Trump Has Killed More Civilians with Illegal Drone Strikes in 9 Months Than Obama Did in 8 Yea

[Origanalist]

BuhWHA?

Non-foikkin'-sequitur.



You didn't just write that.

The implication here is that Hillary would have been better, however marginally.

Mesupposes you need to rethink this just a wee bit.



I'm thinking you are exaggerating here a mite. There are such people and they seem to get plastered all over the news an awful lot, which in itself leaves me wondering just how many there really are.

Trump is not my ideal by a long shot, but he has put the brakes on that which so badly needed braking. In the end, he may prove to have done nothing much better than dragging the pendulum back to the other tyrannical extreme. That has yet to prove out. Until that time, I will provisionally and stintingly lend my open mind. Give the man all the rope he wants and lets see what he does with it.

If in 3 or 7 more years the land is greatly improved, albeit still deathly ill, I am thinking some of you are going to owe the man an apology. If not, then you can say you were right all along, even if only by pure happenstance, which is all you have at this still-early stage.

He's given a tax break and he's not a economic lunatic like Obama. Beyond that I don't have much good to say about him other than he might cut some regulations. But he's going to devalue the dollar worse than the dems with his big spending if he gets his way. On the two things that matter most to me he is a big 0. Foreign intervention and the police state.

There will be no apologies coming from me.

 

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

In b4 dannno says it's all soros propaganda.

No, that is actually just in reference to your employer.

 

[PierzStyx]

This article claims that one study showed 95% of Airwars casualties were non-credible:



https://www.realcleardefense.com/ar..._reporting_101_check_your_sources_112395.html


Here is a prequel to that article:

https://www.lowyinstitute.org/the-interpreter/civilian-casualties-and-media

No, the commander of the Combined Joint Task Force Operation Inherent Resolve Stephen Townsend made that claim. And you actually believe him? Of course the military is going to lie to you to prevent the spreading of damning information about it. You're always railing on about the Deep State and here you are allowing it to spoon feed you bullcrap.

My, how far have you fallen.

 

[William Tell]

According to official government sources, it is 95% lower than what is being reported here. What venue would they be doing this questioning?

Official government sources are the ones dropping the freaking bombs. Official government sources said saying government spied on Americans is a conspiracy theory.

I THINK OUR FOREIGN POLICY STILL SUCKS AND NEEDS TO BE CHANGED.

Good! It should be changed.

I think it will turn out better under Trump than Hillary, though.[/QUOTE]Well you might well be right about Hillary but we will never know.

And that doesn't mean I'm going to take a bunch of airwars propaganda at face value.

Fine but judging by the name I would guess they opposed it under Obama too? Their twitter account was started in 2014. Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should trust them blindly but all you have to say they are wrong is the people running the actual 'air wars'.

 

[PierzStyx]

According to official government sources, it is 95% lower than what is being reported here. What venue would they be doing this questioning?

I THINK OUR FOREIGN POLICY STILL SUCKS AND NEEDS TO BE CHANGED. I think it will turn out better under Trump than Hillary, though.

And that doesn't mean I'm going to take a bunch of airwars propaganda at face value.

No, you'll just take the propaganda of the State at face value. The State who has a vested interest in lying to you and deceiving you (and itself), especially the military-industrial complex which is at the core of the Deep State national security apparatus.

Sad.

 

[dannno]

No, the commander of the Combined Joint Task Force Operation Inherent Resolve Stephen Townsend made that claim. And you actually believe him? Of course the military is going to lie to you to prevent the spreading of damning information about it. You're always railing on about the Deep State and here you are allowing it to spoon feed you bullcrap.

My, how far have you fallen.

It would be helpful if you knew what the deep state was.

Not everybody in the FBI is deep state, not everybody in the military is deep state. Ultimately they are controlled by the deep state, which is made up of people who are trying to lock down control of all these entities.

George Soros is more deep state than most particular individuals involved in the military, and many people who are in the military and who are not deep state will go along with those who are.

But the point is, I never said their numbers were accurate. I said I don't know. I also said you don't know, and you certainly haven't provided any evidence that you do.

Why should we trust the deep state Airwars??

