Vitamins to be outlawed?

[MalcolmGandi]

So, apparently, CODEX is supposed to go into effect Dec 31, 2009, part of it being the labeling of vitamins and other natural substances as toxins, making them only available by prescription. My question is, what do you think would be the public's reaction if they attempted to actually do this?

 

[amy31416]

Not gonna happen.

 

[mizrae]

FDA "Harmonizing" Health Care with Mexico & Canada

According to the FDA's own website: Trilateral Cooperation Charter

It would appear as if these changes are already in the works!

 

[american.swan]

According to the FDA's own website: Trilateral Cooperation Charter

It would appear as if these changes are already in the works!

Great website....now could you direct me where it says vitamins are going to be "outlawed" in that document?

Secondly, research shows over the counter vitamins don't keep you from getting sick and doesn't extend your life as far as I know.

 

[IPSecure]

We can all obtain prescriptions from Dr. Paul...

 

[mizrae]

Canadian Bill C-51

I guess many don't know about this bill:


On April 8th, 2008, the Canadian Minister of Health introduced Bill C-51 into the House of Commons. This Bill proposes significant changes to the current Food and Drugs Act that will have wide-ranging negative implications for Canadians.

Bill C-51 will:

· Remove democratic oversight, bypassing elected officials to vote in laws and allow bureaucrats to adopt laws from other countries without our consent.

· Remove 70% of Natural Health Products from Canadians and many others will be available by prescription only.

· Restrict research and development of safe natural alternatives in favor of high risk drugs.

· Punish Canadians with little or no opportunity for protection or recourse for simply speaking about or giving a natural product without the approval of government. More than 70% of people in Canada use a Natural Health Product. The new law goes so far as to warrant action against a person who would give another person an “unapproved” amount of garlic on the recommendation that it would improve that person’s health.

Since both the U.S. and Canada have gone to great lengths to change the labels and such on our natural food products, this bill is alarming in its implication. Now if this bill passes in Canada and the FDA is promoting a health union between Mexico, Canada and the United States; I believe it's just a matter of time before the United States government tries the same thing.

This is all stemming from Codex Alimentarius out of the EU. Codex says vitamins are "drugs" and therefore need to be regulated. Go to this website, Natural Solutions, for a more in-depth history and understanding about what's really going on with these new "health" reulations.

 

[azygous420]

Damn it the FDA never helps anyone it just denies safe drugs and approves ones that kill us.

 

[Dr.3D]

Secondly, research shows over the counter vitamins don't keep you from getting sick and doesn't extend your life as far as I know.

An introduction to Linus Pauling.
He is considered the father of molecular biology.
Linus Pauling

Linus Pauling on Vitamin C.
Preventing Illnesses and Diseases with Vitamin C

 

[Agent CSL]

This is alarming and would put my aunt's thriving natural and organic food store out of business. Half her store is vitamins and organic herbs packaged.

 

[american.swan]

Linus Pauling on Vitamin C.
Preventing Illnesses and Diseases with Vitamin C

That is a funny video. I like his sense of humor. I don't like his evolutionary rational, but if we ate as much fruit and veges as we are supposed to I am sure we would intake a vastly more vitamins than we do now. Making us more healthy. Maybe my statement is correct. Vitamins and over the counter minerals don't make us "healthier" because we don't take enough of them according to this dude.

 

[freelance]

CODEX has been ongoing for years--at least as far back as the late 80s. Life Extension and the usual suspects are trying to fight it, but this looks like it may be the last stand.

They're going to use no-search/no-knock warrants to check our computers for MP3s, etc. and our homes for supplements.

See my sigline. The time is drawing near.

 

[Truth-Bringer]

research shows over the counter vitamins don't keep you from getting sick and doesn't extend your life as far as I know.

Research from who? Who's funding the research?

If people want to take vitamins, it's their right to take vitamins. The synthetic vitamins don't do you much good, but whole food vitamins have helped me greatly. Standard Process is the best.

 

[Truth-Bringer]

Damn it the FDA never helps anyone it just denies safe drugs and approves ones that kill us.

Absolutely true. The FDA harms our health in the final equation.

 

[Truth-Bringer]

An introduction to Linus Pauling.
He is considered the father of molecular biology.
Linus Pauling

Linus Pauling on Vitamin C.
Preventing Illnesses and Diseases with Vitamin C

Right - Klenner proved that megadoses of Vitamin C would cure many, many illnesses. Why was his research suppressed or ignored? BECAUSE VITAMIN C CANNOT BE PATENTED. Therefore, the greedy demons in the pharmaceutical companies (who are behind much of this CODEX tyranny) cannot patent it and jack the price up %1,000.

 

[amy31416]

An introduction to Linus Pauling.
He is considered the father of molecular biology.
Linus Pauling

Linus Pauling on Vitamin C.
Preventing Illnesses and Diseases with Vitamin C

I put off nitpicking on a few things:

1. Linus Pauling is not considered the father of molecular biology, Max Perutz is.

2. Pauling's research on vitamin C is still considered controversial. Paulings area of expertise is x-ray crystallography, and I'm not saying that he's wrong on vitamin C, but he may not be right either.

