Unofficial Trump/Biden 9/29 debate thread.

[phill4paul]

Yeah, I know...but I have a case of Negro Fatigue so bad now it is damn near fatal.

I do not care what the coloreds think or want or what their grievance du jour is any longer.

Same. Luckily there are many examples, at least in my state, where blacks are tired of the Democrat plantation and embrace Conservative principles. Shall I use the word "bigly?" I'm not joking here. Discussions here and there, and sources and print media regarding black collectives like the Frederick Douglas Foundation, The Urban Conservative, Black Conservative Voices, and Black Voters Matter in N.C. all signal they are done being treated as victims.

 

[Aratus]

I couldn't sit through that fiasco, didn't even try.

Who said what about forest cities?

Trump did. In Europe, which is more densely populated than our Great Plains as a rough rule of thumb,
"urban" planning involves structuring suburbia so it only slightly intrudes into the woods and forests that
have been left to us after the initial phase of the industrial revolution. Inside J.R.R. Tolkien's writings, it
can be suggested that the HOBBITs of the SHiRE can only live in "forest cities" for all else that densely
packs humans into a crowded area is either MODOR or bordering on the same. Trump thinks Calofornia's
forests need groundskeepers like those seen around Hogwarts from time to time, or at least FDR or IKE's
approach to the great outdoors. Keep in mind THAHHH Donald discovered his puberty as IKE passes the
torch to JFK....the man whose Id that is often being wantonly plagarised by either Bill Clinton + Joe Biden.

 

[Aratus]

i indeedy feel impelled to update my NEGAN verses EUGENE poll... [GOTO the Bay State forum area here]

 

[osan]

I should write for these assholes:

First presidential debate devolves into chaos as Trump derails the night with insults and interruptions

Chaos reigns in first Trump-Biden debate

Biden faces down raging Trump, telling him to 'shut up'

Trump’s over-belligerence led him to stumble in first debate

Sadly, Trump did it to himself. This is a smart man, so leading me to wonder why he did it. Is he really so weak in his ego that he could not see what he was doing? It is difficult to believe it, especially given that he really is a decent man. Is he playing another strategy? Plausible, but I don't see how it could be of real advantage.

Trump made several righteous points, but being all flustered (understandable, given four years of unending shit he's received), but his delivery and apparent toss of self-control made lots of people cringe. What was needed that night was not Trump the Brawler, but Trump the Commander In Chief. All he had to do was sit quietly back and let Biden do his work for him. The only saving grace was that Biden was a bigger train wreck than Trump, but cold is that comfort. And as always, it is not so much what one says, as how he says it. Trump really dropped his balls on this one.

I turned it off a mite past halfway as it was giving wifey and myself a giant headache.

Another thing about the "debate" is that it wasn't. It was structured as a Q&A session - basically a live interview of each candidate. How the hell were Trump's peopleso inept as to accept that format? Are they idiots? Screw me, I cannot for the life of me fathom how it is that people so incapable of basic analysis are allowed to be in charge of a taco stand, much less a nation - ANY nation. We live the very definition of absurdity.

In a proper debate format a thesis is defended by one side, attacked by the other. The sides fight it out, not with insults but logic, facts, and proper reason.

"President Trump, you have repeatedly asserted that lowering taxes actually increases government income in stark contrast to your opponent whose position is that the wealthy need to pay their fair share. Please explain your basis for this position." This is just off the top of my head, so don't criticize it as not very good because I've given it no careful thought. After giving his reasoning, Biden would then respond with his critique showing why and how Trump's position is wrong. Trump and Biden would go the rounds a second time and the audience would be left to decide whose argument prevails. THAT is a debate. What we saw the other night was a masturbate; every bit as embarrassing as when one gets caught yanking his yoyo in public... and then some.

The general ignorance of the American people really shows in this as I have yet to encounter a single voice calling into question the fact that this charade was being peddled as debate, even had the participants not devolved to seventh-grade stoogery.

 

[Swordsmyth]

Sadly, Trump did it to himself. This is a smart man, so leading me to wonder why he did it. Is he really so weak in his ego that he could not see what he was doing? It is difficult to believe it, especially given that he really is a decent man. Is he playing another strategy? Plausible, but I don't see how it could be of real advantage.

