What's Going on at the Bundy Ranch?

[pcosmar]

Because of what the guy said about shooting 'deserters'.

Listen again..

You are taking one sentence out of context.

Now I have been checking the Bundy Blog and Their FB page.. Both of the praise the Militia.. and Operation Mutual Aid (Ryan Payne is the organizer)

They make NO MENTION of the Oath Keepers or anyone else.

 

[Pericles]

Why do you care so much about the leadership?

There are about a half dozen attempts to build nationwide militia networks aligned with some group or another. The Operation Mutual Aid network is tied into Gary Hunt's Continental Congress effort. Then there is the Lightfoot bunch, and others. All of them seem keen to have a nationwide organization of an entity that according to the Constitution belongs to the states ... as a state organization at most.

The one thing these have in common is the desire of certain individuals to elbow everybody else out of the way and get themselves to the front of the line - thus the importance of showing up "first" to some people.

 

[pcosmar]

There are about a half dozen attempts to build nationwide militia networks aligned with some group or another. The Operation Mutual Aid network is tied into Gary Hunt's Continental Congress effort. Then there is the Lightfoot bunch, and others. All of them seem keen to have a nationwide organization of an entity that according to the Constitution belongs to the states ... as a state organization at most.

The one thing these have in common is the desire of certain individuals to elbow everybody else out of the way and get themselves to the front of the line - thus the importance of showing up "first" to some people.

I wonder why this was posted just as the Press conference with TMOT and Mr. Bundy was happening.

I think what bothers me most is ,, that this event was a net positive for the militia. And has put them (organized and unorganized) in a good light.
The Oath Keepers (organization) have been unfriendly toward the militia,, and seemed to be Trying to grab the limelight.. and push the militia out.

I was glad to see them show some support at first.. but am quite disappointed at their actions.

And there will never be a national or even State militia at this point,, because the feds have infiltrated every known and open group.

The Michigan Militia proved that very clearly with the Hutaree incident.

 

[Tod]

"Militia of one" comes to mind.

I can't say as I'm too crazy about the concept of consolidating militia groups. Seems like it would result in an authoritarian structure that would be susceptible to all sorts of abuses.

 

[Pericles]

"Militia of one" comes to mind.

I can't say as I'm too crazy about the concept of consolidating militia groups. Seems like it would result in an authoritarian structure that would be susceptible to all sorts of abuses.

Issue is that you have to sleep sometime, and when that happens, you are a target.

There are thousands of groups out there, which is the good news, the Feds can't infiltrate all of them because there are so many. The more effective Fed operations use social media sites to attract militia groups for social networking, and then laugh their asses off reading what all of the idiots post.

Groups crater, split and reform all of the time, as the members figure out that their leaders are incompetent, and then the next ambitious incompetent guy starts his own group... That is actually very useful, as the competent groups can hide in the middle of all that, and work on making themselves too big to fail.

If the Bundy ranch shows anything, it is that once you get big enough, you have some capability to frighten tyranny, which is a good thing. If get gets to slinging lead, the competent groups will emerge, and see the task to completion. Unfortunate part is that good patriots will end up dead via bad leadership, but it was ever thus.

 

[pcosmar]

Unfortunate part is that good patriots will end up dead via bad leadership, but it was ever thus.

Soldiers are always killed by bad leadership. Militia or otherwise. Sometime they are killed with good leadership.

In this case they won the day without firing a shot.. Mr. Bundy gives some praise at the end of the press conference today.

Had the BLM fired a shot they would have ALL been killed. They were in a near perfect (only God is perfect) kill zone,, with another group in reserve.

It was only after being informed of their precarious position that they made the decision to retreat.

No one is under the delusion that this is over.

 

[Pericles]

Soldiers are always killed by bad leadership. Militia or otherwise. Sometime they are killed with good leadership.

In this case they won the day without firing a shot.. Mr. Bundy gives some praise at the end of the press conference today.

Had the BLM fired a shot they would have ALL been killed. They were in a near perfect (only God is perfect) kill zone,, with another group in reserve.

It was only after being informed of their precarious position that they made the decision to retreat.

No one is under the delusion that this is over.

One of the reasons it is in the cureent situation it is has to do with poor leadership. A dynamic leader could have taken the release of the cattle as the opportunity to send a message - You guys are getting out alive and unharmed because we let you. This is now over and we are all going home. If you come back, or try to retaliate against anyone involved, we will be back and it will not end the way it did today. I wish you a good day.

Instead, there are guys out there trying to prolong the triumph and turn it into something it is not.

 

[pcosmar]

Info from a reporter that has been there all along,, and still is.

 

[pcosmar]

Instead, there are guys out there trying to prolong the triumph and turn it into something it is not.

Not really.
There is still an ongoing threat,,that has not been addressed. Though formal criminal charges were just filed against those who assaulted people in Nevada.
They were not disarmed,,and they were allowed to leave,,escorted by those that should have arrested them.

And there are direct threats against the defenders as well. They will stay as long as Mr. Bundy wishes it.

The Defenders are just that defending. They attacked no one. and did not press their advantage to do harm (for all the bullshit talk of them being hotheads)
They are there to defend the ranch and will remain as long as the ranch needs defending.

 

[pcosmar]

And that Eric C. Rahn guy is very wisely pulling out.

