***SUPER BROCHURE PROJECT Idaho***

[braane]

I wish RPP would stop this, I really do.

 

[LibertyEagle]

I'm sorry but this is bullshit. The super brochure scamsters haven't changed/updated/improved ANYTHING from what I can tell. If they have, I challenge you (or anyone else) to list the changes here.

You're mighty big there with name-calling, WD. Especially when you are incorrect.

I'm not going to list them all, but for one, they changed things like End the IRS to Phase out the IRS. They also added in a blurb about honoring the entitlement programs to seniors and veterans.

I haven't checked to see if it was finished, but a couple of months ago, they were moving the videos under their own account. This was for the purpose of making sure they had control of what videos they were suggesting to their readers.

http://www.ronpaulproducts.com/brochure2.html

 

[tom7126]

First off stop calling them "Super" you are not in Japan. Nor are they genuinely super, they are actually quite modest brochures.

Secondly nobody wants facts. Facts go in the garbage. People want DRAMA. AND PICTURES. Much like the internet.

USE THE BROCHURE MONEY TO ATTACK OTHER CANDIDATES.

I could run a much better direct mail campaign than this group.

 

[John F Kennedy III]

My god. A state we can win, a state that the campaign just opened a new office in due to increased confidence, and they are back again.

Why didn't these people donate this spare money to the moneybomb that is going on right now?

This. Apparently DP is some arm of the Establishment machine.

 

[low preference guy]

If voters think like the average Daily Pauler, the super brochures will definitely work.

Rev9

 

[Muwahid]

Lol a post on the dailypaul

Submitted by Zak Carter on Sun, 02/19/2012 - 13:24.
The free market works - Want to knock a competitor out of business? Come up with something better at a cheaper price.

they are treating it as a for-profit business, as their main priority. makes me kind of sick.

 

[Suzu]

Sad to say, but these are the facts!!
RPP="For Profit" and that's MAJOR profit, not just a few bucks for the extra effort/time!!

Assuming a three-cent profit per brochure - based on their figure of .07 being the actual cost of each one, plus 44 cents for a first-class stamp, and another penny for stickers to seal it, for a total cost of 52 cents each, and a price of 55 cents each to the customer - they would be taking in $3k per 100,000 sold. But we don't know how much work or overhead cost is involved for the vendor in selling 100k of the brochures, but let's assume half a cent per brochure to cover these unknowns, which would bring the income to $2500/100k sold.

Is this "major profit"? Well, I don't think it could be seen as a huge money-maker, but certainly worth doing IF the actual costs are as estimated. I think someone mentioned that more than a single 1st-class stamp is required to mail one of these brochures, but that cost could for all we know be offset by some sort of postage discount for volume mailings.

 

[IterTemporis]

Wouldn't brochures about electability be better? The campaign sends mailers out themselves, but they do not stress RP's electability. I don't think that grassroots should be sending out information covering the whole 9 yards, whilst the campaign also sends out mailers targeting the voter's main issue. I think Grassroots should do what the campaign is not doing, such as stressing electability.

 

[theeaglehaslanded]

It depends on what your goal is, if it is to increase the number of votes RP receives then this is counter productive at worst, very inefficient at best. However, if you're merely trying to give voters a compendium of facts about Ron Paul's stances on issues then sure, this probably works towards that end. I'm all for educating voters and with the volume of misinformation circulating about Ron Paul I think that's a worthwhile goal. But the thing to remember is that voters are rather fickle, and the more information you put in that brochure the more likely they are to find something that they don't like. As many have said, the key is targeting. I don't question the motives of those running the superbrochure project, I think they are well intentioned, and I honestly don't think it's being used for monetary gain. I just think that the effort is misguided. If the plan is to use the brochures purely as an adjunct when talking to potential voters, that's fine; as you can correct any misinterpretations as they arise. This is a luxury we don't have when we are mass mailing them to every potential voter in the state.

The answer is to target voters specifically on issues that are of importance to them, and to limit the potential of turning them off. If the most important issues to a voter are government spending and being pro-life, that is what the messaging should focus on. Why run the risk of turning someone off by mentioning Ron Paul's desire to end the IRS, foreign aid, voting against Iraq, etc. The campaign is placing a lot of attention and effort into identifying voters and the issues that will resonate with them. I know this personally. If you don't trust the campaign, then give your money to Endorse liberty which is run by a cadre of people with experience in marketing. This super brochure effort is carpet bomb, at this point we need to be targeted in our approach.

