism is essentially the advocacy of bare bones government. Come on, the health minister is a nurse by day. The government is composed of people moonlighting.

The UN thing was a part of this. It showed the only foreign aid this country is getting is UN officials lobbing stones on a basketball court.
 
I am looking more into somalia, and don't quote me on this (unless you are refuting it, but this is what I have gotten so far:

First of all, thanks for the thread. I'm a big fan of Estonia (yes it isn't perfect but I just love these people's spirit, look into their history). I'm also a big fan of Somaliland, I think the developments there deserve 100 PhD theses in Economics.

About Somalia, first, please share your sources so we can also read them and perhaps bookmark them.

More important, I think you missed the mark when it comes to the courts. The courts system was actually the most ingenious, amazingly anarcho-capitalist development.

The courts were set up because there was a need for courts. Because of the tribal nature of Somali society, when a case was brought before a court, the clans of the claimants (both parties) would give a promise to the court to pay its fees and accept its ruling and carry it out no matter what it may be. The courts slowly starting building its own militia to enforce its rulings.

Note (importantly) that: courts competed in what's closest to a free market. No court had a monopoly over a certain area or town. Similarly, the court's militia wasn't the only one around. This meant that it was in the best interest of each court to be fair, unbiased, and non-violent.

The trouble started with foreign intervention. I don't know if you met any Somali people, but they are extremely dynamic, and an ascendant Somalia would be a threat to many of its neighbors. Besides they sit right there at the entrance of the Red Sea, an area both Israel and the US are interested in for security and economic reasons.

So when the courts (UIC) came close to the capital, which was still under the (internationally recognized) government's control, the "officials" asked for African and US troops to prop them up, by using that boogie-man, Al-Qaeda. It's no surprise that Al-Qaeda only had a major faction within Somalia AFTER this intervention.

Somaliland is the northern part of Somalia and has been safe and peaceful, as virtually all the fighting is taking place in the south.
 
thats exactly why i fear somalia, of course i could be naive and ignorant

I don't know how it is back in Somalia itself, but most Somalis I met have been extremely friendly and very down-to-earth.

(Although the Somali dudes I know have warned me of their women, for some reason. One of them actually took me aside and told me: You see how friendly our men are? Our women are exactly the opposite. They're tyrants. Don't mess with them.)
 
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