Citizen deportations next.

The distinction between citizenship by birth and citizenship by naturalization is clearly marked in the provisions of the Constitution, by which "no person, except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President;" and "the Congress shall have power to establish an uniform rule of naturalization." Constitution, art. 2, sect. 1; art. 1, sect. 8.
By the Thirteenth Amendment of the Constitution slavery was prohibited. The main object of the opening sentence of the Fourteenth Amendment was to settle the question, upon which there had been a difference of opinion throughout the country and in this court, as to the citizenship of free negroes (Scott v. Sandford, 19 How. 393); and to put it beyond doubt that all persons, white or black, and whether formerly slaves or not, born or naturalized in the United States, and owing no allegiance to any alien power, should be citizens of the United States and of the State in which they reside. Slaughter-House Cases, 16 Wall. 36, 73; Strauder v. West Virginia, 102 U.S. 303, 306.
This section contemplates two sources of citizenship, and two sources only: birth and naturalization. The persons declared 102*102 to be citizens are "all persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof." , The evident meaning of these last words is, not merely subject in some respect or degree to the jurisdiction of the United States, but completely subject to their political jurisdiction, and owing them direct and immediate allegiance. And the words relate to the time of birth in the one case, as they do to the time of naturalization in the other. Persons not thus subject to the jurisdiction of the United States at the time of birth cannot become so afterwards, except by being naturalized, either individually, as by proceedings under the naturalization acts, or collectively, as by the force of a treaty by which foreign territory is acquired.

Indians born within the territorial limits of the United States, members of, and owing immediate allegiance to, one of the Indian tribes (an alien, though dependent, power), although in a geographical sense born in the United States, are no more "born in the United States and subject to the jurisdiction thereof," within the meaning of the first section of the Fourteenth Amendment, than the children of subjects of any foreign government born within the domain of that government, or the children born within the United States, of ambassadors or other public ministers of foreign nations.


This view is confirmed by the second section of the Fourteenth Amendment, which provides that "representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed." Slavery having been abolished, and the persons formerly held as slaves made citizens, this clause fixing the apportionment of representatives has abrogated so much of the corresponding clause of the original Constitution as counted only three-fifths of such persons. But Indians not taxed are still excluded from the count, for the reason that they are not citizens. Their absolute exclusion from the basis of representation, in which all other persons are now included, is wholly inconsistent with their being considered citizens.
So the further provision of the second section for a proportionate 103*103 reduction of the basis of the representation of any State in which the right to vote for presidential electors, representatives in Congress, or executive or judicial officers or members of the legislature of a State, is denied, except for participation in rebellion or other crime, to "any of the male inhabitants of such State, being twenty-one years of age and citizens of the United States," cannot apply to a denial of the elective franchise to Indians not taxed, who form no part of the people entitled to representation.

It is also worthy of remark, that the language used, about the same time, by the very Congress which framed the Fourteenth Amendment, in the first section of the Civil Rights Act of April 9, 1866, declaring who shall be citizens of the United States, is "all persons born in the United States, and not subject to any foreign power, excluding Indians not taxed." 14 Stat. 27; Rev. Stat. § 1992.

Such Indians, then, not being citizens by birth, can only become citizens in the second way mentioned in the Fourteenth Amendment, by being "naturalized in the United States," by or under some treaty or statute.
The action of the political departments of the government, not only after the proposal of the Amendment by Congress to the States in June, 1866, but since the proclamation in July, 1868, of its ratification by the requisite number of States, accords with this construction.
While the Amendment was pending before the legislatures of the several States, treaties containing provisions for the naturalization of members of Indian tribes as citizens of the United States were made on July 4, 1866, with the Delawares, in 1867 with various tribes in Kansas, and with the Pottawatomies, and in April, 1868, with the Sioux. 14 Stat. 794, 796; 15 Stat. 513, 532, 533, 637.
The treaty of 1867 with the Kansas Indians strikingly illustrates the principle that no one can become a citizen of a nation without its consent, and directly contradicts the supposition that a member of an Indian tribe can at will be alternately a citizen of the United States and a member of the tribe.