 

[ForLibertyFight]

Redesign the Super Brochures to be ONLY about: economy and electability.

 

[Anarchist]

They have a track record of hurting us. The people who run the project are biased. One of them I spoke to went so far as to say that Ron Paul surged in Iowa because of the Super Brochures, but people who were close to the campaign reported that they lost voters because of the brochures.

The brochures have not had any testing done on them, throw way too many issues on voters who may be more interested in single issues and they undermine mailings that the campaign sends out.

The brochures are simply just terrible if you're not already a Ron Paul supporter.

Please display evidence of the mailings the campaign is sending out that are being undermined.

 

[Xelaetaks]

Please display evidence of the mailings the campaign is sending out that are being undermined.

I'm not getting to my hometown but I believe they go to voting states in the weeks leading up, it's also been mentioned in some of Ron Paul campaign's emails.

 

[mmadness]

When I posted about the brochures early on, I gave my OPINION that they were not the best tool to use for mass-mailing and gave the reasons why I believed that to be true.

My opinion is not the same thing as fact. What you don't seem to understand is that all you have is an opinion too. Which is probably why you have resulted to insults and personal attacks.

Then, there was the whole thing with the videos being brought up by the search terms in the brochure. I kept raising the issue here until enough people seemed to realize the problem, then I considered my work done. Because it is not my decision whether someone wants to support this effort with their own money, but I wanted them to understand what they were responsible for sending out. A couple of other forum members, who now understood the problem, took it upon themselves to make sure other more appropriate videos were kept bumped up to the top. This solved the immediate problem.

Then, I contacted ronpaulproducts and talked to the guys. They had not realized what the search terms in their brochure were now pulling up. We talked about a solution which was to move all the videos they wanted to point to, to a channel that they controlled. This would end any possibility that people would be viewing a different video than they had intended. They were very open to recommendations and very gracious.

If you believed the brochures didn't work, then if they truly are listening to our feedback, then why have they not stopped the direct-mail campaign? The primary issue for most people is the actual direct-mailing of the brochures blind to people. Talking about the actual design of the brochure (which many with a marketing background think is flawed), is secondary. A few other people have posted about our efforts to contact them, and even design changes have not been implemented, other than obvious things like removing the coffins. In some cases people are still receiving the brochures with coffins. There was a mod Nirvikalpa who received one recently.

You can be as gracious and open to recommendations as you want, but actions speak louder than words. If you have reasonable doubts that the product does not work, and the possibility that they might even be hurtful, you've received feedback from multiple experienced grassroots sources, as well as indirectly from the campaign, then wouldn't you reasonably stop or at least suspend the program to re-evaluate?

My god, this is possibly our only chance to get a pro-liberty candidate with the calibre of Dr. Paul into office. For someone who is actively involved in these forums, I do not get the sense that you understand the urgency or what is at stake. My apologies if that comes across as an attack, but I simply do not understand this mindset of, "these brochures may hurt, but it's not a big deal." This is the impression I'm left with.

As we know with Iowa and Maine, these brochures could be the very thing that make the impact to turn voters away from Dr. Paul to make a difference. A "few votes here and there" matter.

If you're not concerned or are willing to listen to why people are so upset about these, then maybe you should listen. I don't see anyone else being pro-brochure here except for you and Curt, who has a vested interest in these.

And being critical of a product is not libel.

 

[floridasun1983]

For those asking for proof, the proof is in the fact that the principles of successful direct mail marketing are well established, and the Super Brochure violates most of them. I've taken college level marketing courses, and while that does not make me an expert by any means, it does make me qualified to at least understand why the Super Brochure is an issue and why it, at best, doesn't work. Just because it has Ron Paul printed somewhere on it doesn't mean that the rules of marketing no longer apply, just like Dr. Paul can't defy the law of gravity.

Frankly the money is better spent going to the campaign or, if you are maxed out, to one of the PACs where it can run some effective advertising.

 

[1stAmendguy]

"As president, Ron Paul will fix health care" is plainly stated on the brochures.

Oh really, so he wants to FIX Obamacare? This is a likely impression readers get. Is that the type of impression we want to make on potential voters in regards to Ron Paul's position on health care? You make the call.

