Quick question

[Intoxiklown]

my wife is a 4th grade public school teacher, so be careful in painting a broad brush opinion of public schools.

This is the same with me and my wife. She is a Nurse Practitioner, and works as a mid level provider in the ER here. Because of her, I have gotten to know the bulk of the doctors, PAs, and NPs there. And not a single one of them adjusts their treatment to what some pharma rep suggested, nor do they wake up in the morning to get busy "wiping out people with their trickery medicinal ways". Only a moron would say that pharma companies aren't worried about their bottom line, but too many people assume that any relationship to them makes one evil and uneducated. There are a couple of posters who frequent the health section that have kept me from letting her sign up here, because if someone tries some of the circular logic used there with her, she'll eat their lunch. LOL....most of my posts there are simply me responding with what she sad between curse words while waking off.

The simple fact is nothing causes error more than lumping entire groups of people together in outlook and action, based solely on their career. And we are all guilty of it.

 

[mello]

This thread is veering off into other directions. I just wanted to know if Rand believes in abstinence only sex Ed or the comprehensive version? Does anyone know the answer to that specific question?

 

[helmuth_hubener]

I know that Rand is against abortion but is he also against comprehensive sex ed. classes & providing condoms for kids?

If he is smart he will be. This is a deeply-felt conservative issue. If asked about sex-ed, he should speak out about the outrageousness of sex-ed classes, give some examples of perversion, mention other awful, perverted things going on at schools and link that all together as: this is messed up, this is horrible, this should stop.

And mentioning states rights saying that all the local districts should decide wouldn't hurt, either. But that needs to be in context of "the Fed should stop forcing all the reasonable local districts to be horrible, and instead let them be free to uphold traditional values," and not, in contrast, giving the impression that "Oh, I don't want to take a position either way, so let me cop out and say that each community can decide to be perverted if they want to, or not if not. In other words I'm not a social conservative, I don't care about your concerns, and you can't really relate to me."

 

[The Gold Standard]

This thread is veering off into other directions. I just wanted to know if Rand believes in abstinence only sex Ed or the comprehensive version? Does anyone know the answer to that specific question?

Who cares? Rand Paul's opinion on sex education should not ever affect my life in any way.

 

[whoisjohngalt]

I know that Rand is against abortion but is he also against comprehensive sex ed. classes & providing condoms for kids?

Just wondering...

Well since the two are perfectly inversely correlated, you can't be against both. You can make any argument you want, but it falls on deaf ears, where comprehensive sex ed exists, abortion rates are dramatically lower and vice versa.

 

[Dr. Dog]

I am pretty sure teachers don't prohibit children from reading the bible...

Oh really?

Teacher stops student from reading the Bible to himself

When 7th grader Loyal Grandstaff’s parents found out that their son was reprimanded by a teacher for reading the Bible in class, they were in utter disbelief...

Read more at http://rare.us/story/teacher-stops-student-from-reading-the-bible-to-himself/#Bt36ZrWYrliRwT8t.99

Florida teacher stops student from reading bible


According to the Liberty Institute, a teacher at Park Lakes Elementary School in Ft. Lauderdale, Fla., on April 8 told fifth grader Giovanni Rubeo to stop reading from his Bible in class during a "free" period.

Then, the teacher called Rubeo's parents, leaving a voicemail explicitly stating that religious books are not allowed in public school.

http://mynorthwest.com/194/2515268/Florida-teacher-stops-student-from-reading-bible

[h=1]Teacher Tells Student Not to Talk About Bible in School: Lawyer[/h][h=2]A teacher interrupted a student who was presenting a family Christmas tradition that involved the star of Bethlehem during a class presentation, according to a lawyer for the student.[/h]
http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/l...Talk-About-Bible-School-Lawyer-240195351.html

 

[helmuth_hubener]

Well since the two are perfectly inversely correlated, you can't be against both. You can make any argument you want, but it falls on deaf ears, where comprehensive sex ed exists, abortion rates are dramatically lower and vice versa.

Umm, it does not fall on deaf ears, it falls on the only ears that actually exist. You know, like actual ears, on actual people, in the wild, out in the real world. All of the people opposed to sex-ed and giving out condoms are also opposed to abortion. And vise-versa almost as strongly. These are actual ears, attached to actual heads of actual people.

The ears you're imagining are some sort of hyper-rational ears that you've grown on the backs of rats in a lab somewhere.

 

[Dr. Dog]

Well since the two are perfectly inversely correlated, you can't be against both. You can make any argument you want, but it falls on deaf ears, where comprehensive sex ed exists, abortion rates are dramatically lower and vice versa.

That's strange, because multiple studies have shown that increased access to contraception leads to an increase​ in the abortion rate...

