Trump: "We're gonna have to send more weapons (to Ukraine)"

[nikcers]

Automation doesn't mean jobs go away, it just means they're more productive.

Instead of 20 workers working at 1 factory, you might have 5 workers each at 4 factories. They all still have jobs. They're just producing 4x as many things.

There is an unlimited demand for "more stuff". Human labor is always* going to be the bottleneck in supplying that demand.

(* at least until the robots conquer and exterminate us)

Of course -- none of this works for us if all the factories are in China.

Thats just not how math works.

If for every 20 jobs you lose you gain 5 jobs you still lose 75% of the number of available jobs.

It becomes a problem where developing countries no longer want to invest their capital in jobs and they want to invest it in automation.

So the more capital created from the automation just incentivizes more automation.

You won't reach peak automation instantly but it will always be what you have an incentive to invest your capital in until you reach peak automation.

 

[Invisible Man]

Thats just not how math works.

If for every 20 jobs you lose you gain 5 jobs you still lose 75% of the number of available jobs.

It becomes a problem where developing countries no longer want to invest their capital in jobs and they want to invest it in automation.

So the more capital created from the automation just incentivizes more automation.

You won't reach peak automation instantly but it will always be what you have an incentive to invest your capital in.

Infinity minus 20 plus 5 is still infinity.

 

[nikcers]

The number of jobs is infinite. So that is not a possibility.

If the number of jobs was infinite we would never have unemployed people or hungry people.

 

[Invisible Man]

If the number of jobs was infinite we would never have unemployed people or hungry people.

That is due to regulations, not any natural limit on the amount of work out there to be done, and that people would be willing to pay for.

People have been spewing your predictions for centuries. They have never been right.

In spite of all the barriers the government puts in the way of people getting jobs, there are fewer hungry people now than ever before. Today's poor are rich by the standards of people living before automation gave us the productivity we now have.

 

[nikcers]

That is due to regulations, not any natural limit on the amount of work out there to be done, and that people would be willing to pay for.

People have been spewing your predictions for centuries. They have never been right.

That's not due to regulations its due to diminishing returns.

Too much supply of anything lowers the value and decreases profit so its no longer profitable.

 

[Invisible Man]

That's not due to regulations its due to diminishing returns.

Too much supply of anything lowers the value and decreases profit so its no longer profitable.

So the price goes down.

And when the price of labor goes down, what is it that prevents people from just continuing to work for lower pay? Regulations.

 

[nikcers]

So the price goes down.

And when the price of labor goes down, what is it that prevents people from just continuing to work for lower pay? Regulations.

Yeah but the price isnt just based on regulations by government its regulated by costs and the costs are priced based on economic conditions that are fixed to the laws of supply and demand.

Costs arent fixed and can fluctuate based on market conditions. A large unpredictable event in the supply chains that prices are determined by can disrupt the cost and the prices go up not by regulations but by market forces.

 

[nikcers]

So the price goes down.

And when the price of labor goes down, what is it that prevents people from just continuing to work for lower pay? Regulations.

The price cant go down below cost. If the price goes down below cost its no longer profitable so jobs have a price ceiling.

This is why socialism doesn't work it doesnt allow prices to be market based.

 

[Invisible Man]

Yeah but the price isnt just based on regulations by government its regulated by costs and the costs are priced based on economic conditions that are fixed to the laws of supply and demand.

Costs arent fixed and can fluctuate based on market conditions. A large unpredictable event in the supply chains that prices are determined by can disrupt the cost and the prices go up not by regulations but by market forces.

I never said the price was just based on regulations.

But when you take away the regulations, then everyone can have a job and the lower demand for labor due to automation will just result in lower wages.

Automation doesn't result in people not being able to have jobs. Only regulations accomplish that.

 

[nikcers]

I never said the price was just based on regulations.

But when you take away the regulations, then everyone can have a job and the lower demand for labor due to automation will just result in lower wages.

Automation doesn't result in people not being able to have jobs. Only regulations accomplish that.

