What STEM Shortage? Sector Isn’t Seeing Wage Growth & More Graduates Than Jobs

[HOLLYWOOD]

What STEM Shortage? Sector Isn’t Seeing Wage Growth & More Graduates Than Jobs

All you hear about is Amnesty and Corporate Executives like Bill Gates and Marc Zuckerberg calling for even more increases of; H1B, H2C, foreign workers, even the US Chamber of Commerce spewing the same, as well as all of them pushing Amnesty of illegals in Americans. Well, four major think tanks/center through their studies, validate there is no shortage of STEM (science, technology, engineering, and mathematics.). As usual, the American people are being lied to by Corporate America as well as every level of bought, bribed, and paid for US government politicians. This come on today's bad news at one of America's largest high tech companies, Hewlett Packard. Horrible earnings numbers from HP, CEO Meg Whitman has announced additional cuts of up to 16,000 employees, bringing the total she has cut during her tenure at the Silicon Valley founded firm to 50,000!

See the article see the links to confirm the big lies we are told, telling Americans what to believe...


Additional Links: What STEM shortage? Electrical engineering lost 35,000 jobs last year
Is There a STEM Shortage? NOPE

IEEE: The STEM Crisis Is a Myth

Rand Corporation: Background: U.S. STEM Workforce Shows No Sign of Impending Shortages

May 20, 2014 4:00 AM

What STEM Shortage?
The sector isn’t seeing wage growth and has more graduates than jobs. By Steven Camarota

The idea that we need to allow in more workers with science, technology, engineering, and math (“STEM”) background is an article of faith among American business and political elite.
But in a new report, my Center for Immigration Studies colleague Karen Zeigler and I analyze the latest government data and find what other researchers have found: The country has well more than twice as many workers with STEM degrees as there are STEM jobs. Also consistent with other research, we find only modest levels of wage growth for such workers for more than a decade. Both employment and wage data indicate that such workers are not in short supply.
Reports by the Economic Policy Institute (EPI), the RAND Corporation, the Urban Institute, and the National Research Council have all found no evidence that STEM workers are in short supply. PBS even published an opinion piece based on the EPI study entitled, “The Bogus High-Tech Worker Shortage: How Guest Workers Lower U.S. Wages.” This is PBS, mind you, which is as likely to publish something skeptical of immigration as it is to publish something skeptical of taxpayer subsidies for the Corporation for Public Broadcasting.RAND’s analysis looked backward in time and found, “Despite recurring concerns about potential shortages of STEM personnel . . . we did not find evidence that such shortages have existed at least since 1990, nor that they are on the horizon.”
In an article entitled “The Science and Engineering Shortage Is a Myth” for the March issue of The Atlantic, demographer Michael Teitelbaum of Harvard Law School summarizes the literature on STEM. “No one has been able to find any evidence indicating current widespread labor market shortages or hiring difficulties in science and engineering occupations that require bachelor’s degrees or higher,” he points out. Teitelbaum is one of the nation’s leading experts on STEM employment, former vice president of the Sloan Foundation (a philanthropic institution essentially devoted to STEM education), and author of Falling Behind? Boom, Bust, and the Global Race for Scientific Talent, just published by Princeton University Press.
In looking at the latest government data available, my co-author and I found the following: In 2012, there were more than twice as many people with STEM degrees (immigrants and native-born) as there were STEM jobs — 5.3 million STEM jobs vs. 12.1 million people with STEM degrees. Only one-third of natives who have a STEM degree and have a job work in a STEM occupation. There are 1.5 million native-born Americans with engineering degrees not working as engineers, as well as half a million with technology degrees, 400,000 with math degrees, and 2.6 million with science degrees working outside their field. In addition, there are 1.2 million natives with STEM degrees who are not working.
Meanwhile, less than half of immigrants with STEM degrees work in STEM jobs. In particular, just 23 percent of all immigrants with engineering degrees work as engineers. Of the 700,000 immigrant STEM workers allowed into the country between 2007 and 2012, only one-third got a STEM job, about one-third got a non-STEM job, and about one-third are not working.
Wage trends are one of the best measures of labor demand. If STEM workers were in short supply, wages would be increasing rapidly. But wage data from multiple sources show little growth over the last 12 years. We found that real hourly wages (adjusted for inflation) grew on average just 0.7 percent a year from 2000 to 2012 for STEM workers, and annual wages grew even less — 0.4 percent a year. Wage growth is very modest for almost every category of STEM worker as well.
So if there is a superabundance of native and immigrant STEM workers and little wage growth, and STEM immigration already exceeds the absorption capacity of the STEM labor market, why are there calls to allow in even more? The answer, put simply, is greed and politics.
The businesses that want more immigration would get more workers to choose from, holding wages in check and increasing their bargaining power over their employees. What’s not to like? The Republicans listen to their corporate donors in Silicon Valley and elsewhere and respond by promising to increase STEM immigration even further.