You have been trolled..
The original "Document" word for word,,exceptt the name at the bottom.. is from Bill Moss..
https://www.facebook.com/billmoss1960

And is full of lots of shit. including this,
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...711624.-2207520000.1399334077.&type=3&theater

Use caution who you get shit from.

There are people who troll for fun and there are Government Trolls.
There are a whole lot of fake Facebook pages.

 

[jllundqu]

This whole thing pisses me off. I think all parties involved, militia and OK, have totally screwed up what should have been a simple task... rally to the aid of Cliven Bundy. Now we have a bunch of ranger-wannabe chickenshits blaming eachother for random shit.

I have a much more disfavorable opinion of militia and OK after this.

Get your shit together, man.

Hell the cub scouts could have organized and responded better than this lot and with less egocentric bitching.

I consider myself an Oathkeeper (though not heavily involved) as a veteran and with my current employment and I'm a little embarrassed at what has gone down.

 

[Deborah K]

This whole thing pisses me off. I think all parties involved, militia and OK, have totally screwed up what should have been a simple task... rally to the aid of Cliven Bundy. Now we have a bunch of ranger-wannabe chickenshits blaming eachother for random shit.

I have a much more disfavorable opinion of militia and OK after this.

Get your shit together, man.

Hell the cub scouts could have organized and responded better than this lot and with less egocentric bitching.

I consider myself an Oathkeeper (though not heavily involved) as a veteran and with my current employment and I'm a little embarrassed at what has gone down.

What, specifically, has Stewart Rhodes done to warrant your opinion? I think he has handled this pretty well, considering his organization was falsely accused of theft, etc.

 

[jllundqu]

What, specifically, has Stewart Rhodes done to warrant your opinion? I think he has handled this pretty well, considering his organization was falsely accused of theft, etc.

Entertaining the ridiculous idea that the Eric Holder had authorized a drone strike against them, for one. I'm sorry, but when he came out and stated his 'credible source' told him of the impending drone strike and subsequent coverup, I had to laugh.

PM me if you'd like more info from my perspective...

 

[phill4paul]

What, specifically, has Stewart Rhodes done to warrant your opinion? I think he has handled this pretty well, considering his organization was falsely accused of theft, etc.

Deb, Rhodes took the intel concerning the possibility of a drone strike straight to the top. Ammon Bundy. It was decided, among the Bundy's and militia hierarchy, that this info was either a) errant or b) psyops. He was told to sit on this info unless he had better confirmation. He went ahead and disseminated the info anyway. And while I understand his allegiance to his own people and their safety if order is to be insured a chain of command must be adhered to.
Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it was right or wrong to do. A "damned if you, do damned if you don't" proposition if ever there was one. But, this is what set up the chain of events that followed.

 

[Carlybee]

From a non military layman perspective, given the fact that the government has labeled militia and basically anyone who bucks them as domestic terrorists and given the provisions of the Patriot Act, I can see where someone might give credence to a possible drone attack...because I would not put anything past the Feds. I watched Waco unfold on camera. I couldn't believe what they did knowing there were children in there and knowing what the outcome could be.

 

[Deborah K]

Deb, Rhodes took the intel concerning the possibility of a drone strike straight to the top. Ammon Bundy. It was decided, among the Bundy's and militia hierarchy, that this info was either a) errant or b) psyops. He was told to sit on this info unless he had better confirmation. He went ahead and disseminated the info anyway. And while I understand his allegiance to his own people and their safety if order is to be insured a chain of command must be adhered to.
Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it was right or wrong to do. A "damned if you, do damned if you don't" proposition if ever there was one. But, this is what set up the chain of events that followed.

How does it relate to the slanderous accusations that his org stole money and supplies? To tell you the truth, if I were him, and I trusted my source, I would have done the same thing. Not worth the risk.

 

[Deborah K]

Entertaining the ridiculous idea that the Eric Holder had authorized a drone strike against them, for one. I'm sorry, but when he came out and stated his 'credible source' told him of the impending drone strike and subsequent coverup, I had to laugh.

PM me if you'd like more info from my perspective...

He was duped. So was Bundy when he rambled on that clip that was supposedly 'stolen' and given to the MSM. I think it was dishonorable for Ryan to lie about his background and to falsely accuse the OKs of stealing. Rhodes made a mistake and trusted someone he shouldn't have, but he didn't do the other things he was accused of.

 

[pcosmar]

Why is it I don't trust "Bhudda?"

Interesting,, I wonder what you base that on.

Here is a short clip by PMbeers asking about the Racism accusation. "Booda" (or what ever his name is) has also been there from the start of this,,

 

[Deborah K]

From a non military layman perspective, given the fact that the government has labeled militia and basically anyone who bucks them as domestic terrorists and given the provisions of the Patriot Act, I can see where someone might give credence to a possible drone attack...because I would not put anything past the Feds. I watched Waco unfold on camera. I couldn't believe what they did knowing there were children in there and knowing what the outcome could be.

I find it odd that anyone would NOT consider that the fedgov is capable of anything. They shoot women in the head while holding their babies, and they burn women and children alive.

 

[ClydeCoulter]

What happened with this Jerry "the 9/12 guy" that tried to take control? That whole thing seems to have fallen off the radar.