Rand Paul remarks on abortion

[cajuncocoa]

Republicans aren't serious about it as a whole, but Ron Paul was.

Ron was serious about everything he said. That's why I admire him so much.

 

[cajuncocoa]

There is absolutely no way Paul was more pro-life than Santorum.

Santorum wasn't more pro-life, just anti-sex.

 

[Tywysog Cymru]

No, I heard what he said. He said that there are two extremes, and that banning abortion with no exceptions is one of those extremes. And ironically, he was on that "extreme" back in 2010 when he filled out a survey from Kentucky Right to Life where he said that he supported banning abortion with no exceptions.

I'm really hoping he is just pandering like with foreign policy.

It would be really awesome to see Clinton in the Presidential debates talking about how the right to privacy means the right to abortion, and then have Rand Paul slam her for her support of the government's invasion of people's privacy.

 

[Tywysog Cymru]

Santorum wasn't more pro-life, just anti-sex.

Ron Paul's exposing of Santorum for voting to fund Planned parenthood was pretty epic, one of the best moments in the debates.

 

[Vanguard101]

He said that banning abortion is an extreme position, having the law where it is now is an extreme position, and he's somewhere in the middle between those two extremes. He's going to be labeled as a bigger flip flopper than Mitt Romney if he keeps this up. He's on record in 2010 as filling out a survey from the Kentucky Right to Life where he said that he supports a ban on abortion without exceptions for rape and incest. He'll fight on spending issues and civil liberties and take unpopular positions like abolishing the Department of Education, but he's afraid to take an unpopular position on an issue like abortion. That just makes me think that he's not serious at all or doesn't care at all about the abortion issue.

The middle ground is more than likely when the mother's life is ask risk. He didn't take the most extreme position in the Kentucky RLF survey. I don't think he's flip-flopping on this position. He does care about the abortion issue. It's just not a major issue.

 

[Brett85]

I'm really hoping he is just pandering like with foreign policy.

If he is pandering, then that's really stupid, because he has to make it through the GOP primary first. He's acting like he's already running for President in a general election. It makes no sense whatsoever.

 

[specsaregood]

He said that banning abortion is an extreme position, having the law where it is now is an extreme position, and he's somewhere in the middle between those two extremes.

Another lie. He didn't say HE was somewhere in the middle between those extremes. He said where he thinks the law could end up and where the country is. He says he thinks life begins at the beginning.

Prove me wrong: give me the timestamp where he says HE is somewhere in the middle.

He is asked it twice and both times he says the country is in the middle, but his personal beliefs are pro-life from the beginning.

 

[William Tell]

There is absolutely no way Paul was more pro-life than Santorum.

You are wrong, Santorum voted to fund Planned Parenthood. His record was not consistently Pro Life, Ron's was. Ron Paul introduced the Sanctity of Life Act: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanctity_of_Life_Act

 

[Brett85]

Another lie. He didn't say HE was somewhere in the middle between those extremes. He said where he thinks the law could end up and where the country is. He says he thinks life begins at the beginning.

So then he was saying that his own views on the issue are extreme?

 

[specsaregood]

So then he was saying that his own views on the issue are extreme?

YES! It was implied as such and both times he said it, he made a point to reference his religious beliefs. Did you actually listen to it?

You can say he gave a nonanswer, you can say he dodged the question; but you can't say what you claimed as it is untrue.

Personally, I think he laid out the gameplan for how pro-life people could actually make some progress on this issue and start getting exceptions made for life.

 

[Rocco]

That is not what he said at all. He said "my personal religious belief is that life begins at the very beginning. Where is the law gonna be? I think the law could find some inbetween."

In other words, he said that he believes life begins at conception, but the law will be somewhere in between having on demand abortion and none at all until we convince the country of our position. If we got a bill that protected life at 20 weeks would you support it? I certainly would, it'd be monumental. But to say Rand ever took a position other than "life begins at conception" is just incorrect.

He said that banning abortion is an extreme position, having the law where it is now is an extreme position, and he's somewhere in the middle between those two extremes.

