What does "Intelligent Design" even mean?

[Mitt Romneys sideburns]

Why do the creationists try to push philosophy into science? Every time a scientific question comes up, the first place they run is to the philosophers.

 

[Theocrat]

What Are You Afraid Of?

Theo, I've been far more open-minded about your links than is typical of my nature.

After watching about 5 videos of a guy claiming that it is impossible to say that no one has ever met a dinosaur since no one has asked Adam & Eve, I've gotten kinda tired of being told to watch your "evidence."

Patience and understanding are not my strong suits, so I'm gonna have to fall back on my tried and true irritability.

In other words, you don't want to deal with the possibility that there's serious evidence out there which proves intelligent design and goes against your superstition of Darwinian evolution. You do have blind faith.

 

[amy31416]

Yeah, I've actually watched some of them myself. Honestly, I can't take Theo seriously anymore and have come to the point where I think you must be a parody of those who are religious. It's just so silly after a while.

 

[Theocrat]

I'm Curious

Yeah, I've actually watched some of them myself. Honestly, I can't take Theo seriously anymore and have come to the point where I think you must be a parody of those who are religious. It's just so silly after a while.

What did you think of the videos you watched?

 

[sophocles07]

Does logic validate logic?

Think about it some more, pretty please.

O rock of ages!

In other words, you don't want to deal with the possibility that there's serious evidence out there which proves intelligent design and goes against your superstition of Darwinian evolution. You do have blind faith.

“Serious evidence”. To who? Carlos Mencia? You are a joke.

 

[DrYongrel]

In other words, you don't want to deal with the possibility that there's serious evidence out there which proves intelligent design and goes against your superstition of Darwinian evolution. You do have blind faith.

You have the astonishing ability to read "2+2" as "2-2." Bravo.

I have watched just about every video you have posted (that I have seen) in favor of ID/Creationism, and I have not been impressed.

There is no science, no research, no logic. The height of the arguments I have seen is that "Noah could have fit every kind of animal on the ark because a kind of animal is different than a species. Zebras and horses are the same kind of animal, so Noah would not have to bring both."

I have watched more informative commercials for sugared cereal.

 

[Mitt Romneys sideburns]

I notice ID pushers dont seem to want to use science, but rather they try to use philosophy and intuition.

Its like trying to complete the William Lowell Putnam Mathematical Competition without using any math.

 

[amy31416]

What did you think of the videos you watched?

I thought "Wow, the people who believe this must have never taken a science class."

 

[Theocrat]

Agree to Disagree

You have the astonishing ability to read "2+2" as "2-2." Bravo.

I have watched just about every video you have posted (that I have seen) in favor of ID/Creationism, and I have not been impressed.

There is no science, no research, no logic. The height of the arguments I have seen is that "Noah could have fit every kind of animal on the ark because a kind of animal is different than a species. Zebras and horses are the same kind of animal, so Noah would not have to bring both."

I have watched more informative commercials for sugared cereal.

You just disagree with the evidence, as I would disagree with the evidence presented for Darwinian evolution. If that's the case, then I have no more to say to you about this subject.

 

[Theocrat]

(lol)

I thought "Wow, the people who believe this must have never taken a science class."

Hmmm, that's funny because all of the presenters on the video have Doctor's degrees in various fields of the natural sciences. Somebody is just prejudiced...

 

[AutoDas]

The Bible is not evidence. Lol

 

[Theocrat]

Eyes and Evidence

I notice ID pushers dont seem to want to use science, but rather they try to use philosophy and intuition.

Its like trying to complete the William Lowell Putnam Mathematical Competition without using any math.

What are you talking about? Creationists/ID proponents use the very same methods of science, discovery, and evidence that antitheistic scientists use. It's just a matter of interpretation of the facts based on one's philosophical presuppositional worldview. That's the difference. Every scientist brings his own assumptions to the table when he performs scientific analysis. There is no neutrality in "doing science."

 

[Theocrat]

Uh...