That treaty not only provided for the naturalization of members 104*104 of the Ottawa, Miami, Peoria, and other tribes, and their families, upon their making declaration, before the District Court of the United States, of their intention to become citizens; 15 Stat. 517, 520, 521; but, after reciting that some of the Wyandotts, who had become citizens under the treaty of 1855, were "unfitted for the responsibilities of citizenship;" and enacting that a register of the whole people of this tribe, resident in Kansas or elsewhere, should be taken, under the direction of the Secretary of the Interior, showing the names of "all who declare their desire to be and remain Indians and in a tribal condition," and of incompetents and orphans as described in the treaty of 1855, and that such persons, and those only, should thereafter constitute the tribe; it provided that "no one who has heretofore consented to become a citizen, nor the wife or children of any such person, shall be allowed to become members of the tribe, except by the free consent of the tribe after its new organization, and unless the agent shall certify that such party is, through poverty or incapacity, unfit to continue in the exercise of the responsibilities of citizenship of the United States, and likely to become a public charge." 15 Stat. 514, 516.
Since the ratification of the Fourteenth Amendment, Congress has passed several acts for naturalizing Indians of certain tribes, which would have been superfluous if they were, or might become, without any action of the government, citizens of the United States...

...The law upon the question before us has been well stated by Judge Deady in the District Court of the United States for the District of Oregon. In giving judgment against the plaintiff in a case resembling the case at bar, he said: "Being born a member of `an independent political community' — the Chinook — he was not born subject to the jurisdiction of the United States — not born in its allegiance." McKay v. Campbell, 2 Sawyer, 118, 134.

More at: Elk v. Wilkins
 
The child born in the U.S. is in MOST CASES a citizen by birth.

This was ruled 6-2 in 1898.

United States v. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649 (1898)
And now let us look at United States v. Wong Kim Ark
The 14th Amendment's citizenship clause, according to the court's majority, had to be interpreted in light of English common law tradition that had excluded from citizenship at birth only two classes of people: (1) children born to foreign diplomats and (2) children born to enemy forces engaged in hostile occupation of the country's territory. The majority held that the "subject to the jurisdiction" phrase in the 14th Amendment specifically encompassed these conditions (plus a third condition, namely, that Indian tribes were not considered subject to U.S. jurisdiction[4])

The Wong Kim Ark case is in conflict with the original intent of the 14thA as expressed by those who drafted it and unless overruled would allow legal visitors and dual citizens to qualify but even it would allow illegals to be excluded because illegals are hostile invaders who are occupying our territory.
(It should be overruled)

Remember that until the 1960's nobody claimed illegals were covered by the 14thA.
 
And now let us look at United States v. Wong Kim Ark


The Wong Kim Ark case is in conflict with the original intent of the 14thA as expressed by those who drafted it and unless overruled would allow legal visitors and dual citizens to qualify but even it would allow illegals to be excluded because illegals are hostile invaders who are occupying our territory.
(It should be overruled)

Remember that until the 1960's nobody claimed illegals were covered by the 14thA.

Yeah, I would have ruled in the dissent. It has to be challenged, and the "rights" of non-citizens also has to go to Scotus.
I find it sad that so many Americans seem to think foreigners allowed here as a PRIVELEGE need not behave in a certain way
to maintain that privelege.
 
When Rights are no longer considered Natural/God-given Rights, but instead granted, and taken away, by governments -------> you're next.

I don't care what some piece of paper or politician says.
 
When Rights are no longer considered Natural/God-given Rights, but instead granted, and taken away, by governments -------> you're next.

I don't care what some piece of paper or politician says.
Being an American citizen is not a right given by GOD to everyone on earth.
It is a right of Americans and their posterity, it is a privilege that Americans can choose to offer to others or not.

Get lost with your great replacement agenda, globalist.
 
Being an American citizen is not a right given by GOD to everyone on earth.
It is a right of Americans and their posterity, it is a privilege that Americans can choose to offer to others or not.

Get lost with your great replacement agenda, globalist.

Don't even try to play word games with me. You'll lose - again. I never said anything about "American citizen" being a Right or not.

Tom Woods is correct. So am I.

Your Neocon buddy Kristi Noem is having too much of an influence over you.



 
Don't even try to play word games with me. You'll lose - again. I never said anything about "American citizen" being a Right or not.

Tom Woods is correct. So am I.

