The Libertarian Case for Palin

[moostraks]

I disagree that that is the only reason for all the vitriol. It may be your reason. Again, a very stringent litmus test will accomplish little. And besides, reasonable people change their minds all the time when they realize they were wrong about something.

If this is all you have against her, then go about changing her mind.

She is like Huckabee in drag. It isn't just pre-emptive war, but that is a huge issue. Someone who rationalizes religion with her god's will to commit murder are a very difficult lot to rationalize with, esp. considering she is rationalizing a pre-emptive war and not even a legitimate self-defense.

 

[Deborah K]

She is like Huckabee in drag. It isn't just pre-emptive war, but that is a huge issue. Someone who rationalizes religion with her god's will to commit murder are a very difficult lot to rationalize with, esp. considering she is rationalizing a pre-emptive war and not even a legitimate self-defense.

We can debate her principles till the cows come home. If what you are saying is that your principles won't allow you to accept my take on co-opting her influence, then I guess you will have to find your own ways of strategizing to help save our country.

I intend to pull Palin supporters (and Palin, if possible) into the fold.

 

[acptulsa]

Yes, she does appeal more to the Huckabee crowd than the McCain crowd, which is why she was chosen. And while I have zero use for Huckabee, his supporters I have found to be both sympathetic and helpful to us.

And Deborah has a point. We may not be able to build our own coalition sufficiently, even with the financial meltdown making us look brilliant. We may well have to at least talk nice to 'less idealogically pure' conservatives to accomplish what must be done.

Now that you mention it, moonstraks, she is indeed basically a Hucksterette, isn't she? I can only think of two candidates in that race whose diet became national news. Squirrel and moose. What a pair they'd make! If you are what you eat, together they could be the new Rocky and Bullwinkle!

Yeah, can't take either seriously. But I can pretend to long enough to win over a supporter or two. Their supporters I do take seriously.

 

[Deborah K]

Now that you mention it, moonstraks, she is indeed basically a Hucksterette, isn't she? I can only think of two candidates in that race whose diet became national news. Squirrel and moose. What a pair they'd make! If you are what you eat, together they could be the new Rocky and Bullwinkle!

 

[moostraks]

Yes, she does appeal more to the Huckabee crowd than the McCain crowd, which is why she was chosen. And while I have zero use for Huckabee, his supporters I have found to be both sympathetic and helpful to us.

And Deborah has a point. We may not be able to build our own coalition sufficiently, even with the financial meltdown making us look brilliant. We may well have to at least talk nice to 'less idealogically pure' conservatives to accomplish what must be done.

Sorry guys, but I can't play nice with people I am that ideologically opposed to so I will agree to disagree. They water down the importance of one of the biggest issues facing our nation and they feel morally obligated to pursue it. Imo, it isn't even rationalized through scripture they supposedly hold so dear. To me it is as vile as the catholic crusades and I am sick of those who portray christians so publicly with this image.

After my exposure to the lock down on effort put forth in the primaries, I have very little faith in any change occuring in the short run. The system is corrupt. I doubt we will have any real choice the next go 'round either. Things will have to get much worse before the majority is able to see the error of their ways and be capable of rationalizing the use of brute force only allows victory to the violent aggressors and totalitarians. To give liberty is necessary to receive liberty.

I wish you two all the best but I will not be able to stomach tolerating the level of faulty rationalizations these people represent.

 

[PaulaGem]

Yes, she does appeal more to the Huckabee crowd than the McCain crowd, which is why she was chosen. And while I have zero use for Huckabee, his supporters I have found to be both sympathetic and helpful to us.

And Deborah has a point. We may not be able to build our own coalition sufficiently, even with the financial meltdown making us look brilliant. We may well have to at least talk nice to 'less idealogically pure' conservatives to accomplish what must be done.

From my perspective you are going to have to appeal to the dreaded "liberals" too...

It also appears to me that the ideologies on this board alone are too fragmented to get anything done.

What about those who are trying to establish a "minimalist government" adopting a minimalist platform? The Constitution, Civil Rights and the Vote?

It appears that you guys got lucky on 1207 - people were scared enough to back it.

That isn't going to hold for most of the items that appear to be on the Libertarian agenda. Personally, I disagree with over half of what I read on hear and a lot of it is really dangerous and ignorant.

What if the solution the U.S. needs really isn't Libertarian but some sort of political coalition that hasn't been invented yet?

 

[PaulaGem]

After my exposure to the lock down on effort put forth in the primaries, I have very little faith in any change occuring in the short run. The system is corrupt. I doubt we will have any real choice the next go 'round either. Things will have to get much worse before the majority is able to see the error of their ways and be capable of rationalizing the use of brute force only allows victory to the violent aggressors and totalitarians. To give liberty is necessary to receive liberty.

I wish you two all the best but I will not be able to stomach tolerating the level of faulty rationalizations these people represent.

Even if the majority were to see the "error of their ways" as you define it personally, it wouldn't matter. The vote is broken, they couldn't do anything about it but whine.

 

[acptulsa]

From my perspective you are going to have to appeal to the dreaded "liberals" too...

I don't dread them, as I think you know. I've got very special arguments I use to try to win them over to our side, at least for national races. They work, too.

