The Rockwell Manifesto

[Yvonne]

Lew's new book, 'The Left, The Right & The State" is out!
In his intro, Lew writes: "In American political culture, and world political culture too, the divide concerns in what way the state's power should be expanded. The left has a laundry list and the right does too. Both represent a grave threat to the only political position that is truly beneficial to the world and its inhabitants: liberty." Read it all here please:

http://www.lewrockwell.com/rockwell/left-right-and-state.html

This book is sure to go to the top of Ron's Reading List.

 

[Truth Warrior]

The Rockwell Manifesto

 

[lodge939]

He has a chapter on "legalize drunk driving"

Uh, no.

 

[Truth Warrior]

He has a chapter on "legalize drunk driving"

Uh, no.

Legalize Drunk Driving by Llewellyn H. Rockwell, Jr.

 

[lodge939]

Legalize Drunk Driving by Llewellyn H. Rockwell, Jr.

He makes some good points, but not good enough.

Now, the immediate response goes this way: drunk driving has to be illegal because the probability of causing an accident rises dramatically when you drink.

I agree with the obvious rebuttal

 

[Truth Warrior]

He makes some good points, but not good enough.

I agree with the obvious rebuttal

Lew's overall reasoning works for me TOO.



"The human race divides politically into those who want people to be controlled and those who have no such desire." ~ Robert A. Heinlein (1907-1988)

 

[libertea]

Works for me.

I got stopped twice at checkpoints in Mexico last week and had to take a breathalyser. I would refuse if they stopped me in the US. I am not about to argue with El Transito. My 6 yr old asked me why we were stopped and I let out my rant then.

 

[lodge939]

Too often libertarians just want no laws at all. I saw an article where Rothbard got all bent out of shape over the UK sending a task force to the Falklands even though Argentina started that war for no reason. He basically said Argentina are right to pointlessly invade the island because Britain had an Empire and is evil!

 

[Conza88]

Too often libertarians just want no laws at all. I saw an article where Rothbard got all bent out of shape over the UK sending a task force to the Falklands even though Argentina started that war for no reason. He basically said Argentina are right to pointlessly invade the island because Britain had an Empire and is evil!

Non aggression axiom + property rights.

War breaks both = i.e you are not a Libertarian if you support War. I.e You FAIL epically.

 

[Conza88]

He makes some good points, but not good enough.

You haven't made any. And thus you fail remarkably.

I agree with the obvious rebuttal

Your rebuttal is that it is ok to make illegal actions, based on ASSUMPTIONS.

Great. Do you really need me to come up with examples on how insane and idiotic that is?

 

[tremendoustie]

Works for me.

I got stopped twice at checkpoints in Mexico last week and had to take a breathalyser. I would refuse if they stopped me in the US. I am not about to argue with El Transito. My 6 yr old asked me why we were stopped and I let out my rant then.

I disagree with all unjustified search and seisure, and any checkpoint, but I agree that drunk driving should be illegal. If a particular activity has a very high probability of causing harm to others, it's reasonable to outlaw it. For example, if you shoot a gun at someone but the gun misfires, it's still attempted murder. Likewise, if a particular drug frequently caused users to start a psychopathic murdering spree, it would make sense to illegalize it.

I think it is a matter of degrees -- if an activity could be reasonably pursued without the expectation that property damage or injury to others would result, it should be legal.

The government, of course, has gone way too far down the path of illegalization, but I would agree with a law against drunk driving.

 

[Truth Warrior]

Too often libertarians just want no laws at all. I saw an article where Rothbard got all bent out of shape over the UK sending a task force to the Falklands even though Argentina started that war for no reason. He basically said Argentina are right to pointlessly invade the island because Britain had an Empire and is evil!

Here's MY ONE law:

"Do as you please - but harm no other in their person or property."

Think about it. How much more is REALLY needed? Shut down the frickin' "law factory", Congress.

 

[Shadow of a Doubt]

The idea that drunk driving should be decriminalized is a technicality. Many libertarians who advocate it also advocate private roads, in which case the road company would be setting the rules and could ban drunk driving if it wanted to.

 

[Conza88]

The idea that drunk driving should be decriminalized is a technicality. Many libertarians who advocate it also advocate private roads, in which case the road company would be setting the rules and could ban drunk driving if it wanted to.

It's not even a technicality.

WHO is the victim of drink driving? WHO!??!?!

NAME ONE.

The Law is meant to be about JUSTICE. You can't have fken justice when there is NO LEGITIMATE VICTIM.

 

[lodge939]

Non aggression axiom + property rights.

War breaks both = i.e you are not a Libertarian if you support War. I.e You FAIL epically.

See this is what I mean. If you were living in France in 1940 you would gladly submit to Nazi rule, because opposing them would mean war

 

[Truth Warrior]

See this is what I mean. If you were living in France in 1940 you would gladly submit to Nazi rule, because opposing them would mean war

99+% of the French did.

 

[Shadow of a Doubt]

It's not even a technicality.

WHO is the victim of drink driving? WHO!??!?!

NAME ONE.

The Law is meant to be about JUSTICE. You can't have fken justice when there is NO LEGITIMATE VICTIM.

I agree entirely, but individual liberty arguments, while being correct, are not very persuasive. It has to be demonstrated that any problem that can supposedly be be solved by government can also be solved by freedom. For example, if it were somehow possible for the government to improve the economy by intervening then that makes peaceful mutual self-interest impossible. Arguments for taxes would be justified by saying that, "we must hurt you in order to help you," or some nonsense like that. It may sound absurd to people who already get it like us, but I know some leftists who follow that train of logic because they have a faulty view of economics.

Once someone understands the world, then things like property rights and the non-aggression axiom become obvious, but not until then. Remember that morality is derived from reality, and not the reverse.

 

[The_Orlonater]

If someone invades, slaughter them or better yet do what the Swiss do.

I don't think we have to go over this.

 

[Scofield]

You can't have complete liberty without a morally just populace. We do not have a morally just populace. We are materialistic, self-centered douchebags who don't give two thoughts about our fellow man. As long as we're making bank, fuck everyone else.

I agree with DUI laws (note: only because of our current state of society), simply because the people aren't going to stop driving drunk just because it's the morally responsible thing to do, but more so because there is a penalty for doing so. I feel if we get rid of all driving drunk laws, the amount of incidents will increase exponentially.

Not enough people with morals, ethics, and principle. When this country begins to regain the aforementioned traits, then we can get rid of the DUI laws. Until then, we can't maximize our Liberty. It sucks, but it's the truth.

 

[Truth Warrior]

You can't have complete liberty without a morally just populace. We do not have a morally just populace. We are materialistic, self-centered douchebags who don't give two thoughts about our fellow man. As long as we're making bank, fuck everyone else.

I agree with DUI laws (note: only because of our current state of society), simply because the people aren't going to stop driving drunk just because it's the morally responsible thing to do, but more so because there is a penalty for doing so. I feel if we get rid of all driving drunk laws, the amount of incidents will increase exponentially.

Not enough people with morals, ethics, and principle. When this country begins to regain the aforementioned traits, then we can get rid of the DUI laws. Until then, we can't maximize our Liberty. It sucks, but it's the truth.

Hello NWO. "Ordo ab Chao"