Romney's Illinois chairman takes Ron Paul sign out and throws it down

[kickzman]

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/chi-straw_poll_web_aug17,1,5128267.story

"Paul's libertarian stylings and campaign of strict interpretation of the Constitution has earned him an unorthodox band of sign-carrying supporters. They frequently interrupted TV reports of the event and at one point, Romney's Illinois chairman, state Sen. Dan Rutherford (R-Chenoa), ripped a sign out of one Paul supporter's hands and threw it on the ground."



I wonder just what interrupting TV reports means. Romney supporters are probably angry that there are more Paul supporters showing up around cameras. I wish I can see video of this. Romney's chairman wanting all the media attention and gets mad at a Ron Paul supporter.

If I was the one holding the sign I would've knocked the old fart to the ground and spat on his face....Ok that would look bad, nevermind.

 

[Ozwest]

Unfortunately,the democratic system (or whatever you want to call it) is not so democratic. Ron Paul's campaign has to work within these perameters not as a matter of choice but necessity. Nonetheless,it should be obvious that victory will never be achieved by "towing the Party Line". There is a stirring in America and it's nearing a perfect storm for Ron Paul. Whilst nobody wants "bad press" or to step on the "establishments" toes (wait ti'll he wins) I believe the controlled aggression of Ron Paul supporters will ultimately win the day. If occasional shrapmetal damage should occur, so be it . After all this is a Revolution. Ozwest.

 

[fj45lvr]

OK...I've made my assertation of you. More on that later.

First off, what part of him stepping on someone else's property is not a violation to you?

2nd..LISTEN to the video....They didn't tell him to 'fuck it dude'. They said, 'gimme my sign back'...and he wouldn't...so the guy said 'fuck it dude...whatever then'.

Either you're a well control troll from the other campaign, or you're worse....and I'm not going to go into name calling because I've lost my cool here once, and I'd prefer to not do it again...

But if you were sitting in front of me....you'd know exactly what I think.


Oh, and to whoever said that if they'd been there, this guy would've lost that sign.....I would've helped you.

Make whatever assumptions you want about me but I had a "hunch" that that there is MORE to this story than what people are on the bandwagon about and as I suspected I was right:

"let me just say what my wife who is not a Ron Paul supporter said about it as she was waiting for me on a bench directly across from where this happened.

She told me that after seeing how the Ron Paul supporters act, she has no intention of ever supporting Ron Paul."​

I quess I'm different than you because in my book "swearing" is just NO CLASS especially in a crowd with kids around.

It boils down to the fact that unfortunately this kind of behavior from "supposed" supporters of Paul will only detur him from winning the primary.....you get more "flies" with HONEY than VINEGAR.

It's ironic that folks have been whining about being labeled "kooks" and "peace train" and "hippie retreads" when this kind of NEGATIVE activism by some supposed "supporters" just galvanizes those characterizations.....as I said previously I am confident that Paul would be embarassed and upset about it himself (especially foul language).

Those Paul supporters that don't want to see his chances "hijacked" by disrespectful "punks" that have no respect for others need to take action.....(for all the conspiracy theorists out there maybe the typical "anachists" are latching onto Paul as a democratic strategy as they don't want to face Paul in the general election as the Rep. Nominee) These anarchists are real "classy" folks....they're probably more worried about drugs than anything else!!

 

[MGS]

I too wish people would calm down when supporting RP. Wishful thinking i suppose.

 

[fj45lvr]

I too wish people would calm down when supporting RP. Wishful thinking i suppose.

No...just wisdom.

being excited and loud is a good thing when done "properly"....unfortunately that little bit of discretion may be too much for many of these folks in the "revolution"....the code word may be "revolting" ...behavior that is.

thats a shame because these other candidates are bad for america even though their supporters (not as young and boistrous) may seem well collected and "reverant".....if we are going to be considered "irreverant" it is funny in a way since Paul himself is the polar opposite....as demonstated in the debates by NOT butting in rudly.....I heard people complain that he should have lowered himself to acting that way...I guess they don't really know the character of the man.

 

[tmg19103]

I do think some RP suporters need to chill a little. Loud and bombastic alone can turn more than a few people off.

I think we need some more friendly type chants and cheers, but I also realize this is a spontaneous kind of thing and that it is often hard to suggest new ideas to passionate people.

