The Libertarian Case for Palin

[dr teeth]

Palin is dead in the water. It may not seem like it now, but she wouldn't survive a primary. The attack add would read as follows from Romney or Huckabee. I was governor too, only I finished what I started. People want to compare her to Reagan, but Reagan was a successful governor. Of the entire Republican field, she has the least experience. Her decision to step down, means in 3 years, that will be worse.

 

[speciallyblend]

Palin is dead in the water. It may not seem like it now, but she wouldn't survive a primary. The attack add would read as follows from Romney or Huckabee. I was governor too, only I finished what I started. People want to compare her to Reagan, but Reagan was a successful governor. Of the entire Republican field, she has the least experience. Her decision to step down, means in 3 years, that will be worse.

ditto. i might vote for her to be a girl scout troop leader but that is about it! the gop truly is deaf dumb and blind but i will make sure my vote keeps the gop in check until they listen!

 

[Deborah K]

Palin is dead in the water. It may not seem like it now, but she wouldn't survive a primary. The attack add would read as follows from Romney or Huckabee. I was governor too, only I finished what I started. People want to compare her to Reagan, but Reagan was a successful governor. Of the entire Republican field, she has the least experience. Her decision to step down, means in 3 years, that will be worse.

Reagan and the others did not experience the vitriol and villification that this woman experiences day after day, month after month. Their families were not mercilessly and relentlessly attacked. It is disgusting what this woman and her family have been put through. She was a lame duck and a target. She got out of the way, so sue her. Oh, I forgot, plenty are already doing that - and LOSING!!

I know she's the favorite whipping post on this forum. I don't really understand why. She deserves critcism for some of her stances, yes, but calling her the horrible names she's been called is reprehensible and it is disappointing to see the cyber- assassination of her that takes place on here.

It's one thing to disagree with someone, but to do what has been done to her gives me great pause as a woman, wife, mother, and political activist. Never before have I seen such an attack on someone, let alone a woman. Even Doc Paul didn't get this kind of treatment.

 

[Kraig]

Reagan and the others did not experience the vitriol and villification that this woman experiences day after day, month after month. Their families were not mercilessly and relentlessly attacked. It is disgusting what this woman and her family have been put through. She was a lame duck and a target. She got out of the way, so sue her. Oh, I forgot, plenty are already doing that - and LOSING!!

I know she's the favorite whipping post on this forum. I don't really understand why. She deserves critcism for some of her stances, yes, but calling her the horrible names she's been called is reprehensible and it is disappointing to see the cyber- assasination of her that takes place on here.

It's one thing to disagree with someone, but to do what has been done to her gives me great pause as a woman, wife, mother, and political activist. Never before have I seen such an attack on someone, let alone a woman. Even Doc Paul didn't get this kind of treatment.

Not nearly as disgusting as what the government puts us through via programs SHE ENDORSED by running with McCain. I don't know if she was singled out or not, but they all deserve far worse.

 

[speciallyblend]

Not nearly as disgusting as what the government puts us through via programs SHE ENDORSED by running with McCain. I don't know if she was singled out or not, but they all deserve far worse.

actually palin is the one that brought her family into the campaign! palin has no argument and if palin is the gop's future. you can count me out!

palin is trying to make an argument out of nothing! sorry palin doesn't make the cut and she is no where near our Ron Paul message! she is part of the failed gop leadership that needs to be fired or expelled. the gop has along way to go to grow!

 

[speciallyblend]

Reagan and the others did not experience the vitriol and villification that this woman experiences day after day, month after month. Their families were not mercilessly and relentlessly attacked. It is disgusting what this woman and her family have been put through. She was a lame duck and a target. She got out of the way, so sue her. Oh, I forgot, plenty are already doing that - and LOSING!!

I know she's the favorite whipping post on this forum. I don't really understand why. She deserves critcism for some of her stances, yes, but calling her the horrible names she's been called is reprehensible and it is disappointing to see the cyber- assassination of her that takes place on here.

It's one thing to disagree with someone, but to do what has been done to her gives me great pause as a woman, wife, mother, and political activist. Never before have I seen such an attack on someone, let alone a woman. Even Doc Paul didn't get this kind of treatment.

palin got what she and the gop deserves! no sympathy for this woman or the gop! she doesn't represent women or my wife, thank god!

until the gop wakes up and smells the coffee. they have 0 credibility well lets say at least 10-25% credibility( aka Ron Paul)! thanks to Ron Paul. the bar has been set high and unfortunately not many in the gop can even come close to the bar Ron paul set.

the gop will continue to fall without Ron Paul and the gop will continue to grow with Ron Paul. the gop better be real careful which road they choose

 

[Deborah K]

actually palin is the one that brought her family into the campaign! palin has no argument and if palin is the gop's future. you can count me out!

palin is trying to make an argument out of nothing! sorry palin doesn't make the cut and she is no where near our Ron Paul message! she is part of the failed gop leadership that needs to be fired or expelled. the gop has along way to go to grow!

palin got what she and the gop deserves! no sympathy for this woman or the gop! she doesn't represent women or my wife, thank god!