Trump made several righteous points, but being all flustered (understandable, given four years of unending $#@! he's received), but his delivery and apparent toss of self-control made lots of people cringe. What was needed that night was not Trump the Brawler, but Trump the Commander In Chief. All he had to do was sit quietly back and let Biden do his work for him. The only saving grace was that Biden was a bigger train wreck than Trump, but cold is that comfort. And as always, it is not so much what one says, as how he says it. Trump really dropped his balls on this one.

I turned it off a mite past halfway as it was giving wifey and myself a giant headache.

Another thing about the "debate" is that it wasn't. It was structured as a Q&A session - basically a live interview of each candidate. How the hell were Trump's peopleso inept as to accept that format? Are they idiots? Screw me, I cannot for the life of me fathom how it is that people so incapable of basic analysis are allowed to be in charge of a taco stand, much less a nation - ANY nation. We live the very definition of absurdity.

In a proper debate format a thesis is defended by one side, attacked by the other. The sides fight it out, not with insults but logic, facts, and proper reason.

"President Trump, you have repeatedly asserted that lowering taxes actually increases government income in stark contrast to your opponent whose position is that the wealthy need to pay their fair share. Please explain your basis for this position." This is just off the top of my head, so don't criticize it as not very good because I've given it no careful thought. After giving his reasoning, Biden would then respond with his critique showing why and how Trump's position is wrong. Trump and Biden would go the rounds a second time and the audience would be left to decide whose argument prevails. THAT is a debate. What we saw the other night was a masturbate; every bit as embarrassing as when one gets caught yanking his yoyo in public... and then some.

The general ignorance of the American people really shows in this as I have yet to encounter a single voice calling into question the fact that this charade was being peddled as debate, even had the participants not devolved to seventh-grade stoogery.

Excellent debate analysis by Anonymous Conservative:
https://www.anonymousconservative.com/blog/news-briefs-09-30-2020/

 

[osan]

I think he, Trump, stomped a mud hole in Biden's ass.

IMO - YMMV

I suppose, but the effect was largely lost on millions of people due to the cringe-factor. Trump carried himself very poorly, to my grave disappointment. I would have stood back and given Biden all the rope he wanted. I would not have interrupted him even once. The "left" would have had to work world's harder to make him the bad guy, not that it would have changed any of the extremists' minds. But people on the fence, a non-trivial factor in the coming election, may well have been put off. Let us hope they saw through the noise, but given how dopey the average guy is these days, hope is the most I can muster, and only in very small quantities.

We need to see a president worthy of the appellation and not a NYC pugilist.

 

[John-G]

[h=1]“The argument that the two parties should represent opposed ideals and policies... is a foolish idea. Instead, the two parties should be almost identical, so that the American people can throw the rascals out at any election without leading to any profound or extensive shifts in policy. Then it should be possible to replace it, every four years if necessary, by the other party which will be none of these things but will still pursue, with new vigor, approximately the same basic policies.”[/h]

Carroll Quigley

Maybe Trump wasn't trying to win, at some point, Trump was using some of the failed talking points Bernie used against him. Between him not fighting the mail in voting strong enough and this debate, maybe, just maybe he is trying to lose to Biden. And Biden needs all the help he can get to win.

 

[Anti Federalist]

I tried to find the thread about the presidential debate last Tuesday but wasn't able to. So I am putting this here in hopes someone can move it to where it should be.
Nice too see the facts. An amazing person took a ton of time to put this together.

