pcosmar
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It does me too.
You need to understand that the media (news) is owned by the same people fomenting the wars, and stirring up the trouble.
Their spin on it is often NOT the whole truth.
What do you think of Mahmoud Ahmadinejad?
- Thread starter dillo
- Start date
It does me too.
You need to understand that the media (news) is owned by the same people fomenting the wars, and stirring up the trouble.
Their spin on it is often NOT the whole truth.
juleswin
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From my experience, pious Muslims generally support some form of Sharia. Mostly they want a self imposed version except when it comes to public dress codes (i.e women dressing in conservatively). Since they believe that it interferes with the daily practice of their religion, they will support a form of dress code for women. But usually the ones you see who are trying to impose all aspects of Sharia law on the masses are the Wahhabi. They are very fanatical, Saudi trained and violent types who are regularly opposed by regular Muslims. Those are the types you see burning churches, schools and govt buildings in Nigeria.
This is the best of my knowledge from living with Muslims in my youth, so any Muslim can feel free to correct me if am wrong with my assessment.
Sharia = Islam. Those two words can be used interchangeably. Some would like the government to enforce Sharia. Others would like the government to stay out of religious affairs. I consider myself to be of the latter.
No, Syria was accepting Iraqi refugees, some of which were Christian, due to the US-led war there. Now since there is an insurgency in Syria, the Christians are either stuck there or going back to Iraq. There haven't been any Christians driven out of Egypt and Libya, as far as I know. I also haven't heard of any Christians fleeing to Turkey, since Turkey is supporting the Syrian insurgency against the Christians there. I also haven't heard of any Christians fleeing to Iran due to the crisis in Syria.
Miss Annie
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I agree Pete,...... one of my greatest challenges is differentiating between truth and BS. The BS and propaganda is EVERYWHERE!
Even the sources that I once thought were good,..... I am now questioning. (AJ, WND, Drudge, etc..... ) They all seem to be shilling for one side or another.
Thanks for the explanations Juleswin and ExPat.
Much appreaciated!The crucial difference is that no one here is advocating the murder of Muslims, whereas you are advocating the murder of Christians in the name of religion.
Muwahid
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"Wahhabi" is basically a buzz-word that even U.S. politicians and pundits are picking up on. It's nothing more than a derogatory term for Salafi. The difference between Salafis and non-Salafis, are not that big in difference and almost always are in regard to theological aspects of Islam, and less to do with Shar'iah.
The major branches within Sunni Islam (the vast majority of Muslims, like 80%) can be watered down to two differences in philosophical reasoning, the Asharis, and the Salafis. The Salafis are a big minority, and are more hardline, but these differences generally wouldn't show when it comes to the outsider perspective (differences in the realm of "where is God", "anthropomorphism", and rationalization).
I have never heard of a large group of Muslims trying to impose something more than the norm of Shar'iah, Islam does have dress codes, they vary, but western countries do impose decency laws as well, you can't just go out naked in the street, we have a more strict interpretation of private parts in Islam. So in closing this stark differnce people try to make with "extremists" and "non-extremists" doesn't really exist, if you went as far as Osama Bin Ladens interpretation of Islam who most consider "extreme" it's nothing out of the ordinary, that's just a fact, but people don't sit and read up on his interpretation of Islam, or Boko Haram's for that matter, we see what's on TV and try our best to attribute it to a way of thinking that may not even exist in the real world.
There are extremists of course who say kill everyone! But they are shunned and loners generally, who are destined to be entrapped by the feds anyway, any large scale organization couldn't survive with a violent mentality because people, especially religiously inclined, want peace not war. There may be exceptions to this in poor obscure countries where education is poor of course, but we're talking in general.
Miss Annie, how on earth would Christians have survived in the Middle East, where Islam dominated for 1,400 years, if Muslims killed Christians? We did in fact see Christians trying to mass convert Muslims and Jews, and Natives, but this was almost exclusive to Christians at least because Islam tolerated Christians and Jews and even made pacts and peace agreements with Pagans forced conversions never happened and are explicitly forbidden in Islam.
