Official Health Care Ruling Thread (Obamacare upheld)

[cajuncocoa]

It's happening. I am seeing it first hand. More people who have said they would never vote for Romney are now thinking about it. People are mad and will do irrational things.

Well, I can understand the sentiment right now...people are angry today. But when they're thinking more clearly, we should remind these folks that politicians will say whatever needs to be said to get your vote...once they have it, they find reasons not to do it so they can say "I have more work to do" when they run for re-election. Romney will not overturn Obamacare, just as Obama didn't stop the wars (he made more of them!) Talk is cheap.

 

[AuH20]

I'd feel much better about this if statists didn't outnumber us so heavily.

But many of the statists are weak and ignorant. They will fall in line to whomever grabs victory. Much of the public is very malleable in their opinion.

 

[romancito]

This is getting unbearable.

Is only Chinese. But it is difficult to learn Chinese from non-Chinese speaking people. Anyhow let the nightmare begin.

Even cities will be able to fine and sue local employers and national chains for whatever unhealthy practices they may wish to undo. Just like New York city is doing. I bet cities and counties will fill a new position of healthcare compliance officer. It will be the solemn duty of each city to protect the public from unwarranted unhealthy practices of all types. Then your health insurance rates will be correlated to your city, county and state enforcement of healthy practices.

Where will these health officer have their conventions and trainings? I bet way out there in Aruba.

So how much do you think you will be paying for a sandwich and a milk shake? Like 20 or 25 dollars.

I love it when the absurd becomes the absurder.

 

[Anti Federalist]

Which entails tearing down our corrupt institutions and imprisoning all the perpetrators. History has shown us that you can't vote tyrants out. You must physically remove them.

+rep

 

[WhistlinDave]

I just heard on CNN or whatever it was the wife had on a little while ago, somebody said something along the lines of,

"Well most people regard Romney as the 'father' of Obamacare. So now Romney is saying he's the only one who can save us from Obamacare. I wonder if the voters are going to realize the irony of this in November, that the father of Obamacare is saying to vote for him because he will save them from it?"

 

[truelies]

WTF??!!! Roberts?!

I don't get this at all. This is so obviously not constitutional.

The 'constitution' is what the Party says it is. Any different idea is Crime Think. Plan on a visit to Room 101.

 

[The Free Hornet]

What's our next move? //

Or do I just have to take it.

Starve the beast. The medical industry is a corrupt cesspool of protectionist and monopolistic practices (e.g., between patents, FDA, and import restrictions, they control our medicine). The AMA has for two centuries worked to reduce the number of medical practicioners and to restrict what can be done by anybody to anybody without their blessing.

I am inclined to cancel my healthcare insurance. If I need care, I'll negotiate and/or sue. Negligence, malpractice, or the asking price is just too damn high. Sue them for any reason or none at all. Accuse them of criminal acts if they don't set the price you think or feel is fair. Stop pretending like this is a free market.

Doctors are jack-booted statists. Treat them accordingly. The few good doctors that are out there will play ball. The rest deserve whatever misery we can give them.

Insurance is a gigantic "FUCK YOU" on top of this corrupt industry. They take a cut and are paid to be gatekeepers and to "manage" (ration) our care.

That's all I got. Either I have the balls to cancel health insurance or I am complicit in this bullshit. Don't know what to do...

 

[IDefendThePlatform]

He's saying that to get elected. Even Goldwater retracted his campaign promise to make S.S. voluntary after the media villified him. Rand is playing the game.

The media vilifies anyone who wants to cut it, or raise the retirement age, or decrease 'benefits' or...etc etc. We need to change the debate, not accept defeat on that issue and try to say "SS just needs reformed, but other stuff needs to eliminated on moral grounds."

Ron doubled his vote total from '08 to '12 and he didn't change his message at all. He converted people. That's what we need to focus on. Convert and stick to principles until our principled voting block is bigger than the margin of victory/defeat.


Also, where's your evidence for knowing Rand really, deep down wants to eliminate social security? I'm not convinced he does.

He doesn't want to eliminate the income tax, or so he continually says.

 

[AuH20]

The media vilifies anyone who wants to cut it, or raise the retirement age, or decrease 'benefits' or...etc etc. We need to change the debate, not accept defeat on that issue and try to say "SS just needs reformed, but other stuff needs to eliminated on moral grounds."

Ron doubled his vote total from '08 to '12 and he didn't change his message at all. He converted people. That's what we need to focus on. Convert and stick to principles until our principled voting block is bigger than the margin of victory/defeat.


Also, where's your evidence for knowing Rand really, deep down wants to eliminate social security? I'm not convinced he does.

He doesn't want to eliminate the income tax, or so he continually says.

Rand knows in the long run it is unsustainable. Playing the role of the white knight only lends him more mainstream credibility among the biggest voting block, namely seniors who are still mesmerized by New Deal legislation.

Most importantly Rand believes what we believe:

 

[Anti Federalist]

The 'constitution' is what the Party says it is. Any different idea is Crime Think. Plan on a visit to Room 101.

DoublePlusGood comrade.

 

[The Free Hornet]

WE ARE SOCALISTS, we've been that way for quite sometime.