If the military looked into the airwars figures and said 95% were not verifiable, it is possible that there were deaths they were not aware of but maybe the real figure is 90% are not verifiable, or 80%, or 60%.. maybe it is because a good portion never existed, maybe it is because the military doesn't do a great job at verifying this stuff.

All I know is that everybody who has been attacking me in this thread has been making false claims about what I've said, so I'm really not concerned what you guys think about me if you are making false claims..

 

[dannno]

Fine but judging by the name I would guess they opposed it under Obama too? Their twitter account was started in 2014. Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should trust them blindly but all you have to say they are wrong is the people running the actual 'air wars'.

George Soros funds Airwars, so I would think they would if anything have skewed in Obama's favor. Airwars is made up of a lot of people, I don't think it's a giant conspiracy.. but since it is centralized, like I said it would be easy for them to setup a few fake twitter accounts and make the numbers seem worse than they really are for Trump.

 

[dannno]

No, you'll just take the propaganda of the State at face value. The State who has a vested interest in lying to you and deceiving you (and itself), especially the military-industrial complex which is at the core of the Deep State national security apparatus.

Sad.

Lol, ya, and George Soros wants what is best for us (Hillary)

 

[William Tell]

If the military looked into the airwars figures and said 95% were not verifiable, it is possible that there were deaths they were not aware of but maybe the real figure is 90% are not verifiable, or 80%, or 60%.. maybe it is because a good portion never existed, maybe it is because the military doesn't do a great job at verifying this stuff.

Oh wow, the origin of that is Foreign Policy Mag. so we have like the most neocon website pulling out of their ass that 95% of alleged civilian casualties did not happen.

 

[dannno]

Oh wow, the origin of that is Foreign Policy Mag. so we have like the most neocon website pulling out of their ass that 95% of alleged civilian casualties did not happen.

I never said their figures should be trusted, I said neither can be trusted and nobody here knows what the actual figures are.

 

[William Tell]

I never said their figures should be trusted, I said neither can be trusted and nobody here knows what the actual figures are.

But your basis for saying Airwars figures can't be trusted is foreign policy dot freaking com. In other words the NeoCons have successfully diverted the conversation from the horrors of war to a situation where we debate whether our foreign policy might be only 1 20th as bad as we thought.

 

[Ender]

Airwars IS Soros propaganda, is there even any question about that??

Link?

 

[dannno]

But your basis for saying Airwars figures can't be trusted is foreign policy dot freaking com. In other words the NeoCons have successfully diverted the conversation from the horrors of war to a situation where we debate whether our foreign policy might be only 1 20th as bad as we thought.

No, my basis for saying Airwars figures can't be trusted is that it is funded by George Soros and Trump is President.. George Soros hates Trump. We can also look at the fact that the military claims 95% of the casualties they looked into couldn't be verified, maybe some of them legitimately couldn't be verified because we never dropped a bomb there, or because we had thermal cameras that showed only 2 people there and they were claiming 20 people died. Some could be because Airwars people want America to look bad. And some of them could be because the military is bad at figuring out the number of casualties. The fact is we don't know any of this information.

 

[dannno]

Link?

About Us – Airwars

https://airwars.org/about-us/
Funding from the Open Society Foundations




George Soros - Open Society Foundations

https://www.opensocietyfoundations.org/people/george-soros

George Soros is one of the world's foremost philanthropists. He has given away more than $32 billion of his personal fortune to fund the Open Society Foundations

 

[William Tell]

Link?

Open Society Foundations is one of of three organizations that Wikipedia lists as funding sources for Airwars. Airwars itself is an organization in England and Wales founded by British anti war journalist Chris Woods. I don't think that is evidence that Airwars is Soros propaganda anymore than Amash is a Koch puppet for getting campaign contributions from the Koch brothers. https://twitter.com/chrisjwoods

[h=1][/h]

 

[Ender]

Open Society Foundations is one of of three organizations that Wikipedia lists as funding sources for Airwars. Airwars itself is an organization in England and Wales founded by British anti war journalist Chris Woods. I don't think that is evidence that Airwars is Soros propaganda anymore than Amash is a Koch puppet for getting campaign contributions from the Koch brothers. https://twitter.com/chrisjwoods

[h=1][/h]

I agree.