The Bible is not evidence. Lol

Who mentioned anything about the Bible?

 

[sophocles07]

Beach-birds wander in sea tides; gay music; steps; beach-house; gay dude; dramatic blue; weird animal graphics; turbulent music; 80s drums; elephants tusking one another; law professor at Berkeley; butterfly; ‘complexity of life’; ‘simply chance and necessity’; ‘”something else”’; birds flying over crashing waves; more birds on the beach; Behe/’irreducible complexity’; bird in the sun on the beach; Darwin/etc; reptiles like a mufugger; finches; Southern Methodist University, 1992 (Behe speaking); molecules and guy w/glasses; hieroglyphics/i.e., what the fuck are you talking about; etc.; part 7 of 7, 3:08, the butterfly from part one; rationality, beauty, comprehensibility; birds over waves; calmed waves; ‘a formidable challenge’; buttcheeks galore; ‘growing number of scientists’; etc.

WOW. I’m FUCKING IMPRESSED. How about linking me to some scholarly articles on the subject, and not emotional drivel posted on a public video site. I”m talking Scientific, first-class journals.

You just disagree with the evidence, as I would disagree with the evidence presented for Darwinian evolution. If that's the case, then I have no more to say to you about this subject.

Stop talking like you know anything about ‘the evidence presented for Darwinian evolution’, it’s ridiculous—you act like you’re a fucking expert on the issue, when you’re pimping youtube videos about enormously complex issues (to which the videos give no answer).

 

[Theocrat]

Dig This

Beach-birds wander in sea tides; gay music; steps; beach-house; gay dude; dramatic blue; weird animal graphics; turbulent music; 80s drums; elephants tusking one another; law professor at Berkeley; butterfly; ‘complexity of life’; ‘simply chance and necessity’; ‘”something else”’; birds flying over crashing waves; more birds on the beach; Behe/’irreducible complexity’; bird in the sun on the beach; Darwin/etc; reptiles like a mufugger; finches; Southern Methodist University, 1992 (Behe speaking); molecules and guy w/glasses; hieroglyphics/i.e., what the fuck are you talking about; etc.; part 7 of 7, 3:08, the butterfly from part one; rationality, beauty, comprehensibility; birds over waves; calmed waves; ‘a formidable challenge’; buttcheeks galore; ‘growing number of scientists’; etc.

WOW. I’m FUCKING IMPRESSED. How about linking me to some scholarly articles on the subject, and not emotional drivel posted on a public video site. I”m talking Scientific, first-class journals.



Stop talking like you know anything about ‘the evidence presented for Darwinian evolution’, it’s ridiculous—you act like you’re a fucking expert on the issue, when you’re pimping youtube videos about enormously complex issues (to which the videos give no answer).

Opponents of Intelligent Design continue their highly scientific labor of trying to square the circle. Martin Cothran at the Discovery Institute has pointed out, with elegant understatement, that opponents of ID cannot have it both ways. They want to reject ID for two reasons, presumably with both of them equally important. First, because the claims made for ID are not falsifiable in principle, the approach cannot be considered science. Second, the central claims of ID have been found to be false. Heh.

 

[DrYongrel]

You just disagree with the evidence, as I would disagree with the evidence presented for Darwinian evolution. If that's the case, then I have no more to say to you about this subject.

What evidence?!

You posted a link to a lecture by Kent Hovind, which was ~9 parts. I had some free time, and was genuinely interested in the arguments presented. I went in with a relatively open mind. What was I greeted with? Insanity.

"The evolutionists have just really hyperactive imagination, I think they need Ritalin or something. But they are able to imagine all sorts of things, you know, the Earth has slowly cooled down. You do have to wonder why there would be an ice age if we are still cooling down, then global warming. "

"Sheep really aren't too bright and they absolutely require somebody to watch over them. They have a very low survival rate in the wild - they must be tended as you mentioned. It's a serious problem [for evolution] and you are right onto something there. "

"There have been human skeletons found in so called Cambrian rock."