Speak for yourself. Your post is defeatist and counterproductive. It is also false and promotes collectivism rather than fighting it.

Perhaps you believe the logical conclusion is single-payer universal care. That is what progressives want, to be unburdened by the issue regardless of the cost to outliers whose care is too expensive and not deemed worth rationing, regardless of the cost to what freedom remains.

My care should be in my hands and not managed by corporatist or fascist or statist entities.

 

[mac_hine]

This pretty much sums it up.

 

[devil21]

Speak for yourself. Your post is defeatist and counterproductive. It is also false and promotes collectivism rather than fighting it.

Perhaps you believe the logical conclusion is single-payer universal care. That is what progressives want, to be unburdened by the issue regardless of the cost to outliers whose care is too expensive and not deemed worth rationing, regardless of the cost to what freedom remains.

My care should be in my hands and not managed by corporatist or fascist or statist entities.

Thank you. I was thinking that WE are not socialists. Our government is and forces us to participate. I am no socialist and I opt out in any way I can, sometimes even at my own peril.

(Btw, your troll sig could use some work. Most of the trolls on RPF are not in your sig but non-trolls are?)

 

[jmdrake]

Rand knows in the long run it is unsustainable. Playing the role of the white knight only lends him more mainstream credibility among the biggest voting block, namely seniors who are still mesmerized by New Deal legislation.

Most importantly Rand believes what we believe:

Good video. Ron Paul has been adamant that he wouldn't as president get rid of social security. Rather he would let younger workers opt out. And that's the way it should be done. If we end the empire we can afford to pay for those already trapped in social security while freeing everybody else.

 

[jmdrake]

It is going to swing the election in favor of Romney (if nominated). Too many people in the middle that were sitting on the fence that don't like Obama care and will drink the Romney kool aid.

I don't think any of those people are libertarians. You may get some Santorum supporters who were considering sitting this one out to vote for Romney but that's it.

 

[AuH20]

Did Roberts "change his mind" midstream?????? Interesting read to say the least.

http://hotair.com/archives/2012/06/...y-a-majority-opinion/comment-page-1/#comments

 

[torchbearer]

Probably.

I was trying my damnedest to thwart that, if for no other reason than I live close enough to that asshole's NH home that the Security State descending on my head would make life untenable.

I think it may be time to jet.

This is getting unbearable.

actually i've turned people off of romney today because of obamacare getting back into their brains-
there is an article on bloomberg that talks about the taxes involved with obamacare. in the article romney is quoted saying something to the effect of 'i wouldn't have that particular tax code'
i point out to people that romney has no intention of repealing obamacare, he just thinks he can manage it better.

people i talked today came to the realization, probably for the first time in their life, that with obama and romney as their choices, they are already fucked.
i mean, did you hear romney coming out today saying we need to repeal obamacare? no. he wants it.

 

[jmdrake]

actually i've turned people off of romney today because of obamacare getting back into their brains-
there is an article on bloomberg that talks about the taxes involved with obamacare. in the article romney is quoted saying something to the effect of 'i wouldn't have that particular tax code'
i point out to people that romney has no intention of repealing obamacare, he just thinks he can manage it better.

people i talked today came to the realization, probably for the first time in their life, that with obama and romney as their choices, they are already fucked.
i mean, did you hear romney coming out today saying we need to repeal obamacare? no. he wants it.

That post deserves 2 plus reps! One for your outreach and another for your analysis. That said I wonder what will ultimately wake more people up. Four more years of Obummer or 4 years of Robomney? Alas it seems that Obummer keeping the wars expanding didn't wake up the antiwar left. Will Robomney keeping the socialism expanding wake up the anti-commie right? Probably not. Only educational outreach like what you're doing is going to turn the tide.

 

[romancito]

Only educational outreach like what you're doing is going to turn the tide.

I refer you to my post #85.

There is nothing that will turn the tide. With this ruling, cities, counties, school districts will all feel empowered to intrude into the personal life of people in their communities. It will be much more than a 'recycling tax' or a 'special assessment tax' whatever. Cities will begin to tax according to perceived benefits for behavior modification. A tax for those who do not upgrade to 'heat reflective windows,' a tax to those who do not install water saving toilets, don't buy hybrid cars, throw away computers in the trash, and will also levy taxes on local companies according to what they may perceive as incentivizing good healthy behavior, like health checkups and eating properly, etc. And insurance companies will begin to encourage that like auto insurance companies do now by attaching reductions in policies to localities that promote healthy outcomes.

So in that sense local elections will become more important than they have been so far.

So it represents the end of freedom and the beginning of free taxation upon behavioral perception.

The future of this country will be full employment by the government by taxing and hiring compliance officers for all kinds of personal behavior incentives. Tax, pay, incur in more debt. The government will take every penny that you will ever make.

The first tax will be to those families that don't buy their 5 year old an Ipad.

 

[cajuncocoa]

I don't think any of those people are libertarians. You may get some Santorum supporters who were considering sitting this one out to vote for Romney but that's it.

I don't think so either, but it's apparently fashionable for certain neocons to label themselves "libertarians"...such as Glenn Beck and Neal Boortz.