I hear a lot of rhetoric on this forum that Saddam Hussein was protecting Christians, Bashar al Assad was protecting Christians, etc. etc. when shocks me is, where does all this slaughter of Christians come from in American's minds? Do you think any Majority Muslim country has a policy of eradicating Christians?! I personally walked through huge Christians communities in the Middle East, and saw Mosques and Churches nearly side-by-side! People have this idea that in Muslim countries other religions are eradicated and it's sad to hear that because Islam helped PRESERVE Christianity -- when Muslims ruled Jerusalem, the Churches and holy places were open to all religions, when CHRISTIANS took Jerusalem, our beloved al Aqsa mosque was used as a horse stable.
Here's a religious verdict from a "WAHHABI" Saudi Cleric Sheikh Ibn al Uthaymeen with regards to treatment of non-Muslims by Muslims:
The fact is Muslims have a obligation to protect peace loving non-Muslims within their borders. The prophet Muhammad (ص) said: ألا من ظلم معاهدا أو انتقصه أو كلفه فوق طاقته أو أخذ منه شيئا بغير طيب نفس فأنا حجيجه يوم القيامة (Translation: Whoever oppresses a Mu'ahhad (non-Muslims at peace with Muslims), or disparages him or burdens them, or takes something from him without permission, then I will be his opponent on the day of judgement).
So Christians fleeing places? How much do you want to bet that there are many more Muslims fleeing the same areas? It's called war, everyone flees, it doesn't means crazy Muzzies are beating them silly.
Apologies for the long post RPF'ers.
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Miss Annie
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I understand there is a battle going on for the minds and opinions of people..... the war is being fought in the media. I know a TON of it is BS.... but trying to sift and sort and figure out which ton is a daunting task. Here is an example of where the "information" is coming from - that muslims hate Christians. This is even on Drudge right now.....
http://www.wnd.com/2012/08/arab-spring-run-amok-brotherhood-starts-crucifixions/
http://www.wnd.com/2012/08/arab-spring-run-amok-brotherhood-starts-crucifixions/
DerailingDaTrain
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Am I the only one who doesn't like ExPatPaki? He is really getting on my nerves with this BS.
pcosmar
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So what.
I know of no requirement to like him.
Frankly, you and a few others get on my nerves.
DerailingDaTrain
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I get on your nerves? I'm not carrying water for a hellhole that murders it's own citizens for minor offenses. He's acting like Iran is some great place that has no problems and the US is such a horrible place to live. It's BS and his talk of killing people who convert to another religion doesn't sound to good either. Is he even a RP supporter? He doesn't sound very liberty minded to me.
Sharia sounds really awesome! /sarcasm
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pcosmar
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No worse than the Israel apologists.
Or those that justify what we have done to Iraq and Afghanistan.
Or those that go on and on about the Hostage crisis by never mention Savak or the overthrow that installed the Shaw.
Seems to me he brings a balance.
And no,, I don't always agree with him,, but appreciate the perspective.
PierzStyx
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I don't have a problem with Mousavi being involved in the Lebanon attacks. US troops should have never been there. We reaped the just deserts for our interventionism.
Election fraud apparently isn't unheard of since Mousavi was cheated. Why is it that its so hard for you to believe dishonest authoritarians also exist in the Middle East? Stop being so reactionary. Ahmadinejad and the Supreme Leader are both complete authoritarians.They have no interest or desire in granting anymore liberties to the people. The same kind of authoritarian interests that work against those who would fight to restore the people's lost liberty here also fight against it in Iran as well.
As for having Mousavi not being the supreme Head of Government, you are right. But neither is our President. Yet would you rather have Obama or Ron Paul as the next President? I know I'd rather have Paul because he at least he would fight for greater restored liberties and against further seizure of liberty from the people. Mousavi would do the same.
PierzStyx
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Apparently you haven't been here long enough to learn that whenever someone says something they don't like some around here immediately label them part of the "global conspiracy." Its an irrational faith requiring no proof.
