PA - Man leaves kids, 6 and 9 for 45 minutes at park. Gets arrested, CPS involved as well.

[Drex]

How ironic. They don't want a stranger to kidnap the kids. But with the NDAA they have the right to kidnap them.

 

[Anti Federalist]

I had a buddy who's parents still had a gremlin, well into the mid 80's. The floor board were rusted out in the back. I recall my friend getting screamed at by his mom for apparently dragging his foot on the road while the car was operating LOL. The fact that he could have lost his leg was not the point, it was that his shoes were brand new and now ruined. WTF? LOL... How we ever survived - I dont know.

Oh wow, did you just bring back a great memory.

I used to go camping with my folks and my grandparents.

I'm 10 to 12 over these summers.

Grandpa had a 1976 F100 (so did my dad, now that I think of it, he had Super Cab F100, and grandpa liked it so much he went out and bought one too, only it was a standard cab with an automatic) that he used to drive to the campground, and I would to ride with him to a camp woodpile (it was a state park that used to have a logging operation on part of it, these were cast offs and bark pieces) about three or four miles down dirt and pavement woods roads from the campsites.

We'd pile up a "rick" or two of wood on the lowered tailgate, and it was my job to ride on the back gate and help hold on to it so we didn't have to throw it into the pickup truck bed, where he had all his camping gear and cots and stuff. This happened many times over the course of a summer.

I would drag my feet along the dirt and the pavement just for kicks, sitting on the lowered tailgate as grandpa drove back to the campsite, as fast as 30 MPH at times.

And my mom would crab at me at the end of each summer, "Young man, how the hell did you wear out the soles of your new boots already??!!!".

"I dunno Mom, must have worn them out riding my bike...honest!"

ETA - In violation of all the rules, my kids love the times when I let them ride in the back of my truck.

 

[JK/SEA]

All these stories of us 'older' folks growing up in relative freedom, makes me want to watch that movie 'Stand By Me'...

geez...i'm getting lots of memory flashbacks from this thread...

 

[kuckfeynes]

What the heck? Didn't read 8 pages, but don't tell me people here have a problem with a 9 year old watching a 6 year old while outside playing.
I've only been alive for 3 decades, and even I remember a time when this was normal.
In a small city, before cellphones even. Just be home by dinner.
Physical abuse is pretty cut and dry and easy to identify. Negligence is a totally subjective concept. Quit trying to Nerf the world.
At least these kids were outside. I'd say parents who let their kids sit in front of screens for hours a day are far more negligent.

 

[Yieu]

When I was around that age, I used to go hiking in the woods halfway up a mountain with my cousins who were the same age.

Sometimes I would just wander into the woods or streets alone to do whatever it was I wanted to do. I walked and road my bike everywhere around that age.

I walked to middle school about 3 miles. And yes, there were steep hills going both ways, and there was snow.

 

[Anti Federalist]

What the heck? Didn't read 8 pages, but don't tell me people here have a problem with a 9 year old watching a 6 year old while outside playing.
I've only been alive for 3 decades, and even I remember a time when this was normal.
In a small city, before cellphones even. Just be home by dinner.
Physical abuse is pretty cut and dry and easy to identify. Negligence is a totally subjective concept. Quit trying to Nerf the world.
At least these kids were outside. I'd say parents who let their kids sit in front of screens for hours a day are far more negligent.

Yeah, a few did.

 

[Anti Federalist]

Well now, this really seemed to touch a nerve.

I thought it might have been in the 80s when everything started to go downhill, but there are plenty of 30 something posters saying that they grew up relatively free as well.

Question: when did this change?

Mid 90s crime wave?

9/11?

Later?

 

[KCIndy]

But even within our own merry little band of refuseniks, when I "attack" certain varieties of privacy invading, personal monitoring technology, like FarceBook for instance, I get pushback even here, from people who should know better, because of all the "convenience" it offers.

That's the part I find so damn depressing.

 

[tod evans]

Well now, this really seemed to touch a nerve.

I thought it might have been in the 80s when everything started to go downhill, but there are plenty of 30 something posters saying that they grew up relatively free as well.

Question: when did this change?

Mid 90s crime wave?

9/11?

Later?

I think it is more geographical than chronological.

 

[KCIndy]

Well now, this really seemed to touch a nerve.

I thought it might have been in the 80s when everything started to go downhill, but there are plenty of 30 something posters saying that they grew up relatively free as well.

Question: when did this change?

Mid 90s crime wave?

9/11?

Later?

I remember 9/11 and its aftermath as being the real turning point where the "conventional wisdom" of the populace began to swing to the idea of "safety at any cost." Before that, the Columbine shooting in '99 marked the real nightmare of totalitarian authority in schools; metal detectors, pat-downs, armed guards, etc were (to my memory) largely unknown before that.

(side note: tomorrow marks the 13 year commemoration of the Columbine shooting)

 

[Danke]

I remember the glazed look of utter shock on the older women next to me in line at the airport, when they were trying out that new passenger interrogation screening, as I loudly refused to answer any questions, based on my 5th Amendment right to remain silent.