3. While you may think I'm just a naysayer, the Merck Manual of medical information and Scientific American Medical Reference state that doses over 1,000 mg/day can cause diarrhea and kidney stones.

4. Megadosing on a water-soluble vitamin is a waste of money as the majority of it will be run through your kidneys and be excreted in your urine. Megadosing on a fat-soluble one can have much worse consequences, so at least it's not as bad as that.

Just felt the need to have a little balance in the thread on this topic.

 

[Dr.3D]

I put off nitpicking on a few things:

1. Linus Pauling is not considered the father of molecular biology, Max Perutz is.

Ok, I should have said a founding father of molecular biology.

http://profiles.nlm.nih.gov/MM/Views/Exhibit/narrative/biomolecules.html
7th paragraph.

Pauling's strategic approach to his research, as well as his specific discoveries, established him as a founding father of molecular biology. First, he worked to understand the structures of the subunits that make up the larger molecules. Then he determined how they could link together. He used the basic rules of chemistry and physics to limit and guide his hypotheses. Finally, he built models to test and elaborate his ideas. By using this approach, Pauling was able to make fundamental advances in determining the shapes of biomolecules, and this achievement then allowed him to investigate how chemical structure determines biological function.

http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/lpbio/lpbio2.html
Third paragraph.

In addition to the general recognition as one of the two greatest scientists of the 20th century, he was usually acknowledged by his colleagues as the most influential chemist since Lavoisier, the 18th-century founder of the modern science of chemistry. His introductory textbook General Chemistry, revised three times since its first printing in 1947 and translated into 13 languages, has been used by generations of undergraduates. After Pauling entered the field of chemistry as a professional in the mid-1920s, his work, grounded in physics, has affected the work of every chemist. He is also often considered the founding father of molecular biology, which has transformed the biological sciences and medicine and provided the base for biotechnology.

http://ffrf.org/day/?day=28&month=2
Second article.

On this date in 1901, Linus Pauling was born in Portland, Ore. A popular figure, peace activist, humanitarian as well as scientist, Pauling is the only person to receive two unshared Nobel Prizes: Chemistry (1954) and Peace (1962). He earned a degree in chemical engineering in 1922, and received his Ph.D from Caltec in 1925 in chemistry, with minors in physics and math. Pauling joined the Caltech faculty in 1927. His interest lay in the field of molecular structure and the nature of the chemical bond. He is considered the founding father of molecular biology. But his research was interdisciplinary, including human physiology and health (he is famed for recommending oral doses of Vitamin C). "The only sane policy for the world is that of abolishing war," Pauling said in accepting the Nobel Prize for Peace for 1962. The award recognized his 6-year campaign to persuade the United States, Great Britain and the USSR to sign an antitesting treaty. Minimizing suffering was the key to ethics, he believed. He was named Humanist of the Year by the American Humanist Association in 1961. The unorthodox and outspoken scientist was a Unitarian for many years. D. 1994.

2. Pauling's research on vitamin C is still considered controversial. Paulings area of expertise is x-ray crystallography, and I'm not saying that he's wrong on vitamin C, but he may not be right either.

3. While you may think I'm just a naysayer, the Merck Manual of medical information and Scientific American Medical Reference state that doses over 1,000 mg/day can cause diarrhea and kidney stones.

I have been taking 16g of Ascorbic acid a day for the past 15 years. My physician says it is just fine for me to do so. One must work up slowly to keep from getting diarrhea. It is called adjusting intake to bowel tolerance. Also, one must not abruptly stop taking vitamin C because of the increased release of the substance from the body through the kidneys. Abruptly stopping can cause the body to react as if it had scurvy. One must slowly drop the dosage rather than stop abruptly.

The following article refutes the claim of increased chances of kidney stones.
http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/f-w99/kidneystones.html

4. Megadosing on a water-soluble vitamin is a waste of money as the majority of it will be run through your kidneys and be excreted in your urine. Megadosing on a fat-soluble one can have much worse consequences, so at least it's not as bad as that.

Just felt the need to have a little balance in the thread on this topic.

The reason there is no known toxicity for Vitamin C is just that... what is not needed will simply be passed out of the body through the kidneys.

I fully agree mega dosing with fat soluble vitamins can have tragic consequences. Vitamin A for instance can cause serious liver damage, if taken in excess.

 

[amy31416]

I have been taking 16g of Ascorbic acid a day for the past 15 years. My physician says it is just fine for me to do so. One must work up slowly to keep from getting diarrhea. It is called adjusting intake to bowel tolerance. Also, one must not abruptly stop taking vitamin C because of the increased release of the substance from the body through the kidneys. Abruptly stopping can cause the body to react as if it had scurvy. One must slowly drop the dosage rather than stop abruptly.

The following article refutes the claim of increased chances of kidney stones.
http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/f-w99/kidneystones.html



The reason there is no known toxicity for Vitamin C is just that... what is not needed will simply be passed out of the body through the kidneys.