As for the guy who stepped on the sign he was dead wrong. Rutherford ripping a sign from someone was wrong. The RP supporter who had the signed ripped from him could have been obnoxious, but you don't rip a sign from him - you get the police.

I think the shortened video plays well for RP and shows his supporters as decent even if one used the F word in a non-threatening way.

Sounds like both sides may have made mistakes, but the vid makes RP supporters look more reasonable. That's what the vid looks like, but since I was not there, I can't speak for the big picture.

 

[jonahtrainer]

Make whatever assumptions you want about me but I had a "hunch" that that there is MORE to this story than what people are on the bandwagon about and as I suspected I was right:

"let me just say what my wife who is not a Ron Paul supporter said about it as she was waiting for me on a bench directly across from where this happened.

She told me that after seeing how the Ron Paul supporters act, she has no intention of ever supporting Ron Paul."​

I quess I'm different than you because in my book "swearing" is just NO CLASS especially in a crowd with kids around.

It boils down to the fact that unfortunately this kind of behavior from "supposed" supporters of Paul will only detur him from winning the primary.....you get more "flies" with HONEY than VINEGAR.

It's ironic that folks have been whining about being labeled "kooks" and "peace train" and "hippie retreads" when this kind of NEGATIVE activism by some supposed "supporters" just galvanizes those characterizations.....as I said previously I am confident that Paul would be embarassed and upset about it himself (especially foul language).

Those Paul supporters that don't want to see his chances "hijacked" by disrespectful "punks" that have no respect for others need to take action.....(for all the conspiracy theorists out there maybe the typical "anachists" are latching onto Paul as a democratic strategy as they don't want to face Paul in the general election as the Rep. Nominee) These anarchists are real "classy" folks....they're probably more worried about drugs than anything else!!

You are right; there probably is more to the story. Perhaps if there were 'Ron Paul supporters' acting illegally then it may also be possible they were being paid by Romney's staff. As I understand it, none of the 'Ron Paul supporters' hold positions within the Ron Paul campaign and one of the fellows involved holds an official position within the Romney campaign. Sounds like this could be an event staged by Romney.

Romney people are upset because they are targeting these straw polls as media events for themselves. They don't want any other candidates actively competing in these events. Romney winning this small poll generated free publicity for him. His only other active competition is Ron Paul. When the cameras are rolling they don't want Ron Paul signs around.

I got a quick answer. Do not invite the public and do not invite other candidates. Have a straw poll with only one name on the ballot.

Realistically, this is politics. Part of politics is having the public involved and competing with ideas. Politics is about having a ideas that get people fired up to action. Politics is about having ideas that people will die for.

I think if all the Meetup groups started shadowing Romney events, like Orlando, it would be great. Everywhere he turns there should be Ron Paul signs. Then, perhaps, Romney will confront the ideas Ron Paul puts forth. Good luck though, that would be like David v. Golliath.

 

[Wyurm]

No...just wisdom.

being excited and loud is a good thing when done "properly"....unfortunately that little bit of discretion may be too much for many of these folks in the "revolution"....the code word may be "revolting" ...behavior that is.

thats a shame because these other candidates are bad for america even though their supporters (not as young and boistrous) may seem well collected and "reverant".....if we are going to be considered "irreverant" it is funny in a way since Paul himself is the polar opposite....as demonstated in the debates by NOT butting in rudly.....I heard people complain that he should have lowered himself to acting that way...I guess they don't really know the character of the man.

I agree with you, but here's the catch. The message we are spreading is of freedom, and different people have a different understanding of what that means. I was raised to show everyone respect, yet be assertive. Ron Paul clearly exibits that as well, he makes sure his words have massive impact even when hes only allowed a few seconds in which to say them.

I would have rather seen people passing out slim jims to the romney supporters and explaining what Paul wants for our country. Remember most of these people aren't really supporters, they just want an all expenses paid day out. Heck, if I wasn't supporting anyone and I was offered somethng like that, I would take it too. All you have to do is press a button and you get a free meal, entry to the fair, a ride and even a free work shirt. How awsome is that?