ALL Candidates introduce their families. She has been reviled in the extreme. And I disagree that she deserves all the hatred being spewed at her. Vehement criticism is one thing - complete annihilation of one's reputation is quite another and I would venture that this attack on her has been hugely successful in convincing other women who are NOT liberals to EVER run for high office. Nice work!

 

[nayjevin]

She has been reviled in the extreme. And I disagree that she deserves all the hatred being spewed at her. Vehement criticism is one thing - complete annihilation of one's reputation is quite another and I would venture that this attack on her has been hugely successful in convincing other women who are NOT liberals to EVER run for high office. Nice work!

I certainly agree with the first part, and think you could be right about the second too, at least in some cases. Female leaders for true conservatism would be awesome.

I think some of the venom is in part brought on by Palin's policies and actions as well. For those of us vehemently against war, she can be rationalized as an advocate of murder.

It's not appropriate or necessary for a person to spit hate at her, but some of the common reasons for that hate are justified I think.

 

[Deborah K]

I certainly agree with the first part, and think you could be right about the second too, at least in some cases. Female leaders for true conservatism would be awesome.

I think some of the venom is in part brought on by Palin's policies and actions as well. For those of us vehemently against war, she can be rationalized as an advocate of murder.

It's not appropriate or necessary for a person to spit hate at her, but some of the common reasons for that hate are justified I think.

I don't think what has been done to her is justifiable in any way.

 

[nayjevin]

some of the common reasons are justified.

Let me try to explain how I can see a person coming to hate Sarah Palin. I don't, or rather hadn't really thought about it -- I think hate is a waste of time.

But I can see a person thinking:

- I like everyone until I find out I shouldn't
- I would probably like people in Iraq for the most part
- Sarah Palin thinks God wants her to advocate killing lots of those people
- I hate Sarah Palin

In my mind, some of that is justified - i.e. people in Iraq are dying, assuredy alot of them good people, and Palin supports that.
The hating part isn't justified, or maybe I should say it isn't productive or positive.

 

[acptulsa]

The G.O.P. is doing what it has been doing for some time now--propping up charismatic idiots, waiting for them to develop a fierce opposition because they're obviously too stupid to ever have a clue what to do in a job like theirs, wait until a bunch of average people get to identifying with them, and spin the whole thing up into one big soap opera. And this works for the G.O.P. machine because it all serves to obscure the question we should always be asking--who's the power of intelligence behind this charismatic idiot obviously not fit for the job? The answer all too often is names like Rove and Cheney.

Restrict your view to candidates competent in their own right for the job in question, like Ron Paul, and you save yourself a lot of headaches...

 

[moostraks]

The G.O.P. is doing what it has been doing for some time now--propping up charismatic idiots, waiting for them to develop a fierce opposition because they're obviously too stupid to ever have a clue what to do in a job like theirs, wait until a bunch of average people get to identifying with them, and spin the whole thing up into one big soap opera. And this works for the G.O.P. machine because it all serves to obscure the question we should always be asking--who's the power of intelligence behind this charismatic idiot obviously not fit for the job? The answer all too often is names like Rove and Cheney.

Restrict your view to candidates competent in their own right for the job in question, like Ron Paul, and you save yourself a lot of headaches...

wow...well said!

 

[Hoot]

I disagree that that is the only reason for all the vitriol. It may be your reason. Again, a very stringent litmus test will accomplish little. And besides, reasonable people change their minds all the time when they realize they were wrong about something.

If this is all you have against her, then go about changing her mind.

Deb is right. Being a libertarian you can't be a hater imho. I think it is a much better idea to educate people then to ignore them. I wish I could send a copy of The Creature From Jekyll Island to Palin, Biden, and everyone else in D.C. Maybe that is what we should do, a book bomb. Buy enough copies of G. Griffin's book to send to every congressmen (and women).

If we started hating everyone that runs for office and the people who support them, we won't be left with many friends. Educate the masses should be our goal.