Ender
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What? You only like your version of the truth? He has had some experience that can help all of us understand this mess.
DerailingDaTrain
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Yep. That's exactly what I'm saying.
Did I say anything about his experiences? I'm talking about him saying it's fine to murder people who convert to another religion, his lies about Iran, and the messed up stuff he is advocating.
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showpan
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A little more history that is long overlooked.
First of all, there are different types of Jews. The actual Jews who lived peacefully with Palestinians and Arabs for centuries are in fact persecuted today by the communist, atheist Jews who have claimed the land for their own this century. A simple search would go a long way to understanding what has happened in the last 100 years or so.
On Nov. 4, 2003, Reinhard Günzel, a brigadier general, who was head of Germany's Special Forces (KSK), was given a "dishonourable" discharge from the army's services. He was fired because he wrote a letter to Martin Hohmann (MP, CDU), who recently went on record about the Jewish role in Bolshevik Russia; and the General applauded Mr. Hohmann's statements.
Hohmann then made this known to the press, who in turn had a field day.
However, there is one thing that the press mysteriously overlooks. What was said is true.
Isn't it almost "funny" how the TRUTH has become anti-Semitic. I mean, it's an actual FACT here that we're talking about: Jews were behind the Russian revolution. This is not some outlandish statement. It should not be considered anti-Semitic, yet it is.
Jews openly bragged about the Russian revolution and its aftereffects at the time. They gloated. They were the financiers--from Warburg to Jacob Schiff (whose great-grand son recently married Al Gore's daughter, oddly enough). They were the revolutionaries--from Apfelbaum, to Zinoviev, to Molotov, to Trotsky (Bronstein), to Lenin (Ulyanov), etc. They were the bloodthirsty horde in the NKVD who later became the KGB, led by Kaganovich and Berija, who were responsible for liquidating untold millions of innocent Russians, Ukrainians, Hungarians etc.
And, now Jews say, "Who, us? No, Jews had nothing to do with it. You're just anti-Semitic for saying such things."
Even those Jews who might still be alive and who took part in the massacres afterward now deny the massacres had anything to do with Jews. Even though anti-Semitism became a crime punishable by death after the Russian revolution, Jews now say that they were "persecuted." Even though the churches burned while the synagogues were left standing, Jews deny that they were protected. Even though priests were murdered or forced to sweep the streets, while rabbis were put on a pedestal, Jews now say they were the ones persecuted.
There is only one thing that we can conclude from all this: Truth is anti-Semitic.
http://globalfire.tv/nj/03en/jews/perpetrators1.htm
The Execution of
Tsar Nicholas II, 1918
http://www.eyewitnesstohistory.com/nicholas.htm
Winston Churchill described the tumultuous years between 1918 and 1933 as a period of 'formidable transformations'. Germany, defeated in a war not of its own making, was laid prostrate by defeat, revolution and anarchy. Communist revolutionaries eager to capitalise on their overthrow of the Russian state seized power. A British Government White Paper estimated that the Royal Navy's blockade on Germany "caused nearly 800,000 deaths, mainly women and children." Vast tracts of German territory were seized as booty and claims for reparations were so draconian that they effectively turned every German into a slave of the victors.
With the Kaiser (king) in exile, the Workers and Soldiers' Soviets and the Social Democrats 'dismissed' the legitimate Ebert government and proclaimed a Soviet Republic. Armed bands of communists (Spartacists) led by Rosa Luxemburg and Karl Liebnecht, patrolled the streets. In Bavaria, another Jew, Kurt Eisner had declared the province a Soviet Republic. Soldiers returning from the front were massacred, revolutionaries seized state property and strikes designed to cause maximum damage to the staggering economy were organised. Barracks and naval dockyards were seized and street barricades divided Germany's cities and towns into politico-criminal fiefdoms.
The French occupied the Rhineland and ruled with an iron fist. An ordinary German passer-by might be randomly picked out and smashed to the ground with a rifle butt or fist. The French attempt to separate Bavaria from Germany sparked Adolf Hitler's brave but futile November Putsch.