So, when they sit there and see Ron Paul supporters in great numbers it looks good, when they see Ron Paul supporters showing passionate enthusiasm about their candidate, they want to be a part of that, and when they see Ron Paul supporters acting rude and disrespectful, they change their mind and decide they would rather not be a part of that. The Romney paid supporters are a good thing and we should treat them like what they are: future Ron Paul supporters that are getting a free vacation on Romney's tab.

However, I'm not going to try convincing anyone to be considerate that something you have to think about. Is what you're doing going to gain votes or lose votes? Is insisting on justice and your freedom of speech going to make sure you get to keep your freedoms in the future by having Ron Paul as president? or is it just a selfish indulgence that will cost you your freedoms in the future? Also, as has been pointed out before, some people arent actually Ron Paul supporters, but are trying to stir up trouble.

Anyway, its not necessary to dwell on it too much, the overall effect of the Straw poll was awsome. I spent about an hour total riding on the tram while holding my Ron Paul for president sign. It was like having an ad on the side of a bus. Ron Paul got a massive amount of name display time at the fair and all in all it was a very good experience.

 

[fj45lvr]

. Remember most of these people aren't really supporters, they just want an all expenses paid day out. .

I'd really like to know how many of his "supporters" are members of the LDS church?? I have no idea now but I suspect that he has a rather big captive audience there on the single issue of folks that VOTE and don't consider much beyond that. I have yet to read any reports on this aspect of his support.

 

[romelll]

Sorry, got to do it after watching that video

Ring Ring:

"Hello, Sen. Dan Rutherford offices"

Gooten tag Frau, is Gruppenfuher Rutherford in?

Yes, would you like to talk to him?

Ya vol!

"Ya"

Gruppenfuher Rutherford, do you have a brownshirt?

"Why do you ask?"

"Vell, the strong arming of fellow countryman reminds me of tactics used by another group of individuals. Would you like to join the Ill. Nazi in a fun romp chasing men that look like Hazidic Diamond Merchants?

Click

No, I did not call nor would I want anyone to call. If you don't know the references that it could come across pretty bad. So don;t use this idea. Had to vent

 

[FluffyUnbound]

Romney's people were in the wrong, there were tons of state police there all they had to do is ask one to help out if there was a problem, rather than taking matters into their own hands and making a scene. However, and keep in mind I was actually there, the RP supporters weren't in the right either. Instead of picking the whole thing apart, let me just say what my wife who is not a Ron Paul supporter said about it as she was waiting for me on a bench directly across from where this happened.

She told me that after seeing how the Ron Paul supporters act, she has no intention of ever supporting Ron Paul. It took me a good long while to convince her that its a minority of supporters that become agressive and cross the line. She also told me that the guy who had his sign stood on was screaming and swearing directly infront of another supporter and his children. She said the man covered his children's ears and asked the angry supporter if that was necessary.

I stayed out of it, I'm not going to allow myself to be associated with that sort of behavior. Its good to support Ron Paul, but not good to push it to the point of giving him a negative appearance. My wife also said that the chairman who ripped the sign out of that guys hand was talking on the phone to Romney asking him where he was (Romney did show up later, gah he is so out of touch with most American's). She said the chairman told Romney that Ron Paul's campaign manager had some very good points, but his supporters are insane. I know you wont care about that, but it is good to know what your opponents are saying about you. Also, what some call insanity isnt really insanity its just passion.

So what do I think you should do. Well, I think you should be aware that both parties were in the wrong and I do actually hate that jerk that was standing on the sign. I'm not going to make a big deal out of it because I know it was a situation where most everyone was being respectful, yet about 3 or 4 on both sides turned it into a bad thing. You of course can complain if you want especially if you weren't there. Definitely feel free to complain about the guy that stood on the sign cause hes just plain repulsive in person.

You know what's missing from your post here? An actual description of the behavior your wife didn't like.

Unless you're going to specifically describe what you saw, you aren't adding any information, and your criticism and advice are utterly worthless.

 

[Dave Wood]

Make whatever assumptions you want about me but I had a "hunch" that that there is MORE to this story than what people are on the bandwagon about and as I suspected I was right:

"let me just say what my wife who is not a Ron Paul supporter said about it as she was waiting for me on a bench directly across from where this happened.

She told me that after seeing how the Ron Paul supporters act, she has no intention of ever supporting Ron Paul."​

I quess I'm different than you because in my book "swearing" is just NO CLASS especially in a crowd with kids around.

