A self evident fact: "liberty is not what people yearn for"

[VIDEODROME]

Women are to blame for the formation of the Mafia?

 

[timosman]

Women are to blame for the formation of the Mafia?

Eighteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eighteenth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution

 

[Danke]

I don't disagree with any of this...

But what's the solution?...

Should property tax be illegal?

Should it be fixed? If so by whom and using what criteria?

Finally under whose authority does any of this take place?

Governments are bloated, every aspect of them including their kourts and their enforcers.... (K is for kangaroo)

The whole thing is one big mess with better than half the mouths eating drawing their food monies from government in one way or another....How does one fight one aspect without engaging the others?

Property tax should be limited to the expenses it incurs. Like maintenance of the street and curb in front of ones house.

 

[Danke]

Also mobsters and, eventually, the deep state.

 

[Warrior_of_Freedom]

I don't disagree with any of this...

But what's the solution?...

Should property tax be illegal?

Should it be fixed? If so by whom and using what criteria?

Finally under whose authority does any of this take place?

Governments are bloated, every aspect of them including their kourts and their enforcers.... (K is for kangaroo)

The whole thing is one big mess with better than half the mouths eating drawing their food monies from government in one way or another....How does one fight one aspect without engaging the others?

The "solution" is beside the fact. I don't care. I should be able to be dead broke and grow tomatoes in my backyard and live off that if I wanna.

 

[Warrior_of_Freedom]

Property tax should be limited to the expenses it incurs. Like maintenance of the street and curb in front of ones house.

My patch of road will be just dirt. How do you like that?

 

[tod evans]

The "solution" is beside the fact. I don't care. I should be able to be dead broke and grow tomatoes in my backyard and live off that if I wanna.

All well and good until you get booted from your land for not paying property tax..

Even dirt road people pay property tax, it's substantially less than what city folk pay but it's still property tax.

1/2 the county I live in is accessed by dirt roads and we're taxed...

 

[shakey1]

Property tax is nothing more than paying rent to the man.

 

[tod evans]

Property tax is nothing more than paying rent to the man.

100% true.

However I know of no alternative, do you?

 

[shakey1]

100% true.

However I know of no alternative, do you?

 

[ATruepatriot]

The Man Versus The State

By Herbet Spencer.

http://files.libertyfund.org/files/330/0020_Bk.pdf

 

[Warrior_of_Freedom]

100% true.

However I know of no alternative, do you?

The alternative is not paying property tax

 

[tod evans]

The alternative is not paying property tax

Let me know how that works out for you.

I'll set aside $100.00 to chip in on your legal fees/ moving expenses/ammo/ however you address the ingress of governments agents.

 

[VIDEODROME]

I think Socialism trains people to think they want to be taken care of. The more exposure, the less initiative toward freedom. People become helpless.

Do people wanting some social services like healthcare really want the whole economy centrally planned or nationalized? People want some basic services like Fire Departments, Police, Snow Plows, and yes The Roads or even Social Security. For reason it becomes such a horrible idea to add Healthcare as another service or even just coverage for that service.

Somehow the discourse on this goes to the most extreme like people want Communism. Now maybe there is some kind of slippery slope argument, but the way money is poured into Military or Corporate interests makes me wonder if there is plenty of cash just being squandered to create "Socialism for the Rich".

I'm not trying to argue heavily against what [MENTION=22770]euphemia[/MENTION] is saying here, but just wonder about how this discussion gets to an extreme polarized version. Also, to be be fair people want some responsibility to an extent, but want to be taken care of as well when catastrophes happen.

 

[tod evans]

Do people wanting some social services like healthcare really want the whole economy centrally planned or nationalized? People want some basic services like Fire Departments, Police, Snow Plows, and yes The Roads or even Social Security. For reason it becomes such a horrible idea to add Healthcare as another service or even just coverage for that service.

Somehow the discourse on this goes to the most extreme like people want Communism. Now maybe there is some kind of slippery slope argument, but the way money is poured into Military or Corporate interests makes me wonder if there is plenty of cash just being squandered to create "Socialism for the Rich".

I'm not trying to argue heavily against what [MENTION=22770]euphemia[/MENTION] is saying here, but just wonder about how this discussion gets to an extreme polarized version. Also, to be be fair people want some responsibility to an extent, but want to be taken care of as well when catastrophes happen.

Think of all the extra dollars there would be if 'government' didn't offer services....

If...................And I'm just freewheeling here...........Tax lucre was still collected but the citizenry had to vote quarterly on disbursements...

Government involvement would only be bookkeeping.

No telling how much money populated counties/towns would save without bloated salaries and pensions.

 

[TheTexan]

100% true.

However I know of no alternative, do you?

If only the founding fathers had included an alternative in the constitution.

But alas, they did not.

 

[Cleaner44]

This is the reality we must deal with.

Freedom is NOT popular.

Security is.

I can sit here and wish for a libertarian nation that I know will never happen, or I can deal with the United States as it exists and always will... a struggle between those that want to be free and those that want collectivism.

Collectivism = Left, Democrats, Socialists, Communists, Progressives, Neo-Conservatives, etc...

 

[Swordsmyth]

This is the reality we must deal with.

Freedom is NOT popular.

Security is.

I can sit here and wish for a libertarian nation that I know will never happen, or I can deal with the United States as it exists and always will... a struggle between those that want to be free and those that want collectivism.

Collectivism = Left, Democrats, Socialists, Communists, Progressives, Neo-Conservatives, etc...

Even liberty must be secured.

Many libertarians seem to think that security and liberty are always and forever direct opposites but that isn't true, in fact you can't have either one without the other.

 

[Southron]

The best hope for liberty is to have the US some day be broken up into many separate nations. Those nations who want liberty are going to need a collective shared identity. Citizenship and voting rights will have to be carefully guarded.

I don’t see any hope for the U.S. as a whole. It’s too fractured and any shared identity seems to be disappearing more every year. Break it up.