Ranchers vs BLM Oregon this time

[jllundqu]

Hammons are getting screwed, twice, by the feds. The Bundy thing is stupid and counter-productive. Two separate issues.

 

[JK/SEA]

By what right do you think they have to waltz into someone else's state uninvited and unwanted and set up armed camp? They don't have wildlife refuges in their own state? This isn't about my permission, it's about the militias of Oregon who do not want them there.

huh?...you telling me militia groups must stay in their own State, and can't mobilize at will without permission from other groups?...seems a bit authortarian, and doesn't live up to the spirit of liberty...

c'mon...really?

this is way more than just about the Hammonds....

 

[GunnyFreedom]

huh?...you telling me militia groups must stay in their own State, and can't mobilize at will without permission from other groups?...seems a bit authortarian, and doesn't live up to the spirit of liberty...

c'mon...really?

this is way more than just about the Hammonds....

Seriously?

You seriously think it's okay to just waltz into someone else's State against their objections and start acting like you own the place?

Some random guy thinks you are abusing your dog, so he's gonna move into your kitchen with a shotgun. You think this is freaking okay?

 

[CPUd]

Church Statement — 4 JANUARY 2016
Church Responds to Inquiries Regarding Oregon Armed Occupation

SALT LAKE CITY —

In response to news media inquiries, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints issued the following statement Monday, January 4 (for more context on this issue, see this story from the Washington Post):

While the disagreement occurring in Oregon about the use of federal lands is not a Church matter, Church leaders strongly condemn the armed seizure of the facility and are deeply troubled by the reports that those who have seized the facility suggest that they are doing so based on scriptural principles. This armed occupation can in no way be justified on a scriptural basis. We are privileged to live in a nation where conflicts with government or private groups can — and should — be settled using peaceful means, according to the laws of the land.

http://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/church-responds-to-inquiries-regarding-oregon-armed-occupation

 

[Mach]

Oh, yeah, there is definitely a better than zero chance that this Payne guy is crooked as a three dollar bill. At this point I'd be more surprised if Payne wasn't a stooge than if he was. I wasn't thinking about him when I responded. I totally think he's dirty as hell.

Here are a couple things that have some, surveillance background.

https://www.oathkeepers.org/oregon-standoff-federal-provocateurs-sociopaths-and-idiots/

Still later, from the Oregonian:

Among those joining Bundy in the occupation are Ryan Payne, U.S. Army veteran, and Blaine Cooper. Payne has claimed to have helped organize militia snipers to target federal agents in a standoff last year in Nevada. He told one news organization the federal agents would have been killed had they made the wrong move. He has been a steady presence in Burns in recent weeks, questioning people who were critical of the militia’s presence. He typically had a holstered sidearm as he moved around the community. At a community meeting in Burns Friday, Payne disavowed any ill intentions.

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http://thisainthell.us/blog/?p=46564

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http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/agency/army/519mi.htm

F Co, 51st Infantry, 519th Military Intelligence Battalion

519th Military Intelligence Battalion (Collection) (Airborne)
519th Military Intelligence Battalion (Tactical Exploitation) (Airborne)

As part of the transformation of the 525th Military Intelligence Brigade to a Battlefield Surveillance Brigade in 2008, the 519th Military Intelligence Battalion transformed from a Tactical Exploitation Battalion to a Collection Battalion.

Previously, the mission of the 519th Military Intelligence Battalion (Tactical Exploitation) (Airborne) had been to conduct interrogation of prisoners of war, counterintelligence, and long range reconnaissance and surveillance in support of XVIII Airborne Corps and subordinate divisions.

The 519th Military Intelligence Battalion (Collection) (Airborne) was first constituted on 1 October 1948 in the Regular Army as the 519th Headquarters Intelligence Detachment and activated on 15 October 1948 at Fort Riley, Kansas. The Detachment was reorganized and redesignated on 10 May 1949 as Headquarters, 519th Military Intelligence Platoon, on 11 August 1949 as the 519th Military Intelligence Service Platoon, on 21 November 1951 as the 519th Military Intelligence Service Battalion, and again on 31 December 1953 as the 519th Military Intelligence Battalion.

The unit was reorganized and redesignated on 25 January 1958 as Headquarters and Headquarters Company, 519th Military Intelligence Battalion. The 523rd Military Intelligence Company was reorganized and redesignated on 15 July 1959 as Company A, 519th Military Intelligence Battalion. The 523rd Military Intelligence Company was first constituted on 25 September 1950 in the Regular Army as the 523rd Military Intelligence Service Platoon and activated on 10 October 1950 at Fort Riley, Kansas. The Platoon was reorganized and redesignated on 1 September 1952 as the 523d Military Intelligence Service Company and again on 28 March 1954 as the 523rd Military Intelligence Company. It was inactivated on 15 November 1954 in Korea before being reactivated on 25 January 1958 at Fort Bragg, North Carolina. As a result of this lineage, Company A was entitled to 7 campaign streamers for service during the Korean War: First UN Counteroffensive, CCF Spring Offensive, UN Summer-Fall Offensive, Second Korean Winter, Korea Summer-Fall 1952, Third Korean Winter, and Korea, Summer 1953. The Company had also earned one Meritorious Unit Commendation and 2Republic of Korea Presidential Unit Citations for its service in Korea.