I fully agree mega dosing with fat soluble vitamins can have tragic consequences. Vitamin A for instance can cause serious liver damage, if taken in excess.

Thanks for all the info, I just think it's possibly dangerous and wasteful to start megadosing on things, without knowing the facts first. And thanks for posting the consequences of stopping massive doses abruptly as well, I'd read that and it's not pleasant. The only thing I'll say about the potential of kidney stones is that I have it from Merck and Scientific American, your source is from the Linus Pauling institute and they just might be biased. So, do the homework and look at multiple sources.

So, considering that the vitamin not needed will just be excreted with the urine, what's the point in taking so much that a lot of it is excreted this way? Are there any studies that show just how much is taken in and how much is excreted? I'd think that's a reasonable approximation of how much a person should be taking.

As I've said before though, wouldn't it make more sense to take small doses more frequently? One massive dose at one time seems an inefficient and wasteful way to take it.

 

[Dr.3D]

Thanks for all the info, I just think it's possibly dangerous and wasteful to start megadosing on things, without knowing the facts first. And thanks for posting the consequences of stopping massive doses abruptly as well, I'd read that and it's not pleasant. The only thing I'll say about the potential of kidney stones is that I have it from Merck and Scientific American, your source is from the Linus Pauling institute and they just might be biased. So, do the homework and look at multiple sources.

So, considering that the vitamin not needed will just be excreted with the urine, what's the point in taking so much that a lot of it is excreted this way? Are there any studies that show just how much is taken in and how much is excreted? I'd think that's a reasonable approximation of how much a person should be taking.

As I've said before though, wouldn't it make more sense to take small doses more frequently? One massive dose at one time seems an inefficient and wasteful way to take it.

The need for vitamin C changes as stress on the body changes. One never knows exactly how much is needed on any given day.

I agree there needs to me more research done as to the optimal dosage of vitamin C. The major problem is, who is going to pay for the research when there are so many drug companies who would rather make money from the patent drugs they make? Regular cholesterol is not what causes heart disease. Lipoprotein(a) cholesterol is what really causes heart disease. When there is damage to the arterial wall and a lack of collagen to repair the damage, the Lp(a) acts as a surrogate to repair the damage.

In a damaged arterial wall, there are exposed lysine and proline residues where the Lp(a) finds binding sites. When Lp(a) is already bound with lysine and proline, the binding sites on the arterial wall are no longer needed because the Lp(a) already has all of it's binding sites filled. The extra vitamin C is converted to collagen and the wall of the artery is repaired.

More can be found on this subject at this web site: http://www.healthvision2020.com/heartdisease.html

I take four grams of vitamin C, four times a day. I also take two grams of L-Lysine and 500 mg of L- Proline whenever I take the vitamin C.

 

[amy31416]

The need for vitamin C changes as stress on the body changes. One never knows exactly how much is needed on any given day.

I agree there needs to me more research done as to the optimal dosage of vitamin C. The major problem is, who is going to pay for the research when there are so many drug companies who would rather make money from the patent drugs they make? Regular cholesterol is not what causes heart disease. Lipoprotein(a) cholesterol is what really causes heart disease. When there is damage to the arterial wall and a lack of collagen to repair the damage, the Lp(a) acts as a surrogate to repair the damage.

In a damaged arterial wall, there are exposed lysine and proline residues where the Lp(a) finds binding sites. When Lp(a) is already bound with lysine and proline, the binding sites on the arterial wall are no longer needed because the Lp(a) already has all of it's binding sites filled. The extra vitamin C is converted to collagen and the wall of the artery is repaired.

More can be found on this subject at this web site: http://www.healthvision2020.com/heartdisease.html

I take four grams of vitamin C, four times a day. I also take two grams of L-Lysine and 500 mg of L- Proline whenever I take the vitamin C.

Interesting.

I'd think it wouldn't be too difficult of a study to perform to see how much vitamin C is actually used by the body at different ages. I'm surprised the Linus Pauling Institute hasn't done this sort of research yet.

I'd be interested in the results. If I find anything I'll share.

 

[Dr.3D]

A bit more on kidney stone formation and vitamin C.

Interesting.

I'd think it wouldn't be too difficult of a study to perform to see how much vitamin C is actually used by the body at different ages. I'm surprised the Linus Pauling Institute hasn't done this sort of research yet.

I'd be interested in the results. If I find anything I'll share.

Here are the results I found for the past 30 minutes.
This deals mostly with kidney stone formation.

http://www.orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v01n07.shtml
http://www.orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v02n02.shtml
http://www.yourhealthbase.com/database/a90d.htm
http://www.article-buzz.com/Article/Kidney-Stones-and-Vitamin-C/153676
http://www.1888articles.com/excess-...of-vitamin-c-in-kidney-stones-0371cz63po.html
http://www.drdillard.com/QA3.aspx?c=article&id=3
http://www.beloit.edu/~nutritio/vitCdose.htm
http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/infocenter/vitamins/vitaminC/

Just thought I would share a little.