I wanted to see dannno's proof of calling them Soros funded.

What I found was this:

Funding
Airwars is entirely funded by philanthropic organisations, along with significant pro bono contributions from our volunteers.

Thanks to generous funding from the Joseph Rowntree Charitable Trust we employ a part-time specialist in Iraq to monitor the Coalition air campaign, as well as a part-time Syria analyst based in the UK.

Funding from the Open Society Foundations allows us to employ a full time US-based investigative reporter and a UK-based Syria researcher, along with a part time London-based web and data producer. Our director is jointly funded by JRCT and OSF.

We also employ a full time researcher in the Netherlands focuses on Dutch and Belgian arstrikes and transparency – kindly funded by Stichting Democratie en Media.

We previously received a small project grant from the UK defence think tank the Remote Control Project to assess transparency and accountability among Coalition allies. Our associated Transparency Audit was published in December 2016.

An emergency grant from the Network for Social Change enabled us until January 2017 to employ a researcher tracking Russian airstrikes in Syria. We were able to slightly extend this project thanks to generous donations of £1,350 from supporters in 2016.

https://airwars.org

 

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

meanwhile local trumptards are focused exclusively on sjw liberal lunatics.

No need to take it personally, chief. But I guess that's the only way you could take it.

 

[dannno]

Open Society Foundations is one of of three organizations that Wikipedia lists as funding sources for Airwars. Airwars itself is an organization in England and Wales founded by British anti war journalist Chris Woods. I don't think that is evidence that Airwars is Soros propaganda anymore than Amash is a Koch puppet for getting campaign contributions from the Koch brothers. https://twitter.com/chrisjwoods

I agree.

I wanted to see dannno's proof of calling them Soros funded.

What I found was this:



https://airwars.org

Do either of you know anything about George Soros? Read any of his books?

 

[William Tell]

Do either of you know anything about George Soros?

Absolutely. He's one of the worst globalists out there. But he has his fingers in more pies than he has complete control of. Kind of like how various conservative organizations over the years have got Rockefeller money. I haven't seen evidence that he calls the shots for Airwars.

 

[r3volution 3.0]

It's because they look at the available information and draw conclusions from it. They don't begin with "Trump is Ron Paul on steroids and the Deep State is trying to bring down Trump because they don't like his _____" and subsequently dismiss all information casting a negative light on him, like what our RPF friends do. I really don't get what the deep state dislikes about Trump though. Foreign policy 100% on board. Goldman Sachs wrote the tax plan. So what exactly is Trump doing that they don't like? Some culture war BS? Is that all they got?

And they don't even really have that beyond rhetoric and some made-for-TV token actions.

Eisenhower didn't start any new major wars. Neither did Kennedy, Carter, or even Nixon (unless you count this war on us and our freedoms).

Raimondo is, as usual, full of shit. Even so, it's a bit early for you Trumpsters to brag, don't you think? Truman didn't start Korea in his first year in office. Trump has plenty of time, and plenty of irons in the fire.

Indeed, Obama didn't start his until year three (prior to which he just continued those of his predecessor, as Trump is doing).

Absolutely. He's one of the worst globalists out there. But he has his fingers in more pies than he has complete control of. Kind of like how various conservative organizations over the years have got Rockefeller money. I haven't seen evidence that he calls the shots for Airwars.

One of Mises' books was published with financing from the Rockefeller Foundation.

The world is not so simple as certain simpletons imagine it to be.

Trump has an IQ in the range of 140-150, he views his surroundings and acts how he thinks he needs to act to get his goals accomplished. Overall I think he has a very positive moral direction, but it does not always come off that way (especially when he is taken out of context as he often is).

Trump is chipping away at the deep state, if he did what you would have wanted him to do he would have been impeached.. Instead he is playing it smart. He isn't a perfect libertarian, but he is bringing us in the right direction.

So I'm a bit hesitant to believe the sensationalism here, and I think Trump will be winding down our foreign policy after some time. I've been saying that from the beginning. When I dunno, the sooner the better.

lol