Your Neocon buddy Kristi Noem is having too much of an influence over you.



Criminals forfeit many rights, invaders even more.
 
Foreigners do not have a right to be here, they may be removed for any or no reason without violating their rights.
 
Being an American citizen is not a right given by GOD to everyone on earth.

But they are given by God. And you'd establish a system that could accidentally take them away in your prog-like faith that government is infallible. You're so busy trying to deny rights to foreigners that you'd gladly throw the baby -- the God-given rights of Americans -- out with the bathwater.

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This is how our God-given rights get eroded away. Some asshole says, if ya wanna make an omelet ya gotta break a few eggs, and other people nod -- and instantly turn into hypocrites.
 
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You have due process Rights to determine that. It's best not to engage with me if you want to avoid further embarrassment.
We've already dealt with this, you don't have a right to a court hearing, and the only reason there is a right to prove you are a citizen is for citizens, the invaders don't have that right.
 
But they are given by God. And you'd establish a system that could accidentally take them away in your prog-like faith that government is infallible. You're so busy trying to deny rights to foreigners that you'd gladly throw the baby -- the God-given rights of Americans -- out with the bathwater.

6802bf717bb0b.webp


This is how our God-given rights get eroded away. Some asshole says, if ya wanna make an omelet ya gotta break a few eggs, and other people nod -- and instantly turn into hypocrites.
Bunk.
Foreign enemies and invaders must be removed to protect the rights of Americans, you are trying to take our rights by making up new ones for enemies and invaders.
 
Who cares if they have the right to do it or not? They can't do it. Right?

Right?
The principle matters.
Invaders have NO rights, in the right circumstances they can be shot in the field and buried in a shallow grave.
Only our mercy and care for the rights of our citizens keeps them from being shot instead of rounded up, and only our mercy lets them be deported instead of shot once their status as invaders is certified.
 
Foreign enemies and invaders must be removed to protect the rights of Americans, you are trying to take our rights by making up new ones for enemies and invaders.

It takes a special kind of idiot to be unable to wrap your head around the fact that government ain't God, and until Musk, Thiel and Gates start chipping us like purebred dogs or putting ear tags on us like cattle government can't tell a citizen from a non-citizen by looking.

I repeat: You would risk denying citizens their rights out of fear that you might accidentally give a foreigner the same consideration one time.
 
It takes a special kind of idiot to be unable to wrap your head around the fact that government ain't God, and until Musk, Thiel and Gates start chipping us like purebred dogs or putting ear tags on us like cattle government can't tell a citizen from a non-citizen by looking.

I repeat: You would risk denying citizens their rights out of fear that you might accidentally give a foreigner the same consideration one time.
You're just making up garbage again.
Nobody is risking the rights of citizens.
 
...once their status as invaders is certified.

And now you're saying to give everyone, illegal or not, due process.

We've been explaining to you for a week what the phrase due process means, and you never dispute it, but you go on bleating about it even as you say illegals should get it. You don't disagree with the definition of the phrase everyone else is using but base your constant flow if toxicity on some other definition you won't explain beyond, something that takes months in court.

And you don't even seem to have the sense to be embarrassed.
 
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And now you're saying to give everyone, illegal or not, due process.

We've been explaining to you for a week what the phrase due process means, and you never dispute it, but you go on bleating about it even as you say illegals should get it.

And you don't even seem to have the sense to be embarrassed.
You keep trying to muddy the waters using the magic words "due process".
I told you all along that they were making sure they were not citizens, and you kept pretending that they didn't so you could demand more than what they do because to give them more is to give them court hearings, and you know that what the left, Rand, and every other idiot braying about "due process" are demanding is individual court fights.
You only retreat to claiming you don't mean court fights when pinned down on it, and then you go back to pretending they don't do anything to make sure they are not citizens.
 
You keep trying to muddy the waters using the magic words "due process".

Once again accusing others of your sins.

Anyone can see who's posting from la-la land.

You've been told a hundred times that making sure they aren't citizens is due process and you keep stirring everyone up by shouting that due process must be denied them. You aren't serious. You're just trolling, plain as the nose on your face.

You're using a different definition of that very phrase from literally everyone else, yet it's always someone else muddying the waters with it. Spoken like a true progressive leftist. Or any other type of megalomanic.
 
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