 

[brandon]

Perhaps STEM is too broad of a field? People with BS degrees is bio have never really been in high demand.


I put my engineering resume online last month and literally get 10 to 20 unsolicited called from recruiters every single day. It's completely crazy. Intel just opened up shop in my area and are trying to hire 100 people by EOY. So I dunno, I think at least the "E" part of STEM is in very high demand.

 

[silverhandorder]

We are not making enough useful stem graduates. There are degrees in stem field that are completely useless and easy to get a degree in. This is where people run to. Besides after first couple of years of working it does not matter what degree you have.

 

[KingNothing]

From what I've seen, engineering firms can't find enough qualified people to fill vacancies. I absolutely believe there to be a shortage.

 

[PRB]

if there's no shortage of STEM, then there definitely isn't a shortage of any other workers, blue collar, white collar, accounting, lawyers, with possible exception of medical doctors.

 

[PRB]

From what I've seen, engineering firms can't find enough qualified people to fill vacancies. I absolutely believe there to be a shortage.

I think you're right, there may not be an overall shortage of all engineers, but there is a shortage of top notch, in demand, high skilled, high experienced engineers which big companies need.

 

[Danke]

 

[Zippyjuan]

Are those HP jobs being reduced management, IT,engineers, or manufacturing (I can't find more specifics so far)? Perhaps they are not STEM jobs. HP will still have over 300,000 employees even after this latest announced round of layoffs.

 

[PRB]

Are those HP jobs being reduced management, IT,engineers, or manufacturing (I can't find more specifics so far)? Perhaps they are not STEM jobs. HP will still have over 300,000 employees even after this latest announced round of layoffs.

Stupid question, are STEM jobs defined by whether the company's main purpose is STEM? or whether the actual job requires a STEM degree?

Like you said, if i work for HP or Google, but as a janitor, does that count?

 

[HOLLYWOOD]

Are those HP jobs being reduced management, IT,engineers, or manufacturing (I can't find more specifics so far)? Perhaps they are not STEM jobs. HP will still have over 300,000 employees even after this latest announced round of layoffs.

Better take your numbers up with CNBC & Bloomberg that conflict with what both reported yesterday, which HP had 250,000 employees worldwide, 350,000 last year (see here), before this announcement of cuts. So why doesn't the company retain all of its employees and just reduce their salaries by a certain percentage if the company has engineering demand, which reciprocates in marketing/sales? That is their end game anyway.

Think the economy and HP are booming? Hewlett Packard now has 11 consecutive quarters of losses... just call'em the JC Penny's of high tech


PS: My call to HP in Cupertino, CA confirmed, not only are they cutting in the western tech countries, they're shifting other head count to foreign locations, like Bangalore, India... giving the illusion there's more HP jobs in the US/CA, but are truly shifting to overseas head count.

 

[Zippyjuan]

Article from today: http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/...rd-ceo-meg-whitman-quarterly-results/9443279/

AN FRANCISCO — Hewlett-Packard is bracing to slash an additional 11,000 to 16,000 jobs after it announced a dip in revenue for its second quarter.

The computing giant, which is in the midst of a long restructuring program by CEO Meg Whitman, on Thursday said revenue was down 1%, to $27.3 billion, from the same quarter a year ago.

HP had previously announced plans to cut 34,000 jobs.

The company employs about 317,500 worldwide.

But your are right that the company has been struggling for a long time.

 

[HOLLYWOOD]

Article from today: http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/...rd-ceo-meg-whitman-quarterly-results/9443279/



But your are right that the company has been struggling for a long time.

Again, you better call business/stock reporting channels, Bloomberg, Reuters, and CNBC, tell them their ~250,000 HP employee count they posted on their channels yesterday are incorrect. It was actually Bloomberg that graphically posted the ~250,000 head count yesterday.