The Saar and the Rhineland were occupied by French troops; inflation soared out of control until there were 136,000,000 Deutsch Marks to the dollar. Decadence erupted in sleaze. Art was debased as were the German people. Child prostitutes of both sexes could be bought openly on the streets. The world's debased were quick to take advantage of the German nation's descent into the economic chaos of defeat and revolutionaries fought like jackals for the territorial remains.
The peace terms (Versailles Treaty); dictated by the victor nations and notorious for its monstrously unjust nature was heaped upon this volcanic social upheaval.
"The greater part of our troubles is the result of World War I and the bad treaties which ended it." (Alfonso of Bourbon and Orleans. Great Grandson of Queen Victoria)
"Germany suffered most as a consequence of this Peace Treaty and the general insecurity which was bound to arise from it. The unemployment figures rose to a third of the number usually employed in the nation, which means, however, that by counting the families of the unemployed as well there were 26 million people in Germany out of a population of 65 millions faced by an absolutely hopeless future." (Adolf Hitler)
In Russia, the Bolsheviks had seized power. The geographical giant on Germany's eastern borders was locked into civil war, the brutality of which knew no bounds. The tentacles of the emerging internationalism of Communism were spreading like wildfire throughout Europe.
"Germany, with more than 6 million communists was on the verge of a catastrophe which none but those wanting in common sense can possibly ignore. If red terrorism was to have swept over Germany the western countries of Europe would probably also have realised that it is not a matter of indifference to them whether the outposts of a destructive Asian world power stand guard on the Rhine and on the North Sea, or whether the land is populated by peaceful German peasants and working men whose only wish is to make an honest living and to be on friendly terms with other nations. By averting this disaster which was threatening to ruin Germany, the National Socialist movement saved not only the German people, but also rendered the rest of Europe a service of historical merit. The National Socialist revolution has but one aim; To restore order in our own country, to provide work and bread for our starving masses and to lay down the ideas of honour, loyalty and decency as being the basis of our moral code, which, far from doing harm to other nations, can be for the benefit of all." (Adolf Hitler)
http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/witness1.htm#3
First of all, there are different types of Jews. The actual Jews who lived peacefully with Palestinians and Arabs for centuries are in fact persecuted today by the communist, atheist Jews who have claimed the land for their own this century. A simple search would go a long way to understanding what has happened in the last 100 years or so.
On Nov. 4, 2003, Reinhard Günzel, a brigadier general, who was head of Germany's Special Forces (KSK), was given a "dishonourable" discharge from the army's services. He was fired because he wrote a letter to Martin Hohmann (MP, CDU), who recently went on record about the Jewish role in Bolshevik Russia; and the General applauded Mr. Hohmann's statements.
Hohmann then made this known to the press, who in turn had a field day.
However, there is one thing that the press mysteriously overlooks. What was said is true.
Isn't it almost "funny" how the TRUTH has become anti-Semitic. I mean, it's an actual FACT here that we're talking about: Jews were behind the Russian revolution. This is not some outlandish statement. It should not be considered anti-Semitic, yet it is.
Jews openly bragged about the Russian revolution and its aftereffects at the time. They gloated. They were the financiers--from Warburg to Jacob Schiff (whose great-grand son recently married Al Gore's daughter, oddly enough). They were the revolutionaries--from Apfelbaum, to Zinoviev, to Molotov, to Trotsky (Bronstein), to Lenin (Ulyanov), etc. They were the bloodthirsty horde in the NKVD who later became the KGB, led by Kaganovich and Berija, who were responsible for liquidating untold millions of innocent Russians, Ukrainians, Hungarians etc.
And, now Jews say, "Who, us? No, Jews had nothing to do with it. You're just anti-Semitic for saying such things."
Even those Jews who might still be alive and who took part in the massacres afterward now deny the massacres had anything to do with Jews. Even though anti-Semitism became a crime punishable by death after the Russian revolution, Jews now say that they were "persecuted." Even though the churches burned while the synagogues were left standing, Jews deny that they were protected. Even though priests were murdered or forced to sweep the streets, while rabbis were put on a pedestal, Jews now say they were the ones persecuted.