During the Vietnam conflict, the battalion again left the United States and distinguished itself by participating in 16 campaigns: Defense, Counteroffensive, Counteroffensive Phase II, Counteroffensive Phase III, Tet Counteroffensive, Counteroffensive Phase IV, Counteroffensive Phase V, Counteroffensive Phase VI, Tet 69/Counteroffensive, Summer-Fall 1969, Winter-Spring 1970, Sanctuary Counteroffensive, Counteroffensive Phase VII, Consolidation I, Consolidation II, and Cease-Fire. The Battalion as a whole earned 3 Meritorious Unit Commendations, whicle Company C recieved an additional Meritorious Unit Commendation. In 1972, the Battalion returned to Fort Bragg, North Carolina.

After several reorganizations, the Battalion officially achieved a 3-company configuration in September 1978, with Headquarters, Headquarters and Service Company, Company A (Interrogation), and Company B (Counterintelligence). In April 1981, the Forces Command Intelligence Training Detachment (FITD) was attached to the Battalion, bringing with it the mission of training Army Reserve and National Guard units throughout the United States.

On 16 April 1982, the Battalion was reorganized and redesignated the 519th Military Intelligence Battalion (Tactical Exploitation) (Airborne), resulting in the activation of Company C (Electronic Warfare). Company C was subsequently inactivated and F Company (Long Range Surveillance), 51st Infantry Regiment was assigned to the Battalion to provide the Corps with long range surveillance capability.

The Battalion participated in combat operations in Grenada during Operation Urgent Fury, in Panama during Operation Just Cause, and in the Kuwaiti Theater of Operations during Operations Desert Shield and Desert Storm). The 519th Military Intelligence Battalion, as a subordinate unit of the 525th Military Intelligence Brigade, provided the highest quality ground-based Signals Intelligence, Human Intelligence, and Counterintelligence support to the XVIII Airborne Corps and Corps Major Support Commands.

As of mid-2001, the Battalion had elements deployed in support of Operations in Europe, Southwest Asia, the Caribbean, and the Pacific and remained ready to deploy world-wide in a moments notice.

In 2008, the 525th Military Intelligence Brigade transformed into a modular Battlefield Surveillance Brigade. The 519th Military Intellingence Battalion was reorganized into a Collection Battalion, but remained assigned to the 525th Battlefield Surveillance Brigade.

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What has the Federal Government been doing to get terrorist for many years now?

They feed them, encourage them and give them direction to their heroism.... with no real goals.




Problem
Reaction
Solution

 

[JK/SEA]

Seriously?

You seriously think it's okay to just waltz into someone else's State against their objections and start acting like you own the place?

Some random guy thinks you are abusing your dog, so he's gonna move into your kitchen with a shotgun. You think this is freaking okay?

this effort by patriot groups in Oregon is actually taking place on Federal Land. Harney County is owned by the feds. 75% of Harney county is controlled by terrorists.

 

[jbauer]

Seriously?

You seriously think it's okay to just waltz into someone else's State against their objections and start acting like you own the place?

Some random guy thinks you are abusing your dog, so he's gonna move into your kitchen with a shotgun. You think this is freaking okay?

It more accurately described as: if the government was beating your dog on your property and your neighbor decided to take over the post office thats within a stones throw distance-wise. Rather than your neighbor going on your private property.

I get it, I get asking the other "militias" I get that you don't care for their actions. I tend to agree that its probably counter productive. I'm not sure that its a requirement to poll the local community first. I'm not sure that other people get a say in "my" personal actions. Government oppression is government oppression regardless of where, when or how it happens. These folks are getting the long schlong of the government. Its absurd to put these guys back in jail after already paying for their "crime".

 

[phill4paul]

this effort by patriot groups in Oregon is actually taking place on Federal Land. Harney County is owned by the feds. 75% of Harney county is controlled by terrorists.

H.Q.

4701 N Torrey Pines Dr

Las Vegas | NV 89130-2301

Why go all the way to Oregon? Where they are not wanted. Plenty of targets in their own back yard.

 

[jllundqu]

Bottom line is this was supposed to be about the Hammons and their fight. It has now been successfully co-opted by the bundy's and their kind against the Hammons wishes.

 

[JK/SEA]

H.Q.

4701 N Torrey Pines Dr

Las Vegas | NV 89130-2301

Why go all the way to Oregon? Where they are not wanted. Plenty of targets in their own back yard.

why?...well, finances, logistics, holiday schedule, apathy, too cold...dunno...as to not being wanted...as i said in an earlier post, it could be that this issue is bigger than just the Hammonds, who are in the FEDS crosshairs for some odd reason, and that reason is subjective...just depends on what kind of coward one is..