Detailed info of the debate
A stop watch was used to time every single word for each candidate. How long they each spoke, how many times did they interrupt the other, etc. Here are the findings. Also included is unbiased fact check that has also been peer reviewed and fact checked against many different articles and sources.
First is how much time did each candidate get to speak.
●TRUMP had a total of 24 minutes and 9 seconds.
●BIDEN had a total of 33 minutes and 4 seconds.
During this debate, each candidate and even the moderator interrupted the others substantially.
●TRUMP interrupted Biden 64 times
●BIDEN interrupted Trump 57 times
●5 minutes and 35 seconds total of both Candidates talking over each other or back and forth which was labeled as overlapping. These minutes were not added to either candidates talking minutes total with this analysis.
Moderator CHRIS WALLACE Interrupted
● Trump 21 times
● Biden 5 times
Both Candidates were asked questions regarding condoning/condemning hate groups .
●TRUMP was asked if he would condemn white supremacists groups. Trump said "yea sure, I'm willing to do that" Chris Wallace asked again and Trump asked what group would you like me to say? Biden then retorted Proud Boys. Trump then said "Proud Boys Stand down and Stand By"
●Biden was asked if he supported BLM, he did not answer nor did he even recognize the question about BLM.
BIDEN brought up his son and said that Trump called him a loser and said his son was a hero who received a "Brown star" Trump responded by asking which son, he stated he didn't know Beau but did know about Hunter and his dishonorable discharge as well as receiving 3.5 million dollars from Moscow.
●There is no such thing as a "Brown star". There is a Bronze Star, which is given for heroic acts. Beau Biden was presented with a Bronze Star for his service in 2008.
●Trump's camp has denied the report from The Atlantic that said Trump called dead WW1 soldiers losers . Those present that day all deny hearing Trump say that, including Trump nemesis John Bolton.
● 87 page Senate Report shown wire transfers to Hunter Biden from Elena Baturina, wife of former mayor of Moscow. Those transfers included 3.5 million in Feb. 2014. As well as "several payments of several hundred thousand dollars" in 2015.
Biden also claimed the US owes more money to China now than when Trump took office.
●US debt is roughly 26 Trillion dollars. Of that Japan owns 5.2% and China owns 4.6%. Other countries also own substantial US debt including but not limited to UK, Brazil, Ireland, Cayman Islands, Hong Kong, Belgium, and Switzerland.
●In Oct.2016, China owns 1.12 Trillion of US debt.
●As of Aug. 2020, China owns 1.7 Trillion of US debt.
BIDEN claimed that Antifa is "an idea not an organization " .
●Antifa first had roots in Germany in the 20s/30s. The movement came to the US in the 70s/80s and gained notoriety and was more prominent in the last 10 years. While it started as an Anti Fascist movement, they have since became organized and have many cell groups such as Rose City Antifa out of Portland. Many of the cells claim organization status, recieve many donations as well as tax deductions.
This next part was gone through very thoroughly as to document insults, here is the following:
●TRUMP told Biden "There's nothing smart about you" as a retort to Biden telling Trump to be smarter.
●TRUMP also criticized Biden on rally attendance stating "If you could get the crowds, you would have done the same thing".
●TRUMP criticized Biden on wearing masks, saying "Every time you see him, he's wearing a mask" “He could be speaking 200 feet away from it. And he shows up with the biggest mask I’ve ever seen."
●BIDEN called Trump Racist
●BIDEN called Trump a clown twice
●BIDEN called Trump a liar
●BIDEN referred to the President as "Donald", "Old Buddy ", "This Man", "Putin's Puppy" on several occasions.
●BIDEN told Trump that he was the "wrong guy, wrong night, wrong time".
●BIDEN told Trump to "Keep yapping man"
●BIDEN asked Trump "Will you shutup man?"
These are the ACTUAL FACTS of the 1st Presidental Debate.

[MENTION=49542]navy-vet[/MENTION]

 

[Swordsmyth]

I tried to find the thread about the presidential debate last Tuesday but wasn't able to. So I am putting this here in hopes someone can move it to where it should be.
Nice too see the facts. An amazing person took a ton of time to put this together.