Don't use the same ones for Rocky and Bullwinkle fans--er, I mean more evangelical and/or rustic conservatives.

What if the solution the U.S. needs really isn't Libertarian but some sort of political coalition that hasn't been invented yet?

Don't see it--unless you mean by '[not] really libertarian' is very libertarian in national politics, but not necessarily in state or local politics. And, honestly, I think that proviso can help us create the greatest coalition in U.S. history over the next few years of economic chaos. Honestly. But we'll have to learn to play our cards right. Hell, some of the people around here would simply have to learn how to play cards...

 

[moostraks]

Even if the majority were to see the "error of their ways" as you define it personally, it wouldn't matter. The vote is broken, they couldn't do anything about it but whine.

define your version of broken...(I quite possibly agree...)

 

[reduen]

Read My Lips!!!!!

Palin is a Lying NEOCON bimbo and I will never get behind her! (Not even for what some of you men in here think of when you think of her behind.. )

It embarasses me for those of you who I have worked with for Ron Paul and liberty in general in here try to make excuses for this idiotic woman...

Please, please..., go back and review all of the interviews that she did while running for the V.P. position and wake up..! Then stop this Sarah Palin nonsense for good! Please..!

 

[moostraks]

I don't dread them, as I think you know. I've got very special arguments I use to try to win them over to our side, at least for national races. They work, too.

Don't use the same ones for Rocky and Bullwinkle fans--er, I mean more evangelical and/or rustic conservatives.

Don't see it--unless you mean by '[not] really libertarian' is very libertarian in national politics, but not necessarily in state or local politics. And, honestly, I think that proviso can help us create the greatest coalition in U.S. history over the next few years of economic chaos. Honestly. But we'll have to learn to play our cards right. Hell, some of the people around here would simply have to learn how to play cards...

I agree with you on this...We are each called according to our strengths, though, and some of us aren't meant to be mouths but hands or feet. Trust me on this!

 

[acptulsa]

define your version of broken...(I quite possibly agree...)

"More men have been elected between sundown and sunup than ever were elected between sunup and sundown."--Will Rogers

And this one:

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showpost.php?p=1599681&postcount=84

It would also be nice to help more people see the wisdom of his assertion that this nation got where it is in spite of politics, not by the aid of it. But that's another subject...

 

[PaulaGem]

define your version of broken...(I quite possibly agree...)

Just refer to the Stalin quote at the bottom....

 

[acptulsa]

Just refer to the Stalin quote at the bottom....

Bleah! Like, gag me with a spoon, dudette.

I'll stick to my Will Rogers quotes, thank you very much.

 

[Deborah K]

"More men have been elected between sundown and sunup than ever were elected between sunup and sundown."--Will Rogers

And this one:

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showpost.php?p=1599681&postcount=84

It would also be nice to help more people see the wisdom of his assertion that this nation got where it is in spite of politics, not by the aid of it. But that's another subject...

Will Rogers alludes to voter fraud. It reminds me of Stalin's quote: "It's not the people who vote that count. It's the people who count the votes."

Voter fraud is yet another concern of mine. Luckily in my neck of the woods the voting machines were NOT certified, which gives me some hope. But people who have them in their counties should fight to have them removed.

 

[Deborah K]

oh oops Paula beat me to the punch....lol

 

[Deborah K]

From my perspective you are going to have to appeal to the dreaded "liberals" too...

It also appears to me that the ideologies on this board alone are too fragmented to get anything done.

What about those who are trying to establish a "minimalist government" adopting a minimalist platform? The Constitution, Civil Rights and the Vote?

It appears that you guys got lucky on 1207 - people were scared enough to back it.

That isn't going to hold for most of the items that appear to be on the Libertarian agenda. Personally, I disagree with over half of what I read on hear and a lot of it is really dangerous and ignorant.

What if the solution the U.S. needs really isn't Libertarian but some sort of political coalition that hasn't been invented yet?

The anarchist/atheist element aside, you should have been here in our heyday. We were awesome. I miss those days. Btw, I'm not a libertarian, although I do agree with many of their principles. I am personally against a party system.

 

[moostraks]

Just refer to the Stalin quote at the bottom....

yep...we are on the same page

 

[tron paul]

We can debate her principles till the cows come home. If what you are saying is that your principles won't allow you to accept my take on co-opting her influence, then I guess you will have to find your own ways of strategizing to help save our country.

I intend to pull Palin supporters (and Palin, if possible) into the fold.

Amen! Nice to hear I'm not the only one that realizes if we don't join and influence whatever Palin is cooking up, we might lose our leadership role in the Tea Party movement.

That's "God's will" canard is really hurting her around here, even tho the quote is twisted to mean the opposite of what she really said.

Reminds me of fighting the MSM smears on Ron Paul. Feels like the right thing to do.

 

[dantheman]

I'm glad we're talking strategy now instead of just bashing Palin. That's like bashing Bush: it's too easy and everyone does it. But I still can't get behind the idea of supporting her. I'm glad Deborah K brought up the idea of infiltration, but this is one where America will just think we're crazier than we already are.

When people hear Ron Paul say we don't need something like the F.D.A. they don't take him seriously. And if people are going to blow off the most sound conservative of our time, how is a hockey mom from Alaska going to get any respect from the American people?!