It boils down to the fact that unfortunately this kind of behavior from "supposed" supporters of Paul will only detur him from winning the primary.....you get more "flies" with HONEY than VINEGAR.

It's ironic that folks have been whining about being labeled "kooks" and "peace train" and "hippie retreads" when this kind of NEGATIVE activism by some supposed "supporters" just galvanizes those characterizations.....as I said previously I am confident that Paul would be embarassed and upset about it himself (especially foul language).

Those Paul supporters that don't want to see his chances "hijacked" by disrespectful "punks" that have no respect for others need to take action.....(for all the conspiracy theorists out there maybe the typical "anachists" are latching onto Paul as a democratic strategy as they don't want to face Paul in the general election as the Rep. Nominee) These anarchists are real "classy" folks....they're probably more worried about drugs than anything else!!

As far as the swearing, you can thank the left and their hollywood Ghetto rap promoters. The schools are doing a pretty bad job as well in teaching societal norms. The swear I heard came after the assault and theft that I witnessed, the guy standing on the sign was simply lucky that he didnt end up in the emergency room, pretty stupid to do that in the middle of a very passionate crowd imho.
This is a REVOLUTION people, WAKE UP! Stop with this political correctness B.S., it wont work. We have to do whatever it takes and if we alienate some along the way then that is just too bad!! The mission is too important. With all respect to your wife, she doesnt get it. Maybe a little uninformed or closed minded, either way she is the enemy of our movement and she would never be on our side anyway. Just so you know I am a 40 year old educated business owner, husband, father.

 

[fj45lvr]

This is a REVOLUTION people, WAKE UP! Stop with this political correctness B.S., it wont work. We have to do whatever it takes and if we alienate some along the way then that is just too bad!! The mission is too important. With all respect to your wife, she doesnt get it. Maybe a little uninformed or closed minded, either way she is the enemy of our movement and she would never be on our side anyway.

Dave:

I have a problem with your characterization.

"We have to do whatever it takes"

What's your point here? This was a "poll" so it took "voting".... the fact that supporters like myself wear shirts, buttons, wave signs is a means to "advertise" or "product labeling" if you will......it does NOTHING to explain the benefits of the "product" in our case the "ideas" of Paul....this requires more than mere signs and packaging but either an explaination from a "teacher" that shares it or people seeking out that information on their own where they will decide for themselves.....I am hoping that Paul supporters aren't shallow enough to believe that others should merely vote for Paul because of the wild enthusiasm they demonstrate....but rather because of the IDEAS of Paul in relation to the rule of law. What if currently their were another candidate that had even larger crowds of supporters that were enthusiastic but the ideas were for socialism (bigger government and regulations)???? think about it.

if we alienate some along the way then that is just too bad!!

If we alienate people because they reject the ideas then I agree.....If they are alienated on the other hand because of something else and NEVER hear the ideas because of this something else then WE ARE THE LOSERS and we have done MORE harm than good.

The mission is too important

the mission is to garner the Republican nomination so that Paul can be elected president (short term mission)....this will be accomplished if Americans are educated to his ideas not because they witness an awesome display of "activism". That is what Paul is doing is "educating" people on the "rule of law" based on common sense.

With all respect to your wife, she doesnt get it. Maybe a little uninformed or closed minded, either way she is the enemy of our movement and she would never be on our side anyway.

that is just plain ignorant.

 

[FluffyUnbound]

I'd still like to know exactly what the Paul supporters did that you think they should not have done.

I need it explained to me using nouns and verbs. I can't make much use of an adjectival description like "They were obnoxious."

I realize I'm being a bit of a jerk about this, but I can't help suspecting that when described with nouns and verbs, it will be something like, "The Romney chairman was trying to speak to the TV crew, and the Paul supporters were chanting so loud he couldn't conduct his interview," or "The news crew was filming the Romney chairman, and Ron Paul supporters were waving signs in the background," and if it's either of these things, tough nuggets.

 

[MozoVote]

This stuff is such small beer compared to the 1968 and 1972 conventions and the passions people had there.

Oooo! He yelled at me! Heyyyy! He took my sign!

But it is a good thing that no "crowd mentality" took place. We don't need fistfights and mace on the local news.

