luctor-et-emergo
Member
- Joined
- Jan 10, 2012
- Messages
- 7,420
Toady I'm voting NO! [Referendum on associating with Ukraine]
Good morning America...
Toady we have a referendum in the Netherlands. It's a referendum on whether or not we should 'associate' with Ukraine. First of all, a little background on our referendums.. We have a 'referendum law' which means that if enough signatures are collected for a certain topic/question we can have a national referendum. This law is pretty new and this is the first referendum ever to come out of it. The only other referendum we ever had was on the EU-constitution, which we did not approve but they later forced it on us as a treaty anyways. And we had no mandatory referendum on treaties... So we had nothing to say about it.
Anyways, this referendum is not binding either. Establishment parties are all in favor of the association treaty and the rest is against. Only one party (that I'm aware of) has said to respect the outcome, a christian party (CU).
Now the reasons to vote in favor of this treaty according to the proponents are;
-Good for trade (even though a trade deal is already in place which they happily omit from their messaging)
-Supposedly reduces corruption in Ukraine (But if you add a very corrupt country to a pretty corrupt union, then what happens)
-It's not about Ukraine joining the EU (It's not, however, inside this treaty are hidden the last couple of things Ukraine has to attain in order for them to directly ask for membership of the EU)
-It's what Ukrainians want (Some, the other half likes Russia more, which is the honest answer)
Now there are a few reasons to vote against the treaty;
-It WILL fast-track Ukrainian membership of the EU.
-It WILL piss off Russia.
-It WILL piss off Eastern-Ukrainians and devastate their economy as they are heavily linked to Russia's economy.
-It is going to cost billions in aid that's hidden inside the treaty.
-Ukraine has to this day not given radar images and other evidence they have on MH17. (Some 200 Dutch people died in that shot down aircraft... How people here can THINK of voting in favor of this treaty let alone actually vote in favor of it is a complete mystery to me.
-Ukrainian secret service is implicated in the theft and sale of millions worth of 17th century paintings from a museum in the Netherlands. They are not cooperating on that either.
So yeah, I'm voting against. For these reasons. Also because I will generally do anything to stop the EU from growing further in any way shape or form.
Nigel Farage was here the other day not too far from where I live. He was really excited about the referendum, according to him, it will send a signal to the people of the UK who will vote on BREXIT later this year. I sure hope we can deliver.
[here's the footage with Farage, intro is in Dutch/poor English]
Good morning America...
Toady we have a referendum in the Netherlands. It's a referendum on whether or not we should 'associate' with Ukraine. First of all, a little background on our referendums.. We have a 'referendum law' which means that if enough signatures are collected for a certain topic/question we can have a national referendum. This law is pretty new and this is the first referendum ever to come out of it. The only other referendum we ever had was on the EU-constitution, which we did not approve but they later forced it on us as a treaty anyways. And we had no mandatory referendum on treaties... So we had nothing to say about it.
Anyways, this referendum is not binding either. Establishment parties are all in favor of the association treaty and the rest is against. Only one party (that I'm aware of) has said to respect the outcome, a christian party (CU).
Now the reasons to vote in favor of this treaty according to the proponents are;
-Good for trade (even though a trade deal is already in place which they happily omit from their messaging)
-Supposedly reduces corruption in Ukraine (But if you add a very corrupt country to a pretty corrupt union, then what happens)
-It's not about Ukraine joining the EU (It's not, however, inside this treaty are hidden the last couple of things Ukraine has to attain in order for them to directly ask for membership of the EU)
-It's what Ukrainians want (Some, the other half likes Russia more, which is the honest answer)
Now there are a few reasons to vote against the treaty;
-It WILL fast-track Ukrainian membership of the EU.
-It WILL piss off Russia.
-It WILL piss off Eastern-Ukrainians and devastate their economy as they are heavily linked to Russia's economy.
-It is going to cost billions in aid that's hidden inside the treaty.
-Ukraine has to this day not given radar images and other evidence they have on MH17. (Some 200 Dutch people died in that shot down aircraft... How people here can THINK of voting in favor of this treaty let alone actually vote in favor of it is a complete mystery to me.
-Ukrainian secret service is implicated in the theft and sale of millions worth of 17th century paintings from a museum in the Netherlands. They are not cooperating on that either.
So yeah, I'm voting against. For these reasons. Also because I will generally do anything to stop the EU from growing further in any way shape or form.
Nigel Farage was here the other day not too far from where I live. He was really excited about the referendum, according to him, it will send a signal to the people of the UK who will vote on BREXIT later this year. I sure hope we can deliver.
[here's the footage with Farage, intro is in Dutch/poor English]
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