Detailed info of the debate
A stop watch was used to time every single word for each candidate. How long they each spoke, how many times did they interrupt the other, etc. Here are the findings. Also included is unbiased fact check that has also been peer reviewed and fact checked against many different articles and sources.
First is how much time did each candidate get to speak.
●TRUMP had a total of 24 minutes and 9 seconds.
●BIDEN had a total of 33 minutes and 4 seconds.
During this debate, each candidate and even the moderator interrupted the others substantially.
●TRUMP interrupted Biden 64 times
●BIDEN interrupted Trump 57 times
●5 minutes and 35 seconds total of both Candidates talking over each other or back and forth which was labeled as overlapping. These minutes were not added to either candidates talking minutes total with this analysis.
Moderator CHRIS WALLACE Interrupted
● Trump 21 times
● Biden 5 times
Both Candidates were asked questions regarding condoning/condemning hate groups .
●TRUMP was asked if he would condemn white supremacists groups. Trump said "yea sure, I'm willing to do that" Chris Wallace asked again and Trump asked what group would you like me to say? Biden then retorted Proud Boys. Trump then said "Proud Boys Stand down and Stand By"
●Biden was asked if he supported BLM, he did not answer nor did he even recognize the question about BLM.
BIDEN brought up his son and said that Trump called him a loser and said his son was a hero who received a "Brown star" Trump responded by asking which son, he stated he didn't know Beau but did know about Hunter and his dishonorable discharge as well as receiving 3.5 million dollars from Moscow.
●There is no such thing as a "Brown star". There is a Bronze Star, which is given for heroic acts. Beau Biden was presented with a Bronze Star for his service in 2008.
●Trump's camp has denied the report from The Atlantic that said Trump called dead WW1 soldiers losers . Those present that day all deny hearing Trump say that, including Trump nemesis John Bolton.
● 87 page Senate Report shown wire transfers to Hunter Biden from Elena Baturina, wife of former mayor of Moscow. Those transfers included 3.5 million in Feb. 2014. As well as "several payments of several hundred thousand dollars" in 2015.
Biden also claimed the US owes more money to China now than when Trump took office.
●US debt is roughly 26 Trillion dollars. Of that Japan owns 5.2% and China owns 4.6%. Other countries also own substantial US debt including but not limited to UK, Brazil, Ireland, Cayman Islands, Hong Kong, Belgium, and Switzerland.
●In Oct.2016, China owns 1.12 Trillion of US debt.
●As of Aug. 2020, China owns 1.7 Trillion of US debt.
BIDEN claimed that Antifa is "an idea not an organization " .
●Antifa first had roots in Germany in the 20s/30s. The movement came to the US in the 70s/80s and gained notoriety and was more prominent in the last 10 years. While it started as an Anti Fascist movement, they have since became organized and have many cell groups such as Rose City Antifa out of Portland. Many of the cells claim organization status, recieve many donations as well as tax deductions.
This next part was gone through very thoroughly as to document insults, here is the following:
●TRUMP told Biden "There's nothing smart about you" as a retort to Biden telling Trump to be smarter.
●TRUMP also criticized Biden on rally attendance stating "If you could get the crowds, you would have done the same thing".
●TRUMP criticized Biden on wearing masks, saying "Every time you see him, he's wearing a mask" “He could be speaking 200 feet away from it. And he shows up with the biggest mask I’ve ever seen."
●BIDEN called Trump Racist
●BIDEN called Trump a clown twice
●BIDEN called Trump a liar
●BIDEN referred to the President as "Donald", "Old Buddy ", "This Man", "Putin's Puppy" on several occasions.
●BIDEN told Trump that he was the "wrong guy, wrong night, wrong time".
●BIDEN told Trump to "Keep yapping man"
●BIDEN asked Trump "Will you shutup man?"
These are the ACTUAL FACTS of the 1st Presidental Debate.

...

 

[shakey1]

So...how to kick it off? How about with a twist on the drinking game?


Every time Biden says “Come on man!”, ya gotta take a shot of Espresso.


Every time Trump says “...Like no-one has ever seen before.”, ya gotta take a shot of Stolichnaya.

Thanks for posting... couldn’t bring myself to watch so caught the ‘highlights’ here... +rep coming your way.

 

[Swordsmyth]

...

Hat Tip [MENTION=49542]navy-vet[/MENTION]

Nice too see the facts. An amazing person took a ton of time to put this together.