I'd imagine you get that look a lot, especially from fellow passengers.

 

[Yieu]

I believe it was after the time of the events at Columbine and more so after 9/11 that schools seemed to be starting to go on lock down and the freedoms of children in the eye of the public started diminishing, but you could see it creeping in slowly before that.

But then, my freedom to roam could have been local to my family and community. And my extended families' communities, both of them.

 

[JK/SEA]

Well now, this really seemed to touch a nerve.

I thought it might have been in the 80s when everything started to go downhill, but there are plenty of 30 something posters saying that they grew up relatively free as well.

Question: when did this change?


Mid 90s crime wave?

9/11?

Later?

its been 'incremental'

Boomers for instance grew up with cars with no seatbelts...now you can get your kids taken away if caught without them on.

In between 'those times' and now, we can fairly pinpoint certain instances of incrementalism being applied, and lawmakers with nothing better to do except make points with corporations and insurance companies putting the squeeze on to maximize profit with 'safety devices' and Insurance companies making the extra dough with higher insurance rates all in the guise of 'safety'. Of course this is but one example. CPS fits in there someplace...i'll let someone else comment on that aspect.

 

[Anti Federalist]

I remember 9/11 and its aftermath as being the real turning point where the "conventional wisdom" of the populace began to swing to the idea of "safety at any cost." Before that, the Columbine shooting in '99 marked the real nightmare of totalitarian authority in schools; metal detectors, pat-downs, armed guards, etc were (to my memory) largely unknown before that.

(side note: tomorrow marks the 13 year commemoration of the Columbine shooting)

Great, great point, Columbine had completely slipped my mind, yeah, the ruckus over that was deafening and the fallout is still being dealt with.

I owe ya another rep.

 

[Anti Federalist]

I'd imagine you get that look a lot, especially from fellow passengers.

Har har har...

 

[Yieu]

I remember 9/11 and its aftermath as being the real turning point where the "conventional wisdom" of the populace began to swing to the idea of "safety at any cost." Before that, the Columbine shooting in '99 marked the real nightmare of totalitarian authority in schools; metal detectors, pat-downs, armed guards, etc were (to my memory) largely unknown before that.

(side note: tomorrow marks the 13 year commemoration of the Columbine shooting)

Beat me to it.

 

[Yieu]

its been 'incremental'

Boomers for instance grew up with cars with no seatbelts...now you can get your kids taken away if caught without them on.

In between 'those times' and now, we can fairly pinpoint certain instances of incrementalism being applied, and lawmakers with nothing better to do except make points with corporations and insurance companies putting the squeeze on to maximize profit with 'safety devices' and Insurance companies making the extra dough with higher insurance rates all in the guise of 'safety'. Of course this is but one example. CPS fits in there someplace...i'll let someone else comment on that aspect.

This is true to an extent, they did have more freedom further in the past.

The thing is, the rate of tyranny has accelerated much faster than it had in the past, since the late 90's and early 00's.

They now use the excuse of "it's for safety because of 9/11" even if the situation does not relate to 9/11.

 

[newbitech]

All of the reminiscing about the good old days reminds me of one difference between then and now. It seemed that everything was in walking or quick bike ride from the house, especially when we were under ten. When the inevitable broken leg or bloody gash occurred, someone's house was within a quick run for help.

It would have been pretty strange to be driven to a far away park and left there for hours. In this particular case, it sounds like the Father was playing tennis a short distance away, which would be within a quick run if the kids knew how to get there. Driving to the gym may have put him out of reach though.

I don't think so. there are tennis courts at the park, the walmart is across the creek and the gym is a mile or two up the road. These are fairly tight nit communities. They are old mining and lumber communities in the south suburbs of Pittsburgh. These are decedents of immigrants from south east Europe, Slovania, Croatia, Bosnia etc.. The rolling hills reminded them of back home so I am told.

The park has a row of homes and a middle class neighborhood on the border. I wouldn't doubt if the family lives right there in the hood. If the kids were going to run somewhere, it'd probably be to their house.

 

[newbitech]

Well now, this really seemed to touch a nerve.

I thought it might have been in the 80s when everything started to go downhill, but there are plenty of 30 something posters saying that they grew up relatively free as well.

Question: when did this change?

Mid 90s crime wave?

9/11?

Later?

I noticed some real crack downs on young people hanging out after hours in the late 90's with the rave scene and Ecstasy being popular. Before the crack downs, you had clubs in Ybor City and around Tampa that stayed open until 3am catering to 18-21 crowds. You know, freshly minted adults that still weren't aloud to drink. Those clubs weren't strictly 18 and up though. There was no such rules that I recall, and if there were, it didn't really matter. I started these clubs right around 15-16, when I could drive. The real crack down came when Ybor turned in to commercial central instead of the cultural icon that it is misleadingly now known for.

 

[angelatc]

I take it my comment touched a nerve, and you'd rather not face the reality that children are abducted, everyday.

Sorry.

If you'd turn off Nancy Grace and actually pay attention to facts, you'd know that stranger abduction is actually pretty rare. Almost all abductions are by people known to the child and trusted by the parents. But thanks for playing.