Are you for open borders?

[dgr]

I'm so confused "open borders" is the main focus of neo-cons, which I thought you hated, along with free trade it is the cornerstone of the "conservatative" form of goverment, I thought you were libertarians or centrist.
It is a provision in the US EU Intergration Agreemant and SPP, which I thought you all opposed.
Not to mention how it's going to affect the cencus. In NC last election we had 600,000 voters who did not pass the Social Security E-verify test, but the courts said we could only throw out 200,000, the rest had a power bill to prove who they were. that adds up because the DMV said 400,000 people had illegally obtained drivers liciences

 

[Met Income]

Why do we need a nation of monopolized violence?

 

[LibertyEagle]

Why do we need a nation of monopolized violence?

So, are you saying you want to dissolve the United States?

 

[Voltaire]

Eliminate the nation-state and the same problems will develop - the nation-state exists because we acknowledge the persistence of organized power, or as Met Income calls it, "monopolized violence."

The only thing worse than having a government is having no government.

 

[revolutionisnow]

I'm so confused "open borders" is the main focus of neo-cons, which I thought you hated, along with free trade it is the cornerstone of the "conservatative" form of goverment, I thought you were libertarians or centrist.
It is a provision in the US EU Intergration Agreemant and SPP, which I thought you all opposed.
Not to mention how it's going to affect the cencus. In NC last election we had 600,000 voters who did not pass the Social Security E-verify test, but the courts said we could only throw out 200,000, the rest had a power bill to prove who they were. that adds up because the DMV said 400,000 people had illegally obtained drivers liciences

It might be a talking point of them, but definitely not a focus. If it was a focus, something would have been done about it.

The fact is both parties want illegals coming here. Big business republicans want cheap labor, democrats and liberals want to attempt to save the world through government and get a larger democrat voting base.

 

[Agorism]

So, are you saying you want to dissolve the United States?

That would be an excellent idea. Just have the states in charge of their own sovereignty. Hopefully some states could be further decentralized, and we could have good competition among the states so that some are not anti-business.

 

[Toureg89]

That would be an excellent idea. Just have the states in charge of their own sovereignty. Hopefully some states could be further decentralized, and we could have good competition among the states so that some are not anti-business.

not a bad idea imo.

power seems to be way too centralized.

even at the State level.

 

[scottish devil]

are you for open borders

Another new member with crazy Nationalist tendencies. BNP and Stormfront go away, please.

Ok, you want open borders then answer this. Let's say we drop all border checks and let everyone come to this country and work. What about minority hiring quotas or affirmative action. Do you think you can keep a job when the company you work for has incentives to hire someone less qualified than you. Are you really willing to trade you and your childrens future? Or are you planning to become the minority and eat at the trough of goverment entitlement.
This may be a good plan for you but not for me and mine.

 

[The Patriot]

The desire for separation from others is completely legitimate.

 

[Met Income]

The desire for separation from others is completely legitimate.

You have the right to voluntarily separate yourself on your property, not others.

 

[MelissaWV]

That would be an excellent idea. Just have the states in charge of their own sovereignty. Hopefully some states could be further decentralized, and we could have good competition among the states so that some are not anti-business.

This doesn't answer the OP's question, but just pushes it in another direction. So would you, if your state split off right now, be for your state having open borders?

 

[The Patriot]

You have the right to voluntarily separate yourself on your property, not others.

Just as a group of individuals who make up the nation have the right to separate themselves from a group of individuals in another nation.By the the nation I don't mean the state, but as Murray Rothbard put it, "the entire web of culture, values, traditions, religion, and language in which the individuals of a society are raised".

 

[Met Income]

Just as a group of individuals who make up the nation have the right to separate themselves from a group of individuals in another nation.By the the nation I don't mean the state, but as Murray Rothbard put it, "the entire web of culture, values, traditions, religion, and language in which the individuals of a society are raised".

Again, you do not have a right to tell me what to do on my property. It's of no concern to you if I want to hire or rent to someone on my property. We have a welfare problem, not an immigration problem.

 

[LibertyEagle]

Founding Fathers Were Immigration Skeptics
Jul 23, 2007 by Woods, Thomas E Jr

The American people continue to be involved in a long-overdue national discussion of immigration. And yet, during the debate over the immigration bill that recently died in the Senate. I do not recall hearing the views of the Founding Fathers-even it' only out of curiosity-considered, pursued or even raised.

Contrary to what most Americans may believe, in fact, the Founding Fathers were by and large skeptical of immigration. If the United States lacked people with particular skills, then the Founders had no objection to attracting them from abroad. But they were convinced that mass immigration would bring social turmoil and political confusion in its wake.

In one of the most neglected sections of his Notes on Virginia. Thomas Jefferson posed the question. "Are there no inconveniences to be thrown into the scale against the advantage expected by a multiplication of numbers by the importation of foreigners?"

What was likely to happen, according to Jefferson, was that immigrants would come to America from countries that would have given them no experience living in a free society. They would bring with them the ideas and principles of the governments they left behind-ideas and principles that were often at odds with American liberty.

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=21626

 

[The Patriot]

Again, you do not have a right to tell me what to do on my property. It's of no concern to you if I want to hire or rent to someone on my property. We have a welfare problem, not an immigration problem.

As long as these people you hire don't come illegally, grab a welfare check, and taking a job from a legal immigrant or American citizen you don't have a problem. Otherwise, they are committing a couple crimes, one, they are violating the sovereignty of the nation, they are engaging in theft of people's wages and of a legal person's job through their illegal actions. You are facilitating in that illegal action thus you are complicit in the crime.

"Beyond a small quantity, national heterogeneity simply does not work; the "nation" disintegrates into more than one nation, and the need for separation becomes acute. "
Murray Rothbard.

The nation is as I said before, "the entire web of culture, values, traditions, religion, and language in which the individuals of a society are raised." This is not to be confused with the state. They are entirely different things.

 

[Met Income]

As long as these people you hire don't come illegally, grab a welfare check, and taking a job from a legal immigrant or American citizen you don't have a problem. Otherwise, they are committing a couple crimes, one, they are violating the sovereignty of the nation, they are engaging in theft of people's wages and of a legal person's job through their illegal actions. You are facilitating in that illegal action thus you are complicit in the crime.

"Beyond a small quantity, national heterogeneity simply does not work; the "nation" disintegrates into more than one nation, and the need for separation becomes acute. "
Murray Rothbard.

The nation is as I said before, "the entire web of culture, values, traditions, religion, and language in which the individuals of a society are raised." This is not to be confused with the state. They are entirely different things.

the immigrants are not creating the theft, the State is. We have a welfare proble
, not an immigration problem. Welfare violates property rights, immigration doesn't. You have no right to tell me what to do on my property. Voluntary employment is not an actual crime, it's a diversion for slave vs slave conflict, while the elites whistle past the graveyard. Focusing on immigration empowers the Fed

 

[rpfan2008]

the immigrants are not creating the theft, the State is.

who is "state"?
The constitutional just state or the one created by the nasty elements who have taken over it?

 

[Met Income]

who is "state"?
The constitutional just state or the one created by the nasty elements who have taken over it?

Everyone in government who administers legalized theft.

 

[rpfan2008]

Everyone in government who administers legalized theft.

Very roundabout answer, how about trying to expel/rectify those elements rather than abolishing the entire state?

 

[Met Income]

Very roundabout answer, how about trying to expel/rectify those elements rather than abolishing the entire state?

Because that still leaves the possibility open for government to rob its citizens at gunpoint.