Detailed info of the debate
A stop watch was used to time every single word for each candidate. How long they each spoke, how many times did they interrupt the other, etc. Here are the findings. Also included is unbiased fact check that has also been peer reviewed and fact checked against many different articles and sources.
First is how much time did each candidate get to speak.
●TRUMP had a total of 24 minutes and 9 seconds.
●BIDEN had a total of 33 minutes and 4 seconds.
During this debate, each candidate and even the moderator interrupted the others substantially.
●TRUMP interrupted Biden 64 times
●BIDEN interrupted Trump 57 times
●5 minutes and 35 seconds total of both Candidates talking over each other or back and forth which was labeled as overlapping. These minutes were not added to either candidates talking minutes total with this analysis.
Moderator CHRIS WALLACE Interrupted
● Trump 21 times
● Biden 5 times
Both Candidates were asked questions regarding condoning/condemning hate groups .
●TRUMP was asked if he would condemn white supremacists groups. Trump said "yea sure, I'm willing to do that" Chris Wallace asked again and Trump asked what group would you like me to say? Biden then retorted Proud Boys. Trump then said "Proud Boys Stand down and Stand By"
●Biden was asked if he supported BLM, he did not answer nor did he even recognize the question about BLM.
BIDEN brought up his son and said that Trump called him a loser and said his son was a hero who received a "Brown star" Trump responded by asking which son, he stated he didn't know Beau but did know about Hunter and his dishonorable discharge as well as receiving 3.5 million dollars from Moscow.
●There is no such thing as a "Brown star". There is a Bronze Star, which is given for heroic acts. Beau Biden was presented with a Bronze Star for his service in 2008.
●Trump's camp has denied the report from The Atlantic that said Trump called dead WW1 soldiers losers . Those present that day all deny hearing Trump say that, including Trump nemesis John Bolton.
● 87 page Senate Report shown wire transfers to Hunter Biden from Elena Baturina, wife of former mayor of Moscow. Those transfers included 3.5 million in Feb. 2014. As well as "several payments of several hundred thousand dollars" in 2015.
Biden also claimed the US owes more money to China now than when Trump took office.
●US debt is roughly 26 Trillion dollars. Of that Japan owns 5.2% and China owns 4.6%. Other countries also own substantial US debt including but not limited to UK, Brazil, Ireland, Cayman Islands, Hong Kong, Belgium, and Switzerland.
●In Oct.2016, China owns 1.12 Trillion of US debt.
●As of Aug. 2020, China owns 1.7 Trillion of US debt.
BIDEN claimed that Antifa is "an idea not an organization " .
●Antifa first had roots in Germany in the 20s/30s. The movement came to the US in the 70s/80s and gained notoriety and was more prominent in the last 10 years. While it started as an Anti Fascist movement, they have since became organized and have many cell groups such as Rose City Antifa out of Portland. Many of the cells claim organization status, recieve many donations as well as tax deductions.
This next part was gone through very thoroughly as to document insults, here is the following:
●TRUMP told Biden "There's nothing smart about you" as a retort to Biden telling Trump to be smarter.
●TRUMP also criticized Biden on rally attendance stating "If you could get the crowds, you would have done the same thing".
●TRUMP criticized Biden on wearing masks, saying "Every time you see him, he's wearing a mask" “He could be speaking 200 feet away from it. And he shows up with the biggest mask I’ve ever seen."
●BIDEN called Trump Racist
●BIDEN called Trump a clown twice
●BIDEN called Trump a liar
●BIDEN referred to the President as "Donald", "Old Buddy ", "This Man", "Putin's Puppy" on several occasions.
●BIDEN told Trump that he was the "wrong guy, wrong night, wrong time".
●BIDEN told Trump to "Keep yapping man"
●BIDEN asked Trump "Will you shutup man?"
These are the ACTUAL FACTS of the 1st Presidental Debate.

 

[Anti Federalist]

I suppose, but the effect was largely lost on millions of people due to the cringe-factor. Trump carried himself very poorly, to my grave disappointment. I would have stood back and given Biden all the rope he wanted. I would not have interrupted him even once. The "left" would have had to work world's harder to make him the bad guy, not that it would have changed any of the extremists' minds. But people on the fence, a non-trivial factor in the coming election, may well have been put off. Let us hope they saw through the noise, but given how dopey the average guy is these days, hope is the most I can muster, and only in very small quantities.

We need to see a president worthy of the appellation and not a NYC pugilist.

All forgotten by now...

 

[Anti Federalist]

Hat Tip [MENTION=49542]navy-vet[/MENTION]

Beat ya by two minutes...

 

[Swordsmyth]

Beat ya by two minutes...

 

[osan]

All forgotten by now...

Possibly.

Humans.

 

[devil21]

You misunderstand the situation. "Trumpism" is the working class. Trump saw an opportunity to appeal to millions of people who had no voice and were not represented by anyone in Washington. Whether he truly believes in a working class agenda (anti-war, populist economics, reduced immigration, etc.) or not is irrelevant. If you find "Trumpism" distasteful or repugnant, then maybe your problem isn't with Trump himself, but an entire socio-economic class of Americans.