 

[JK/SEA]

Oh really?

my wife lets her pupils talk about their religion, time permitting. And as to the pledge, most days the entire school participates, but there are days they can't for various reasons. Why is that a problem?...perhaps you have a better idea on how to teach children to prepare for life?....especially when not everyone is of the same stripe?...she works in a low income school, and there are many kids who come from a terrible home life....

again...stop with the broad brush labeling of teachers and schools. Very tacky.

 

[Dr. Dog]

my wife lets her pupils talk about their religion, time permitting. And as to the pledge, most days the entire school participates, but there are days they can't for various reasons. Why is that a problem?...

The pledge of allegiance is worshipping the state. Forcing, or even encouraging, children to recite it is downright evil.

perhaps you have a better idea on how to teach children to prepare for life?....

I do have a better idea. Abolish public schools.

 

[JK/SEA]

The pledge of allegiance is worshipping the state. Forcing, or even encouraging, children to recite it is downright evil.



I do have a better idea. Abolish public schools.

yeah, i might agree with you on the pledge, but i don't really see it as a game changer. I actually wrote an essay on it in high school in 1968 claiming it falls into a form of brain washing, but as you can see, it didn't make me worship the State, as i'm one of those with a brain. So, i'm hopeful there are others that came after my stint in public schools that didn't sucumb to the attempted brain washing...so...meh..on the pledge paranoia

as to abolishing public schools...replace it with....what...exactly?

btw, my essay got an A+...but was told by the teacher i wouldn't be getting it back. I'm guessing its in my file at the FBI..

 

[erowe1]

I know that Rand is against abortion but is he also against comprehensive sex ed. classes & providing condoms for kids?

Just wondering...

I can't imagine that he supports spending federal funds on either of those things.

 

[Dr. Dog]

as to abolishing public schools...replace it with....what...exactly?

The free market.

Private schools, parochial schools, homeschooling, trade schools, whatever works for each individual family and child.

 

[erowe1]

Well since the two are perfectly inversely correlated, you can't be against both.

Of course you can be against both. What a ridiculous claim.

And they obviously aren't perfectly inversely correlated. You think the abortion rate was higher before schools started having sex-ed?

 

[PierzStyx]

I'd rather spend a couple bucks for contraception than potentially hundreds of thousands to house a kid in the foster system & then probably the prison system. I don't care if it's the government or private individuals/organizations that provide different forms of contraception (condoms, birth-control pills, etc.) Here are some stats about kids going through the foster system:

"Less than half were employed at 23, 24. They're much less likely to have finished high school, less likely to be enrolled in college or have a college degree."

In fact, by age 24, only 6 percent have two- or four-year degrees. More than two-thirds of the young women have children. Nearly 60 percent of the males have been convicted of a crime. Almost a quarter were homeless at some point after leaving foster care. Many former foster kids have a tough time out on their own. When they age out of the system, they're more likely than their peers to end up in jail, homeless or pregnant. They're also less likely to have a job or go to college. More report details here.

And I'd rather not pay for any of that. None of it is the government's role to begin with and your statistics just prove how terrible of a job state run programs are doing anyway.

 

[JK/SEA]

The free market.

Private schools, parochial schools, homeschooling, trade schools, whatever works for each individual family and child.

all those at the expense of whom?

homeschooling is a nice idea, but not for everybody.

 

[Dr. Dog]

all those at the expense of whom?

What do you mean by that?

homeschooling is a nice idea, but not for everybody.

I agree, I never said homeschooling is for everybody.

 

[JK/SEA]

What do you mean by that?

you expect people to teach or train other people for free?...money to pay for your private schooling and voctech training has to come from somewhere, and there are a lot of people with kids who can't afford those expenses...hence, public schools, that are paid through levy's and property taxes...

now, before you say give people the 'option', might i remind you that there is already a system working...albeit, not perfect, but private schools are expensive, and vochtech as well. If you think taxes are high now, if you got your way, we'd all be broke.

Parochial Schools i believe is a religious system am i right?...they are under the auspices of standards that must be fair and equal along side of public education, and if one has the financial means then cool...not for everybody.

 

[erowe1]

my wife is a 4th grade public school teacher, so be careful in painting a broad brush opinion of public schools.

I would think that experience would put her in the position of being especially knowledgable about how bad they are.

That's what my brief tenure as a public school teacher did for me.

 

[JK/SEA]

I would think that experience would put her in the position of being especially knowledgable about how bad they are.

That's what my brief tenure as a public school teacher did for me.

she loves her students. Most come from low income families. She's an excellent teacher, and the entire staff are very dedicated to educating these children.

Are there bad teachers and idiotic administrators?...of course, but its the same in just about every vocation out there from plumbers, to politicians...you bear down and put the pedal to the metal and keep going. My wife graduated Cum Lauda...4 point grade, from a 4 year University.