"Sometimes .... people say you are not qualified to talk about a certain subject and then they will use the ad hominem argument "You can not discuss this because you have not been trained". Well, Columbus had no training and yet he proved the world was round."

"I say, you guys have to get two cells to evolve from the [primordial] soup - of the opposite sex, in the same place, at the same time. It's a big world, you know, cells are kind of small - they've got to find each other. "

"Charles Darwin said women bred the hair off of the men - because why aren't men as hairy as apes? - Darwin said women prefer less hairy men and so they were able to get more mating opportunities - Darwin said in The Descent of Man - what an idiot [sic] idea - then why don't the women have beards, Darwin?"

"I don't think the fossils are sorted in those layers they claim. All types of things are found in all types of layers."

"Why do men have nipples?" [...] Plus, I think if it was not designed this way we would probably have an incredibly higher rate of, you know, child pornography and child abuse and stuff like that. "

"There is about four or five [feathered dinosaurs] that have been found. They're all fake. They're coming from China. These Chinese guys who make 40 cents a year. [...] They're faking them. They spend years forging these things."

"There is zero proof of black holes. Now, if someone wants to believe in them that's fine. There is some evidence that can be interpreted that way, and maybe they do exist, I'm not saying they don't. I'm just saying there is no proof of them. So if somebody says there are black holes, the reason they are saying that, and they probably don't even know it, they are trying to rescue the Big Bang Theory because the Big Bang Theory would say if the matter expanded or blew out from the Big Bang it should be evenly distributed. There are billions of miles of nothing, then clumps of matter called galaxies. The real purpose behind the black hole idea is to rescue the Big Bang - to explain why there is the nothings between the somethings. "

"Every farmer on planet Earth counts on evolution not happening. They count on it. It doesn't happen. People can believe whatever they want but whenever a farmer crossbreeds a cow he expects to get a cow not a kitten."

"Do you know chimpanzees are still having babies? Why don't they make another human?"

"Teaching the pagan religion of evolutionism is a waste of valuable class time and textbook space. It is also one of the reasons American kids don't test as well in science as kids in other parts of the world. "

" There is definitely a conspiracy, but I don't think that it is a human conspiracy. I don't believe there is a smoke filled room where a group of men get together, and decide to teach evolution in all the schools. I believe that it is at a much higher level. I believe that it is a Satanic conspiracy. The reason these different people come to the same conclusion is not because they all met together; it is because they all work for the devil [sic]. He is their leader and they don't even know it. "

"The Smithsonian Institute [sic] has 33,000 sets of human remains in their basement right now as you are reading this. Many of them were taken while the people were still alive. They were so desperate to find missing links, so desperate to prove their theory that they murdered people to prove it. "

"If evolution is true, you could not know that it's true because your brain is nothing but chemicals. Think about that. "

""The Earth is billions of years old. The geologic column is the way to interpret it, and Charles Darwin's evolution is right." That is what they teach in order to be a good communist. Did you know that Russian teachers come to America to study education because the American educational system is considered the best in the world for teaching students these three principals. This prepares them to be good communists and to doubt the word of God. "



Theocrat, this is what you post links to, and this is why I don't take you seriously.

 

[Theocrat]

I Can't Make a Blind Man See

What evidence?!

You posted a link to a lecture by Kent Hovind, which was ~9 parts. I had some free time, and was genuinely interested in the arguments presented. I went in with a relatively open mind. What was I greeted with? Insanity.

"The evolutionists have just really hyperactive imagination, I think they need Ritalin or something. But they are able to imagine all sorts of things, you know, the Earth has slowly cooled down. You do have to wonder why there would be an ice age if we are still cooling down, then global warming. "

"Sheep really aren't too bright and they absolutely require somebody to watch over them. They have a very low survival rate in the wild - they must be tended as you mentioned. It's a serious problem [for evolution] and you are right onto something there. "

"There have been human skeletons found in so called Cambrian rock."