You mean Cambridge Analytica saw an opportunity to leverage social media to craft a message that would appeal to the millions of moderate working class. There has been a ridiculous amount of propaganda in conservative, libertarian and "wakening conspiracy theorist" corners since Trump declared as a candidate in 2016 to put him exactly where he is today, 5 years later. I've always said I don't hate Trump and I mean it. I don't hate Trumpers either. I have, however, witnessed from the start the level of propaganda, social engineering and consent manufacturing that has taken place under his "brand" and I do dislike that, yes. I can dislike tactics and messages but I never hate people themselves. If I hated people in general, I wouldn't be here posting the things that I post. Instead, I wish people who should know better by now would simply get smarter, that's all.

 

[Anti Federalist]

Same. Luckily there are many examples, at least in my state, where blacks are tired of the Democrat plantation and embrace Conservative principles. Shall I use the word "bigly?" I'm not joking here. Discussions here and there, and sources and print media regarding black collectives like the Frederick Douglas Foundation, The Urban Conservative, Black Conservative Voices, and Black Voters Matter in N.C. all signal they are done being treated as victims.

Mrs. AF keeps telling me the same thing.

If true and not outliers, that is great news.

 

[DiverseSegregation]

@navy-vet

Nobody will see it that way. Chris Wallace did a terrible job and made Trump look like he was an interrupting bully.

 

[DiverseSegregation]

Detailed info of the debate
A stop watch was used to time every single word for each candidate.
First is how much time did each candidate get to speak.
●TRUMP had a total of 24 minutes and 9 seconds.
●BIDEN had a total of 33 minutes and 4 seconds.
●TRUMP interrupted Biden 64 times
●BIDEN interrupted Trump 57 times

Moderator CHRIS WALLACE Interrupted
● Trump 21 times
● Biden 5 times

●TRUMP was asked if he would condemn white supremacists groups. Trump said "yea sure, I'm willing to do that" Chris Wallace asked again and Trump asked what group would you like me to say? Biden then retorted Proud Boys. Trump then said "Proud Boys Stand down and Stand By"
●Biden was asked if he supported BLM, he did not answer nor did he even recognize the question about BLM.
BIDEN brought up his son and said that Trump called him a loser and said his son was a hero who received a "Brown star" Trump responded by asking which son, he stated he didn't know Beau but did know about Hunter and his dishonorable discharge as well as receiving 3.5 million dollars from Moscow.

BIDEN claimed that Antifa is "an idea not an organization " .
●While it started as an Anti Fascist movement, they have since became organized and have many cell groups such as Rose City Antifa out of Portland. Many of the cells claim organization status, recieve many donations as well as tax deductions.

This next part was gone through very thoroughly as to document insults, here is the following:
●TRUMP told Biden "There's nothing smart about you" as a retort to Biden telling Trump to be smarter.
●TRUMP also criticized Biden on rally attendance stating "If you could get the crowds, you would have done the same thing".
●TRUMP criticized Biden on wearing masks, saying "Every time you see him, he's wearing a mask" “He could be speaking 200 feet away from it. And he shows up with the biggest mask I’ve ever seen."
●BIDEN called Trump Racist
●BIDEN called Trump a clown twice
●BIDEN called Trump a liar
●BIDEN referred to the President as "Donald", "Old Buddy ", "This Man", "Putin's Puppy" on several occasions.
●BIDEN told Trump that he was the "wrong guy, wrong night, wrong time".
●BIDEN told Trump to "Keep yapping man"
●BIDEN asked Trump "Will you shutup man?"
These are the ACTUAL FACTS of the 1st Presidental Debate.

Why hasn't the RNC stood their ground on this? Chris Wallace was not an impartial moderator. To this day he is being lauded as the poor guy that had to deal with Trump's rudeness and constant interruptions. I am not saying that if this information was fact checked by a famous University and found to be true, it would change the narrative, but, it must be made known. The RNC should file an official complaint against Chris Wallace. Instead of Trump saying he won the debate, they should attack the attackers. On substance Trump won. However, his character was, and is still being slandered by Chris Wallace.

 

[KEEF]

My toilet won that debate on that night because dinner that day was just a little too greasy.