Here's the numbskull pump monkeys at CNBC bar chatter
http://www.cnbc.com/id/101693489

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/05/22/us-hp-results-idUSBREA4L12T20140522

 

[Zippyjuan]

A trifling point really. But here is Bloomberg:

The job cuts announced yesterday don’t reflect worsening demand for the company’s products, the CEO said on a conference call. Whitman said she doesn’t anticipate the need for further cuts. Hewlett-Packard had 317,500 employees at the end of October.

 

[HOLLYWOOD]

A trifling point really. But here is Bloomberg:

How many laidoff since then ZIP? BTW, Yesterday, May 22. 2014, Bloomberg posted on their feed, ~250,000 employees.

I stand by it, it was reported less than 24 hours ago on Bloomberg, as opposed to that 7 month ago figure, which we all know HP had huge layoffs by EOY 2013 and continued layoff into CY2014.

I'll get an even more detailed count with my contacts within HP when they get done finding the numbers.

 

[Brian4Liberty]

From what I've seen, engineering firms can't find enough qualified people to fill vacancies. I absolutely believe there to be a shortage.

Tell us more. What have you "seen"?

 

[Brian4Liberty]

Perhaps STEM is too broad of a field? People with BS degrees is bio have never really been in high demand.

I put my engineering resume online last month and literally get 10 to 20 unsolicited called from recruiters every single day. It's completely crazy. Intel just opened up shop in my area and are trying to hire 100 people by EOY. So I dunno, I think at least the "E" part of STEM is in very high demand.

Actual demand will vary greatly depending upon specialty and location. Did you get a new job? That's an important metric.

The problem in lumping everyone together is that their is more demand in some areas, and not in others. Zuckerberg, Gates, Ellison, etc. want programmers. Most H-1B visas are taken for that purpose. Other specialties may not have the connections to get any visas. Corporatism and favoritism.

And quite frankly, individual hiring managers want very specific things. Not all of those things are actually important for doing the work. Sometimes they want things that don't even exist. "Must have 3-5 years experience in XYZ (where XYZ has only existed for 2 years)". They refuse to hire a new grad, who may have to do even a minimal amount of learning on the job.

As a simplified analogy, it gets to the absurd level of "McDonald's cashier needed, must have 3-5 years experience on McDonald's cash registers and ordering system". Someone applies who has worked at Jack in the Box and Burger King on their registers, and McDonald's denies them and then claims that "we can't find qualified applicants".

 

[PRB]

Actual demand will vary greatly depending upon specialty and location. Did you get a new job? That's an important metric.

The problem in lumping everyone together is that their is more demand in some areas, and not in others. Zuckerberg, Gates, Ellison, etc. want programmers. Most H-1B visas are taken for that purpose. Other specialties may not have the connections to get any visas. Corporatism and favoritism.

And quite frankly, individual hiring managers want very specific things. Not all of those things are actually important for doing the work. Sometimes they want things that don't even exist. "Must have 3-5 years experience in XYZ (where XYZ has only existed for 2 years)". They refuse to hire a new grad, who may have to do even a minimal amount of learning on the job.

As a simplified analogy, it gets to the absurd level of "McDonald's cashier needed, must have 3-5 years experience on McDonald's cash registers and ordering system". Someone applies who has worked at Jack in the Box and Burger King on their registers, and McDonald's denies them and then claims that "we can't find qualified applicants".

How exactly will you find your 3-5 years on McDonald's (or Microsoft, Facebook equivalent) cash registers people overseas by giving them visas?

 

[Brian4Liberty]

How exactly will you find your 3-5 years on McDonald's (or Microsoft, Facebook equivalent) cash registers people overseas by giving them visas?

The unrealistic requirements go right out the window, and/or resumes are faked. The employer doesn't care, they just want the cheaper labor, everything else is just a lie.

 

[PRB]

The unrealistic requirements go right out the window, and/or resumes are faked. The employer doesn't care, they just want the cheaper labor, everything else is just a lie.

basically what you're saying is, employers want to hire foreigners, even when it's high skilled STEM because they're cheaper?

 

[LibForestPaul]

Tell us more. What have you "seen"?

There is no shortage. What the owners and club members in this land have found is that the non-euro blood over their is difficult to 'control'. They do not want to ask a farmer over there if they can borrow one of their oxen. They want the oxen, and they want it here. For them to beat themselves.