Hoot
http://www.libertyunleashed.com

 

[tron paul]

divide and conquer

We can debate her principles till the cows come home. If what you are saying is that your principles won't allow you to accept my take on co-opting her influence, then I guess you will have to find your own ways of strategizing to help save our country.

I intend to pull Palin supporters (and Palin, if possible) into the fold.

Maybe it's time for the liberty movement to split into two camps.

The Anti-Palin greens, anarchists, communists, nihilists, and libertarians form Camp#1.
They can grow up and replace the Democrat Party.

The Pro-Palin conservatives, minarchists, populists, nationalists, and libertarians form Camp#2. Camp#2 can grow up and replace the Republican Party.

 

[acptulsa]

Maybe it's time for the liberty movement to split into two camps.

The Anti-Palin greens, anarchists, communists, nihilists, and libertarians form Camp#1.
They can grow up and replace the Democrat Party.

The Pro-Palin conservatives, minarchists, populists, nationalists, and libertarians form Camp#2. Camp#2 can grow up and replace the Republican Party.

When does Palin grow up?

 

[jmdrake]

Maybe it's time for the liberty movement to split into two camps.

The Anti-Palin greens, anarchists, communists, nihilists, and libertarians form Camp#1.
They can grow up and replace the Democrat Party.

The Pro-Palin conservatives, minarchists, populists, nationalists, and libertarians form Camp#2. Camp#2 can grow up and replace the Republican Party.

How about Camp#3? People who are against politicians who supported the socialist banker bailout? That, of course, rules OUT Sarah Palin. Really, I don't get your fascination with her. The fact that she thought the bailout was somehow related to tax cuts shows she's not fit to be dogcatcher. There's one way and one way only to get our country back. We have to stand on principles. The overwhelming majority of Americans were against the bailout. If everyone who was against the bailout only supported anti bailout politicians then we'd have our country back. Sarah Palin can't "replace" the current Republican party. She IS the current republican party.

 

[Deborah K]

How about Camp#3? People who are against politicians who supported the socialist banker bailout? That, of course, rules OUT Sarah Palin. Really, I don't get your fascination with her. The fact that she thought the bailout was somehow related to tax cuts shows she's not fit to be dogcatcher. There's one way and one way only to get our country back. We have to stand on principles. The overwhelming majority of Americans were against the bailout. If everyone who was against the bailout only supported anti bailout politicians then we'd have our country back. Sarah Palin can't "replace" the current Republican party. She IS the current republican party.

That stategy hasn't worked out very well for the pro-lifers. What makes you think it will work out for the fiscally conservative?

 

[acptulsa]

Really, I don't get your fascination with her... Sarah Palin can't "replace" the current Republican party. She IS the current republican party.

I fear I'm beginning to 'get' it. Between the fact that he titled his thread 'divide and conquer' and statements like this:

Maybe it's time for the liberty movement to split into two camps.

 

[tron paul]

We may well have to at least talk nice to 'less idealogically pure' conservatives to accomplish what must be done.

Many of us have been busting our asses doing that for years. Where have you been? Too busy hating?

We also won over many 'less idealogically pure' liberals like Kucinich and McKinney, BTW. That's why HR1207 has so much support. Not because we let the abortion & war issues dominate everything else and refused to work with the 'impure.'

Yeah, can't take either seriously. But I can pretend to long enough to win over a supporter or two. Their supporters I do take seriously.

A goal higher than 1 or 2 would be more helpful. But it's a start.

Thanks for stopping the bashing long enough to consider the strategic possibilities of using the insurgent Palinite, Tea Party, Townhall Mob movement to further our mutual goals.

 

[marc1888]

No disrespect to anyone who likes Palin.

However how low do we have to go. Ron Paul supporters, libertarians have convinced me over the years by their argument. What is actually wrong with running a strong intellectual candidate who actually believes in your principles who can make a coherent argument and has a background of actually supporting it. Rather than these types who want a shot at glory and find their "Libertarian" ideals when it is politically expedient to do so.

Palin might well be more powerful than a fleet of Ron Paul blimps. I would rather however support someone who is unelectable and unpalatable to the masses who was right and honorable than someone who knows how to stir the groins of middle aged goppers. I dont think there has been one word that came out of Palin's mouth that was original, impressive or even meaningful. In fact the majority of people who i have met who love Palin are salivating male goppers or pathetic women goppers who think 'She's just like us'. They are right, dumb and stupid.

Like it or not, Palin is more powerful than a fleet of 10,000 Ron Paul Blimps.

She is a superstar of megawatt intensity. Her supporters range from debate team type Paulistas and family-oriented former Huck's Army personnel, to (normally/formerly apolitical) others admire that her for being both an icon of fashion and female power.