RPP Super brochures - Made by amateurs

 

[radiofriendly]

Sorry to pile on to this, lol!

The saddest thing is that people who are obsessed with the Super Brochure (it's not "Super") think they are doing "canvassing." You aren't doing political activism--you are handing out a flyer for the Daily Paul or Ron Paul Forums---some people would rather do that...but
please stop pretending that you are canvassing.

Canvassing involves one essential thing. Asking,

"What is the most important issue motivating who you will be voting for in the election?"

(After you have qualified them as a likely voter in the caucus/primary.)

This whole principle, alone, should tell you all you need to know about why the Super Brochure has Zero to do with winning an election.

 

[LibertyEagle]

If you believed the brochures didn't work, then if they truly are listening to our feedback, then why have they not stopped the direct-mail campaign? The primary issue for most people is the actual direct-mailing of the brochures blind to people. Talking about the actual design of the brochure (which many with a marketing background think is flawed), is secondary. A few other people have posted about our efforts to contact them, and even design changes have not been implemented, other than obvious things like removing the coffins. In some cases people are still receiving the brochures with coffins. There was a mod Nirvikalpa who received one recently.

She did not receive it from ronpaulproducts. She received it from someone who had ordered them previously.

You can be as gracious and open to recommendations as you want, but actions speak louder than words. If you have reasonable doubts that the product does not work, and the possibility that they might even be hurtful, you've received feedback from multiple experienced grassroots sources, as well as indirectly from the campaign, then wouldn't you reasonably stop or at least suspend the program to re-evaluate?

My understanding is that they are constantly evaluating. Which is one of the reasons they are open to feedback.

I keep saying that if you have PROOF that the brochures are doing harm, contact them with it. For some reason, you don't seem to want to do the very thing that could affect the change that you desire.

My god, this is possibly our only chance to get a pro-liberty candidate with the calibre of Dr. Paul into office. For someone who is actively involved in these forums, I do not get the sense that you understand the urgency or what is at stake. My apologies if that comes across as an attack, but I simply do not understand this mindset of, "these brochures may hurt, but it's not a big deal." This is the impression I'm left with.

If you are left with that impression, that would be of your own doing. See, instead of whining about it on an internet forum, which by the way does absolutely zero good in affecting the change you desire, I picked up the phone and talked to Curt.

As we know with Iowa and Maine, these brochures could be the very thing that make the impact to turn voters away from Dr. Paul to make a difference. A "few votes here and there" matter.

If you're not concerned or are willing to listen to why people are so upset about these, then maybe you should listen. I don't see anyone else being pro-brochure here except for you and Curt, who has a vested interest in these.

There you go again, blubbering that I support the brochures, when I have told you more than once that I am not. At least with respect to them being mailed to Republicans. I have no vested interest in them whatsoever.

You can gather what evidence you have that they are hurting the campaign and contact Curt, or you can continue to blather on the internet, where it will do no good. It's your choice.

And being critical of a product is not libel.

I'm not an attorney, but let's check the definition, shall we?

Law .
a. defamation by written or printed words, pictures, or in any form other than by spoken words or gestures.
b. the act or crime of publishing it.
c. a formal written declaration or statement, as one containing the allegations of a plaintiff or the grounds of a charge.
2. anything that is defamatory or that maliciously or damagingly misrepresents.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/libel

Basically, back up your charges. Which to this point, you have not.

 

[Feeding the Abscess]

I'm just going to say that LibertyEagle has been extremely critical of most third party attempts to promote Ron Paul during this entire campaign (including the super brochure), so to see someone paint her as a supporter or promoter of the brochures is pretty funny.

 

[LibertyEagle]

I'm just going to say that LibertyEagle has been extremely critical of most third party attempts to promote Ron Paul during this entire campaign (including the super brochure), so to see someone paint her as a supporter or promoter of the brochures is pretty funny.

Well, those where we are competing with the campaign. PAC or other side grassroots efforts should complement, not compete, with the campaign.

 

[Teamronin]

In light of all the drama, mostly from some of our friends at the DP, I had some great conversations with the guys backing the Super Brochure Project, even after the results of South Carolina.. I understand the motives now of the whole project!!! The backers sent me this video, an insider look at the project today.. I now understand the intent of going forward!!!! A must watch guys!!! Thank them for the real inside look at the project, and telling the truth at last!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsQcgWmE5f4