MN - Two children dead, 17 others shot at Minneapolis Catholic school shooting

I don't disagree with any of that. Even the statement "In the past a person with a clear cut mental illness would be restricted from owning firearms." is strictly factua1.

However, it is not, never has been, and probably never will be, at all clear exactly what "mental illness" really is - let alone what qualifiers like "clear cut" are actually supposed to mean in this context. And that's a big problem ...
"Show me the man, and I'll show you the crime mental illness." -- Lavrentiy Beria (attributed, updated)​

It can mean a lot of things. It's always going to be a fuzzy line that can be used against people to take guns. I know that. But sometimes and I think it will be found in this case, it's so clear that something should have been done.

We are starting to see some accountability, wasn't one of the recent school shooter's parents found criminally negligent or something like that. I know this person was an adult, but if a family member living with them knows how messed up they are, knows they have guns and does nothing? That is negligent.
 
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It can mean a lot of things. It's always going to be a fuzzy line that can be used against people to take guns. I know that. But sometimes and I think it will be found in this case, it's so clear that something should have been done.

"Hindsight is 20/20" - it's always much easier to see how "obvious" something was after the fact.

Instead of "show me the man, I'll show you the crime", it should be "show me the man's crime - then (and only then) we can talk about maybe taking his guns away".

Anything else is just utopian "pre-crime" bullshit that absolutely will be abused to harass and punish innocent people and deprive them of their rights.

In fact, they are already geared up to do just that:
 
"Hindsight is 20/20" - it's always much easier to see how "obvious" something was after the fact.

Instead of "show me the man, I'll show you the crime", it should be "show me the man's crime - then (and only then) we can talk about maybe taking his guns away".

Anything else is just utopian "pre-crime" bullshit that absolutely will be abused to harass and punish innocent people and deprive them of their rights.

In fact, they are already geared up to do just that:

Yeah, I'm never going to be for that. But if a somebody knows a family member is this messed up, has guns and does nothing, that is textbook negligence.
 
Yeah, I'm never going to be for that. But if a somebody knows a family member is this messed up, has guns and does nothing, that is textbook negligence.

It certainly could be, depending on the particulars. Holding people accountable after the fact for something that has already happened isn't objectionable at all. (In fact, that's exactly how things ought to be done.)

But if a person hasn't yet committed any crime, and there is no probable cause showing they are going to commit a crime, then preemptively depriving them of their rights (such as gun ownership) just because they are deemed to be "mentally ill" (whatever that means) - and therefore "might do something" (whatever that means) - is not acceptable, and it should not be permitted. It's a slippery slope that will end up being abused (for example, by opportunistically expanding whatever is considered to be "mentally ill").
 
A Swedish total-population registry analysis (n ≈ 2 679 transgender vs. 9 747 324 cisgender individuals) found that transgender persons were 3.4–3.9 times more likely to receive prescriptions for antidepressants and anxiolytics than the general population. Even ten years after gender-affirming surgery, about 21.1% of transgender people had mood or anxiety diagnoses versus 12.5% of cisgender counterparts, reflecting persistently higher treatment needs and likely SSRI use.
https://psychiatryonline.org/doi/pdf/10.1176/appi.ajp.2019.19111151


In a U.S. study of 131 adults diagnosed with both gender dysphoria and a mood or anxiety disorder, 62% had an active outpatient antidepressant prescription (primarily SSRIs) at the time of their gender-dysphoria diagnosis. Roughly 38% had no antidepressant despite concurrent psychiatric diagnoses, suggesting both high overall prescribing and potential gaps in care
https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/32f4/dcac42510425a9ccf3a765da8c94b112d082.pdf
 
A Swedish total-population registry analysis (n ≈ 2 679 transgender vs. 9 747 324 cisgender individuals) found that transgender persons were 3.4–3.9 times more likely to receive prescriptions for antidepressants and anxiolytics than the general population. Even ten years after gender-affirming surgery, about 21.1% of transgender people had mood or anxiety diagnoses versus 12.5% of cisgender counterparts, reflecting persistently higher treatment needs and likely SSRI use.
https://psychiatryonline.org/doi/pdf/10.1176/appi.ajp.2019.19111151


In a U.S. study of 131 adults diagnosed with both gender dysphoria and a mood or anxiety disorder, 62% had an active outpatient antidepressant prescription (primarily SSRIs) at the time of their gender-dysphoria diagnosis. Roughly 38% had no antidepressant despite concurrent psychiatric diagnoses, suggesting both high overall prescribing and potential gaps in care
https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/32f4/dcac42510425a9ccf3a765da8c94b112d082.pdf
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Another Mass Shooting in a ‘Gun-Free Zone’
The Minneapolis killer made the point in his manifesto. The media insist on ignoring it.
https://www.wsj.com/opinion/another-mass-shooting-in-a-gun-free-zone-55e29255
[archive link: https://archive.ph/DsVvN]
{John R. Lott Jr. & Thomas Massie | 28 August 2025}

Another mass shooter has struck and the media is again refusing to say why he chose his target. Like other killers, he openly admitted that he sought out “gun-free zones.” Yet mainstream outlets refuse to acknowledge it—and thereby ignore a policy solution that could save children’s lives.