Lover or hater, almost everyone has an opinion and propagates the intense buzz about Palin. For example:


http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2008/09/the_libertarian_case_for_palin.html

September 02, 2008
The Libertarian Case for Palin
By David Harsanyi

The potential political consequences of Sarah Palin have been chewed over from every imaginable angle.

Though there is plenty to ponder, one thing is certain: libertarian-inclined voters should be encouraged. No, I'm not suggesting that your little Molly will be bringing home "The Road to Serfdom" from her (distinctly non-public) elementary school. But in contrast to any national candidate in recent memory, Palin is the one that exudes the economic and cultural sensibilities of a geniune Western-style libertarian.

Now, Palin's lack of experience has been framed as an impenetrable negative. One wire story helpfully noted that Palin had never ever appeared on "Meet the Press." Shocking! But as Barack Obama often notes, it's not about experience, it's about judgment. And Palin's penchant for reform-minded conservatism is certainly at odds with the racket Washington Republicans have offered up the past 8 years.

Palin, for example, vetoed 300 pork projects in Alaska in her first year in office. She made a habit of knocking out big-government Republicans in her brief political career. For this, the 44-year-old mother of five enjoys a sterling approval rating in a state with arguably the nation's most libertarian-minded populace.

When it comes to healthcare, Palin says she wants to "allow free-market competition and reduce onerous government regulation." These days, any mention of the "free market" that's not framed as a crass pejorative is a sign of progress.

Culturally, there is little for the Heartland to dislike. By now, you've probably seen picture or two of Palin sporting a rifle. Apparently, she's left carcasses strewn across the Alaskan wilderness. In some places -- areas where the nation is growing -- owning a gun is not yet a sin. And unlike Obama, Palin seems to believe that the Second Amendment means the exact same thing in rural Alaska as it does in the streets of Chicago.

Yes, Palin is without argument a staunch social conservative. She is fervently opposed to abortion - even in cases of rape and incest, which will raise eyebrows, but is certainly more philosophically consistent than the namby pambyism of your average politician. The choice issue, after all, is complicated, even for many libertarians. And, as I was recently reminded, Ron Paul, the Libertarian champion of the 21st century, also opposes abortion.

Even when advocating for "moral" issues, Palin's approach is a soft sell. Palin does not support gay marriage (neither does Obama, it should be noted). Yet, in 2006, Palin's first veto as Governor was a bill that sought to block state employee benefits and health insurance for same-sex couples.

We cannot bore into Palin's soul to see her true feelings about gay couples, but, at the time, she noted that signing "this bill would be in direct violation of my oath of office" because it was unconstitutional. For most libertarians, the thought of politician following any constitution, rather than their own predilections, morality or the "common good," is a nice change of pace.

On the counterproductive War on Drugs, Palin is no warrior. Her Republican opponent in 2006 primary, incumbent Republican governor Frank Murkowski, made recriminalizing the possession of small amounts of pot a priority. Palin, though she does not support legalization, believes enforcement should not be a high priority.

"I can't claim a Bill Clinton and say that I never inhaled," Palin once said. This sort of honesty is a welcome change from the standard hand-wringing about marijuana's supposed disastrous consequences.

On education, Palin supports school-choice programs. There have already been smears that she backed "creationist" teaching in "public" schools, when in fact, Palin's comment regarding intelligent design should hold some appeal to libertarians. Even if you find the idea inane, in essence, Palin pushed the idea that parents, rather than the state, should decide what children are learning.

When asked about this commotion, Palin said, "I won't have religion as a litmus test, or anybody's personal opinion on evolution or creationism." If lockstep left-wing union-run school boards in urban districts would follow this sound advice on ideological litmus tests, our educational system would be a lot more productive.

Then there is a question of authenticity. And it matters. Those who will do anything for power, will say anything and support any position that is convenient. From John McCain to Joe Biden to Obama, one gets the sense that political office is their life's work. All of them have made attempts to create the perception that, hey, they're ordinary Americans just like you. Palin won't have to work at genuineness. With Palin, you get the impression she can take politics or leave it. Her life certainly hasn't been saturated with policy, favor trading and back scratching.

Of course, Washington has a mysterious power to turn perfectly reasonable, wholesome, well-meaning human beings into equivocating crooked gasbags. But, from the little we know about Palin, such a transformation doesn't seem likely. And for libertarians - in the broadest sense of the small "l" word -- she's the best candidate they can expect.
Reach columnist David Harsanyi at [email protected].