There is only one thing that we can conclude from all this: Truth is anti-Semitic.
http://globalfire.tv/nj/03en/jews/perpetrators1.htm
The Execution of
Tsar Nicholas II, 1918
http://www.eyewitnesstohistory.com/nicholas.htm
Winston Churchill described the tumultuous years between 1918 and 1933 as a period of 'formidable transformations'. Germany, defeated in a war not of its own making, was laid prostrate by defeat, revolution and anarchy. Communist revolutionaries eager to capitalise on their overthrow of the Russian state seized power. A British Government White Paper estimated that the Royal Navy's blockade on Germany "caused nearly 800,000 deaths, mainly women and children." Vast tracts of German territory were seized as booty and claims for reparations were so draconian that they effectively turned every German into a slave of the victors.
With the Kaiser (king) in exile, the Workers and Soldiers' Soviets and the Social Democrats 'dismissed' the legitimate Ebert government and proclaimed a Soviet Republic. Armed bands of communists (Spartacists) led by Rosa Luxemburg and Karl Liebnecht, patrolled the streets. In Bavaria, another Jew, Kurt Eisner had declared the province a Soviet Republic. Soldiers returning from the front were massacred, revolutionaries seized state property and strikes designed to cause maximum damage to the staggering economy were organised. Barracks and naval dockyards were seized and street barricades divided Germany's cities and towns into politico-criminal fiefdoms.
The French occupied the Rhineland and ruled with an iron fist. An ordinary German passer-by might be randomly picked out and smashed to the ground with a rifle butt or fist. The French attempt to separate Bavaria from Germany sparked Adolf Hitler's brave but futile November Putsch.
The Saar and the Rhineland were occupied by French troops; inflation soared out of control until there were 136,000,000 Deutsch Marks to the dollar. Decadence erupted in sleaze. Art was debased as were the German people. Child prostitutes of both sexes could be bought openly on the streets. The world's debased were quick to take advantage of the German nation's descent into the economic chaos of defeat and revolutionaries fought like jackals for the territorial remains.
The peace terms (Versailles Treaty); dictated by the victor nations and notorious for its monstrously unjust nature was heaped upon this volcanic social upheaval.
"The greater part of our troubles is the result of World War I and the bad treaties which ended it." (Alfonso of Bourbon and Orleans. Great Grandson of Queen Victoria)
"Germany suffered most as a consequence of this Peace Treaty and the general insecurity which was bound to arise from it. The unemployment figures rose to a third of the number usually employed in the nation, which means, however, that by counting the families of the unemployed as well there were 26 million people in Germany out of a population of 65 millions faced by an absolutely hopeless future." (Adolf Hitler)
In Russia, the Bolsheviks had seized power. The geographical giant on Germany's eastern borders was locked into civil war, the brutality of which knew no bounds. The tentacles of the emerging internationalism of Communism were spreading like wildfire throughout Europe.
"Germany, with more than 6 million communists was on the verge of a catastrophe which none but those wanting in common sense can possibly ignore. If red terrorism was to have swept over Germany the western countries of Europe would probably also have realised that it is not a matter of indifference to them whether the outposts of a destructive Asian world power stand guard on the Rhine and on the North Sea, or whether the land is populated by peaceful German peasants and working men whose only wish is to make an honest living and to be on friendly terms with other nations. By averting this disaster which was threatening to ruin Germany, the National Socialist movement saved not only the German people, but also rendered the rest of Europe a service of historical merit. The National Socialist revolution has but one aim; To restore order in our own country, to provide work and bread for our starving masses and to lay down the ideas of honour, loyalty and decency as being the basis of our moral code, which, far from doing harm to other nations, can be for the benefit of all." (Adolf Hitler)
http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/witness1.htm#3
Barrex
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PierzStyx
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Iran is only blockaded to America, because we blockade them. You can get an Iranian passport through Europe. It is just a real hassle.
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