 

[GunnyFreedom]

this effort by patriot groups in Oregon is actually taking place on Federal Land. Harney County is owned by the feds. 75% of Harney county is controlled by terrorists.

Land that exists inside of a STATE, where the very active STATE militias there DID NOT WANT them.

 

[jllundqu]

why?...well, finances, logistics, holiday schedule, apathy, too cold...dunno...as to not being wanted...as i said in an earlier post, it could be that this issue is bigger than just the Hammonds, who are in the FEDS crosshairs for some odd reason, and that reason is subjective...

It's no 'odd' reason.

The feds want their land! It's private property and they own the water rights and everything, but the feds want it and will stop at nothing to drive them out, much like that family outside area 51 that was forced out. In the Hammonds prior court case, they were forced to give the feds 'first right of refusal' for selling the property. Basically, if/when they ever have to sell the ranch, they are FORCED to sell it to the FEDS.

This is a land grab with massive fishy political undertones.

This is where the focus should have been kept... taking over the stupid building is a distraction, detracts from the cause, and makes the Hammons look really bad in their JUST FIGHT against the feds.

 

[JK/SEA]

Bottom line is this was supposed to be about the Hammons and their fight. It has now been successfully co-opted by the bundy's and their kind against the Hammons wishes.

this is more than just about the Hammonds....amirite?

 

[GunnyFreedom]

It more accurately described as: if the government was beating your dog on your property and your neighbor decided to take over the post office thats within a stones throw distance-wise. Rather than your neighbor going on your private property.

I get it, I get asking the other "militias" I get that you don't care for their actions. I tend to agree that its probably counter productive. I'm not sure that its a requirement to poll the local community first. I'm not sure that other people get a say in "my" personal actions. Government oppression is government oppression regardless of where, when or how it happens. These folks are getting the long schlong of the government. Its absurd to put these guys back in jail after already paying for their "crime".

You don't have to "poll the local community," you should ask the local militias if it's okay to do militia stuff inside of their state, and the Oregon militias have not exactly been silent about their disagreement.

And disagreement with Ammon Bundy in this one event does not imply support for the monsters of the BLM. Most of the Oregon militia members who have spoken against this, actually participated in the Bundy Ranch standoff.

 

[phill4paul]

why?...well, finances, logistics, holiday schedule, apathy, too cold...dunno...as to not being wanted...as i said in an earlier post, it could be that this issue is bigger than just the Hammonds, who are in the FEDS crosshairs for some odd reason, and that reason is subjective...just depends on what kind of coward one is..

All those "why's" would point that they should have looked no further than their back yard.

Militias are meant to be local. It doesn't mean that they can't join together but that is not what is happening in Oregon. It's pretty damn hypocritical to go up to Oregon and seize fed property in the name of the liberty movement as a whole when there is fed property right in their backyard. Perhaps they chose not to do that there because "you don't shit were you eat."

 

[JK/SEA]

It's no 'odd' reason.

The feds want their land! It's private property and they own the water rights and everything, but the feds want it and will stop at nothing to drive them out, much like that family outside area 51 that was forced out. In the Hammonds prior court case, they were forced to give the feds 'first right of refusal' for selling the property. Basically, if/when they ever have to sell the ranch, they are FORCED to sell it to the FEDS.

This is a land grab with massive fishy political undertones.

This is where the focus should have been kept... taking over the stupid building is a distraction, detracts from the cause, and makes the Hammons look really bad in their JUST FIGHT against the feds.

don't you think that by 'taking' over a deserted vistor center with open doors, is now getting much needed and embarrassing media attention towards the Feds, is actually working. Its now all over the cable news and internet....bearing fruit my friend. Stay tuned, and keep your powder dry.

 

[GunnyFreedom]

why?...well, finances, logistics, holiday schedule, apathy, too cold...dunno...as to not being wanted...as i said in an earlier post, it could be that this issue is bigger than just the Hammonds, who are in the FEDS crosshairs for some odd reason, and that reason is subjective...just depends on what kind of coward one is..

You think it was too cold in Southern Nevada so they had to go invade Eastern Oregon? 50° highs are too cold so let's go where the highs are in the 20's?

 

[JK/SEA]

All those "why's" would point that they should have looked no further than their back yard.

Militias are meant to be local. It doesn't mean that they can't join together but that is not what is happening in Oregon. It's pretty damn hypocritical to go up to Oregon and seize fed property in the name of the liberty movement as a whole when there is fed property right in their backyard. Perhaps they chose not to do that their because "you don't shit were you eat."

didn't militia groups from across the country go to Bundy's Ranch?...

 

[GunnyFreedom]

don't you think that by 'taking' over a deserted vistor center with open doors, is now getting much needed and embarrassing media attention towards the Feds, is actually working. Its now all over the cable news and internet....bearing fruit my friend. Stay tuned, and keep your powder dry.

You think they would have gotten less attention doing this in their own state where they weren't unwanted?

 

[phill4paul]

didn't militia groups from across the country go to Bundy's Ranch?...

Were militia groups from across the country ASKED to come to the Bundy ranch? By...the Bundy's.