The Annunciation Catholic School shooter in Minneapolis spelled it out in his manifesto: “I recently heard a rumor that James Holmes, the Aurora theater shooter, may have chosen venues that were ‘gun-free zones.’ I would probably aim the same way. . . . Holmes wanted to make sure his victims would be unarmed. That’s why I and many others like schools so much. At least for me, I am focused on them. Adam Lanza is my reason.” (Lanza committed a mass shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Conn.)

Many of these attackers may be crazy, but none are stupid. They plan to die, but they want to die with attention. They know that the more victims they kill, the more coverage they’ll get. That’s why they target places where no one can fight back.

Yet searching media coverage, we turned up no articles mentioning that the Minneapolis killer picked a school because it was a “gun-free zone.” The media clearly read the passages the shooter wrote. CNN highlights his “obsession with school shootings.” The Washington Post describes the manifesto’s “reverence for other mass shooters.” But instead of reporting the killer’s own words about the vulnerability of gun-free zones, the media infers that he targeted the school because his mother was a former employee at the parish.

Everyone wants to stop mass shootings, but we need solutions that work. Having someone on site who can quickly intervene and stop an attack is crucial. Gun-control advocates push background checks on private transfers of guns and red-flag laws, yet Minnesota has both. The Annunciation Catholic School shooter still obtained three firearms legally. These limits didn’t keep the children of Minneapolis safe.

Neither did Minnesota’s law banning guns in schools. The attached penalty of five years in prison is a strong deterrent for a law-abiding American, but not to a shooter who is going to face multiple life sentences anyway. And that assumes the killer lives. Some 60% of these attackers—including the Minneapolis shooter—die at the scene. Many seem intent on ending their lives in the attack. They don’t care about more theoretical prison time.

Far from making people safer, in practice these bans guarantee that only the attacker will be armed. That’s why such places are targets. It’s no accident that 92% of mass public shootings occur in gun-free zones where civilians aren’t allowed to carry firearms. The Nashville Covenant School shooter admitted she avoided another site because it had too much security. “There was another location that was mentioned, but because of a threat assessment by the suspect of too much security, they decided not to,” Nashville Police Chief John Drake explained. No one at Covenant carried a gun to fight back.

The Buffalo, N.Y., supermarket attacker in 2022 made the same calculation, writing in his manifesto: “Areas where CCW [concealed carry weapons] permits are outlawed or prohibited may be good areas of attack.” Many other killers have written nearly identical words.

So why not station more police officers at schools? Sheriff Kurt Hoffman of Sarasota County, Fla., explained why that approach falls short: “A deputy in uniform has an extremely difficult job in stopping these attacks. These terrorists have huge strategic advantages in determining the time and place of attacks. They can wait for a deputy to leave the area, or pick an undefended location. Even when police or deputies are in the right place at the right time, those in uniform who can be readily identified as guards may as well be holding up neon signs saying, ‘Shoot me first.’ My deputies know that we cannot be everywhere.”

Arming teachers and other employees with concealed firearms deprives an attacker of those tactical advantages. He can’t tell which teachers or staff are armed. More than 21 million people hold concealed handgun permits, and in the 29 constitutional-carry states no permit is even required. Across America when you stand in a grocery store, there’s a good chance someone nearby carries a concealed handgun. The same should be true of schools. More than 20 states and more than 10,000 public schools already allow armed teachers under various rules. Other than suicides and gang violence at night, not a single death or injury has occurred in a school that permits teachers to carry.

One of us, Rep. Massie, continues to reintroduce the Safe Students Act to repeal the 1990 federal Gun-Free School Zones Act. We shouldn’t make the national default one that advertises children as defenseless targets.

If the media ever reported why these killers consistently choose disarmed victims, the push for more gun control would collapse and more lives would be saved. It’s time to take these killers at their word.

Mr. Lott is president of Crime Prevention Research Center. Mr. Massie, a Republican, represents Kentucky’s Fourth Congressional District and is a co-chairman of the Second Amendment Caucus.
 
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I am noticing a rapid decline in the nooz mentions and reporting on this incident already.

In a week it will be forgotten.

Perhaps the disvalue of the shooter being "trans" exceeded the value of the shooter being a "white male".

Then factor in the "antisemitism" and "the shooter explicitly chose a gun-free soft target" angles, and ...

... and ... ummm ...

... what were we talking about, again? :confused:
 
It certainly could be, depending on the particulars. Holding people accountable after the fact for something that has already happened isn't objectionable at all. (In fact, that's exactly how things ought to be done.)

But if a person hasn't yet committed any crime, and there is no probable cause showing they are going to commit a crime, then preemptively depriving them of their rights (such as gun ownership) just because they are deemed to be "mentally ill" (whatever that means) - and therefore "might do something" (whatever that means) - is not acceptable, and it should not be permitted. It's a slippery slope that will end up being abused (for example, by opportunistically expanding whatever is considered to be "mentally ill").

It's a fine line. We don't really have a good legal standard. Maybe we should. This is happening too often. It's not a gun control problem in this country, it's a massive mental health problem.
 
Happens whenever people start to figure out that the only people who need to be disarmed are government agents and Democrats.

Mentally ill people with violent thoughts or tendancies should be disarmed. I believe that. It doesn't have to be permanent.
 
Once again Democrats are not talking any responsibility when someone who supports them shoots up a school.
 
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