 

[fj45lvr]

but I can't help suspecting that when described with nouns and verbs, it will be something like, "The Romney chairman was trying to speak to the TV crew, and the Paul supporters were chanting so loud he couldn't conduct his interview," or "The news crew was filming the Romney chairman, and Ron Paul supporters were waving signs in the background," and if it's either of these things, tough nuggets.

I guess Americans have been just to darn brain washed by ESPN "gameday" with a mass of wild "fans" in the background making a spectacle of themselves....

politics is about IDEAS.

I agree that having signs in the "background" would be fine .....however, it would be totally RUDE and immature for these "kids" to shout over the conversation or interview (totally BUSH LEAGUE)

Think of the golden rule people....would you be happy if Paul was drowned out by the some other supporters??? Thats the bitchin and moanin I hear all the time about the MSM (on another level) whereas these "corporations" are DROWNING out the message......we don't like it because it is BS just like those guys wouldn't like it happening there in Illinois because it is BS. let LIBERTY shine and it is in words! and thoughts not DEMONSTRATIONS. (if you disagree with that consider if you will all the massive demonstrations that Saddam Hussein used to have in Iraq)

 

[constituent]

fj45...

really though, what does being an archist have to do with anything? that sort of behavior says nothing about the person's politics. on a site like this, it is probably best you refrain from making such broad generalizations. the "anarchists" that one tends to see around amongst the protest kids are likely planted there, they instigate stuff you know... but that has nothing to do with anarchy is in fact quite the opposite....

so leave that garbage at the door.

 

[Wyurm]

You know what's missing from your post here? An actual description of the behavior your wife didn't like.

Unless you're going to specifically describe what you saw, you aren't adding any information, and your criticism and advice are utterly worthless.

She didn't like the Ron Paul supporter screaming "Fascist!! F---!!! F---!!!" directly infront of some guy's kids. She didnt like them yelling at the reporter because he asked them to move out of his shot.

I dont get you people. I was there I was actually there in person and saw what happened with my eyes, I am telling you that both sides were in the wrong. Unless you were there, how can you say my argument is worthless?

I'm not going to argue with you guys. If you think its ok to distance yourselves from voters just because you feel you're right so you're all going to force your rightness on those who say your wrong, go for it.

I'm done with this discussion because its a waste of time to try reasoning on this matter. I know what I saw, but I'm sure all of you know better.

 

[fj45lvr]

I guess I misunderstand your take on "anarchist"...."anarchy" is defined as the 'complete absence of government' OR 'political disorder and violence'

We have anarchist "rallies" out here on the left coast where they trash cars, businesses as the crowd wanders down the streets and the people are stereotypically your basic sid viscious/punk wannabes, tats, piercings, dreads, etc.

Dr. Paul is the furthest away from "anarchy" as the most Conservative member of Congress trying desperately to get others to actually follow the "rule of law" as they swear they will uphold the Constitution (the supreme law of the land and protection from tyranny).

I guess from my perspective the "anarchists" (who show little to NO respect for anyone or thing) are more closely aligned with the dems...but I guess I'm biased there.

As someone else pointed out this kind of display could actually be an orchestrated "charade" to be used as a "politcal" tool....believe me people will do crap like that to maintain the power.

 

[RP08]

If I were not a Ron Paul supporter and wasn't completely dedicated to any one candidate yet...

* and I saw passionate people displaying and announcing their support for Ron Paul, I'd be intrigued to find out more.

* and a Ron Paul supporter extended a friendly handshake, I'd want to learn more.

* and a protestor / self-appointed revolutionary super-activist for Ron Paul was rudely yelling at or near me or especially my family, I'd likely be compelled to either: kick some ass, quickly get as far away from that shit as possible, or other. But one thing I'm absolutely sure I wouldn't be compelled to do is go out to seek more information on Ron Paul or want to be associated with that uncomfortable atmosphere.

It's not a "politically correct" thing to have manners and respect for others. And, it might just impress more people to become part of our important cause instead of being pushed away from it.

I have a great appreciation for passion and enthusiasm which is some of the stuff I enjoy so much about Ron Paul's grass-roots effort. I have, however, no tolerance for someone forcing themselves upon me or pre-emptively striking and acting like an ass to me.

This rEVOLution is a movement for something good and important, not one against non-(yet) Ron Paul supporters.