 

[Brett85]

YES! It was implied as such and both times he said it, he made a point to reference his religious beliefs. Did you actually listen to it?

He said that he personally believes that life begins at conception. A lot of politicians, mostly Democrats, say they believe that life begins at conception but that they don't want to force their views on others. That's what I interpreted Rand as saying. He certainly didn't ever say that the law should protect the unborn from the moment of conception.

 

[Brett85]

That is not what he said at all. He said "my personal religious belief is that life begins at the very beginning. Where is the law gonna be? I think the law could find some inbetween."

In other words, he said that he believes life begins at conception, but the law will be somewhere in between having on demand abortion and none at all until we convince the country of our position. If we got a bill that protected life at 20 weeks would you support it? I certainly would, it'd be monumental. But to say Rand ever took a position other than "life begins at conception" is just incorrect.

Of course I would support a bill that bans abortion after 20 weeks, but I would also make it clear that this is only a minor first step, and the ultimate goal is to ban all abortions, except when the life of the mother is in danger, which is extremely rare.

 

[Rocco]

Plus effing rep. Bravo.

Another lie. He didn't say HE was somewhere in the middle between those extremes. He said where he thinks the law could end up and where the country is. He says he thinks life begins at the beginning.

Prove me wrong: give me the timestamp where he says HE is somewhere in the middle.

He is asked it twice and both times he says the country is in the middle, but his personal beliefs are pro-life from the beginning.

 

[specsaregood]

He said that he personally believes that life begins at conception. A lot of politicians, mostly Democrats, say they believe that life begins at conception but that they don't want to force their views on others. That's what I interpreted Rand as saying. He certainly didn't ever say that the law should protect the unborn from the moment of conception.

So now you are upset about what he didn't say; after getting upset about things you thought he said that he didn't?

You should step back and look at what he actually said and proposed. He proposed changing abortions laws in the pro-life direction, legislation that could have the majority of voters support.

 

[Brett85]

@Rocco-What do you think is the strategy behind this? Is this kind of rhetoric going to help him in Iowa and other deep red states? Why is Rand answering a question like that as if he's running in a general election campaign for President, when he has to win the GOP primary before he ever gets to that point?

 

[Rocco]

That is just not true, TC. He made very clear that if he had his way the law would reflect that life began at conception. But guess what? Rand doesn't get his way all the time. Sometimes there has to be a compromise. The law will more likely in the near term end up with something like a 20 week abortion ban, and that is what we should push for at this juncture. His is the pragmatic view on the issue that can actually reap benefits, as the public is SOLIDLY with us on that point. Why not get to 20 weeks and fight the next battle afterwards? The stupidity of conservative causes has been that liberals have been content to play this incremental strategy for years while we sit here and throw hail mary passes all day.

A lot of politicians, mostly Democrats, say they believe that life begins at conception but that they don't want to force their views on others. That's what I interpreted Rand as saying.

 

[William Tell]

Why is Rand answering a question like that as if he's running in a general election campaign for President, when he has to win the GOP primary before he ever gets to that point?

Good question.

 

[Rocco]

This was a poor answer strategically, I can certainly agree with that, but to say that he betrayed his pro life principles is WILDLY inaccurate

@Rocco-What do you think is the strategy behind this? Is this kind of rhetoric going to help him in Iowa and other deep red
states? Why is Rand answering a question like that as if he's running in a general election campaign for President, when he has to win the GOP primary before he ever gets to that point?

 

[Brett85]

So now you are upset about what he didn't say; after getting upset about things you thought he said that he didn't?

You should step back and look at what he actually said and proposed. He proposed changing abortions laws in the pro-life direction, legislation that could have the majority of voters support.

I'm upset with this constant waffling and non committal BS. He'll take an unpopular position when it comes to something like closing down the Department of Education, but won't do the same when it comes to abortion. It just makes me think that he doesn't care much about the issue, which is unfortunate. The main problem I had with what he said is when he said that banning abortion is an "extreme position." If Rand is just pandering, then I guess I won't ever be a politician, because I would throw up if I ever used the kind of rhetoric that he used in this interview.