Of course it does. People can not work for less than it costs to live. There is a price ceiling.

There is the real cost that the USA pays to keep people eating and alive and that cost has a price ceiling.

Eventually if left unregulated by government rule you get two scenarios.

Either

*natural selection for smaller and smaller people.*

You see this in animals on islands that have limited resources they get smaller and smaller

Or

*Natural competition where the genetics of the animal changes to compete for limited resources*

You see this with locusts. They become aggressive and violent.

 

[acptulsa]

Yeah but the price isnt just based on regulations by government its regulated by costs and the costs are priced based on economic conditions that are fixed to the laws of supply and demand.

So is the value of the currency.

Or to put it in terms you'll understand, moo.

 

[nikcers]

So is the value of the currency.

Or to put it in terms you'll understand, moo.

The value of currency comes from the value of the economy of the country that creates it.

The USA prices everything into dollars so cash is king by law. Rule of law.

 

[acptulsa]

The value of currency comes from the value of the economy of the country that creates it.

Supply and demand, bullshit generator. You're only talking about the demand side. You're ignoring half the equation.

Moo.

 

[nikcers]

Supply and demand, bullshit generator. You're only talking about the demand side. You're ignoring half the equation.

Moo.

Having an abundant supply is good it makes it to where there are no artificial shortages.

Shortages curb necessary investments for survival.

 

[acptulsa]

Having an abundant supply is good it makes it to where there are no artificial shortages.

You're not only as full of bullshit as a bull, you're dumb as cattle too.

Devaluing the currency creates shortages of currency for the people who are forced to use it because it doesn't go as far as it used to, moo.

 

[Invisible Man]

Of course it does. People can not work for less than it costs to live.

Sure they can. Many do all the time. And it is their right to do that if they choose.

Some people even offer their labor for no compensation at all, motivated by various other things like gaining experience in a field they want to enter or supporting a cause they believe in. Other people who work for less than it costs to live include people who are dependent on others, such as kids or developmentally disabled people. There are countless reasons people have to offer their labor for a wage that is less than the cost of living. Regulations that prevent them from doing that harm the very people they claim to help by making their jobs illegal.

But more to the point in the context of the current discussion, automation reduces the cost of living. When food, clothing, and shelter are practically free, due to advancements in productivity, the cost of living will be practically nothing at all, and every dollar someone makes will go toward luxuries above and beyond that, which will also be very cheap.

There is no possible scenario where automation results in people being worse off economically. Only government intervention in the market can do that.

If there is a cost of automation, it won't be jobless people going without basic necessities. It will be laziness and the atrophying of people's bodies and minds as they delegate more and more tasks to machines.

 

[nikcers]

You're not only as full of bullshit as a bull, you're dumb as cattle too.

Devaluing the currency creates shortages of currency because it doesn't go as far as it used to, moo.

You can't devalue something that has value because we believe it has value unless you stop believing it has value.

So collectively we as a country believe it has value and that belief is based on evidence and that evidence is based on history.

I can only go based off historical truth when it comes to knowing something. Its a historical truth that cash has value.

Cash has had value for as long as I have been around and as long as anyone I have ever known that has been around.

There is simply just a mountain of evidence that cash has value.

 

[acptulsa]

If the government sells something we happen to have a stockpile of and then orders a new one that doesnt just balance out we profit from it and the government makes revenue from taxation.

Never. It's all corporate welfare creating death and blowback. It's the insanity of an "elite" class that finds other people an irritant, bullshit generator.

 

[nikcers]

Never. It's all corporate welfare creating death and blowback. It's the insanity of an "elite" class that finds other people an irritant, bullshit generator.

Class warfare is marxism.

A rising tide lifts all boats.

Our defense industry is merit based. Other countries compete with it and ours is simply greater.

 

[acptulsa]

There is simply just a mountain of evidence that cash has value.

More meaningless word salad from the Cliché-O-Matic.

There's a mountain of evidence I can get a Pepsi for a nickel.