"Sometimes .... people say you are not qualified to talk about a certain subject and then they will use the ad hominem argument "You can not discuss this because you have not been trained". Well, Columbus had no training and yet he proved the world was round."

"I say, you guys have to get two cells to evolve from the [primordial] soup - of the opposite sex, in the same place, at the same time. It's a big world, you know, cells are kind of small - they've got to find each other. "

"Charles Darwin said women bred the hair off of the men - because why aren't men as hairy as apes? - Darwin said women prefer less hairy men and so they were able to get more mating opportunities - Darwin said in The Descent of Man - what an idiot [sic] idea - then why don't the women have beards, Darwin?"

"I don't think the fossils are sorted in those layers they claim. All types of things are found in all types of layers."

"Why do men have nipples?" [...] Plus, I think if it was not designed this way we would probably have an incredibly higher rate of, you know, child pornography and child abuse and stuff like that. "

"There is about four or five [feathered dinosaurs] that have been found. They're all fake. They're coming from China. These Chinese guys who make 40 cents a year. [...] They're faking them. They spend years forging these things."

"There is zero proof of black holes. Now, if someone wants to believe in them that's fine. There is some evidence that can be interpreted that way, and maybe they do exist, I'm not saying they don't. I'm just saying there is no proof of them. So if somebody says there are black holes, the reason they are saying that, and they probably don't even know it, they are trying to rescue the Big Bang Theory because the Big Bang Theory would say if the matter expanded or blew out from the Big Bang it should be evenly distributed. There are billions of miles of nothing, then clumps of matter called galaxies. The real purpose behind the black hole idea is to rescue the Big Bang - to explain why there is the nothings between the somethings. "

"Every farmer on planet Earth counts on evolution not happening. They count on it. It doesn't happen. People can believe whatever they want but whenever a farmer crossbreeds a cow he expects to get a cow not a kitten."

"Do you know chimpanzees are still having babies? Why don't they make another human?"

"Teaching the pagan religion of evolutionism is a waste of valuable class time and textbook space. It is also one of the reasons American kids don't test as well in science as kids in other parts of the world. "

" There is definitely a conspiracy, but I don't think that it is a human conspiracy. I don't believe there is a smoke filled room where a group of men get together, and decide to teach evolution in all the schools. I believe that it is at a much higher level. I believe that it is a Satanic conspiracy. The reason these different people come to the same conclusion is not because they all met together; it is because they all work for the devil [sic]. He is their leader and they don't even know it. "

"The Smithsonian Institute [sic] has 33,000 sets of human remains in their basement right now as you are reading this. Many of them were taken while the people were still alive. They were so desperate to find missing links, so desperate to prove their theory that they murdered people to prove it. "

"If evolution is true, you could not know that it's true because your brain is nothing but chemicals. Think about that. "

""The Earth is billions of years old. The geologic column is the way to interpret it, and Charles Darwin's evolution is right." That is what they teach in order to be a good communist. Did you know that Russian teachers come to America to study education because the American educational system is considered the best in the world for teaching students these three principals. This prepares them to be good communists and to doubt the word of God. "



Theocrat, this is what you post links to, and this is why I don't take you seriously.

That's why I said we're just going to have to agree to disagree.

 

[sophocles07]

That's why I said we're just going to have to agree to disagree.

Super-god, you're ridiculous.

 

[sophocles07]

You posted a link to a lecture by Kent Hovind, which was ~9 parts. I had some free time, and was genuinely interested in the arguments presented. I went in with a relatively open mind. What was I greeted with? Insanity.

Well, at least he's in prison now:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kent_Hovind#Sentencing.2C_appeal.2C_and_prison_life_in_2007

He gets out in 2015 though.

 

[amy31416]

Good post Yongrel. There seems to be a tradition of Lamarckian evolution being argued by those who believe in ID, rather than modern theories of evolution.

And none of them can explain C-14 dating of bones and various fossils.