Looking for a new church

[fisharmor]

Every year on the first Sunday in Great Lent, after the conclusion of liturgy, the priest announces to everyone that if he has done anything to offend anyone he asks for forgiveness.
Then the entire parish forms a line. One person walks up to the priest and the priest asks "Forgive me, a sinner" and the first person in line responds, "God forgives, and I forgive." And the parishioner asks the priest for forgiveness, and the priest responds.
Then that person stands next to the priest, and the second person in line does this with the priest, and then the first person who was in line asks the second person the same and they forgive each other, too. And so on, until the line goes out the church and into the parking lot and everyone who was there has asked for and given forgiveness to everyone else who was there.

It's not required. But if you do it, it's taken seriously. If it came out that someone had beef with someone else from before forgiveness vespers, I would expect everyone in the community to say hang on, that wasn't just a ritual. It was your time to get right with that person.

And no, there are no timeframes here. We do it at the beginning of Lent because Lent is a time during the year where we do extra reinforcing of what we're supposed to be doing year round.

This last Pascha our rector had us all line up and do it again but instead of asking forgiveness, we all said "Christ is Risen!" and responding "Truly He is Risen!"
Which was not only a perfect bookend, but we just got singing in Paschal Matins:
"Let us embrace each other joyously; Let us call brothers even those who hate us, and forgive all by the resurrection"

If you go through that process, you can tell who is taking it seriously and they can tell if you are, too. It's pretty intense. But it also works. And that's kind of what I've been saying this whole thread. If the Holy Spirit is real and actually gives us faith and ways to develop and nurture it - these are all doctrines I don't think any Christian would argue with - then I'm seeing a lot of results in places where I previously refused to look.

 

[mtr1979]

I've been going to a church where the entire service is in Spanish. Before I was going to a "bilingual" church. It wasn't really bilingual. It was the local mega church where they spoke English the majority of the time. Half of the song verses would be in Spanish.

I never liked the previous church I attended. It felt like a business rather than a church. They were always asking for money. I also felt like they were preaching the prosperity ministry. One day they had some pastor come in and give a presentation for some class that was like 8 weeks long offered through Ramsey University.

I finally got enough courage to attend a Spanish Language service. This church would be classified as Pentecostal. Of course I don't understand everything they say, but I understand enough to realize it is a good church. They do take a collection which I understand they need to have lights and heat, but taking money isn't the center of their theology. This church has a lot of positive energy. It seems to be more based than english language services I've attended.

 

[ClaytonB]

I also felt like they were preaching the prosperity ministry. One day they had some pastor come in and give a presentation for some class that was like 8 weeks long offered through Ramsey University.

I attended a Dave Ramsey course as part of another ministry program and I have to say I misjudged him. I saw his book everywhere and assumed it was some kind of prosperity-gospel garbage because I was literally judging the book by the cover. Nope, Ramsey is all about eliminating debt and living in your means. His course boils down to: "eat your monetary vegetables, and here's where the Bible says you have to do that, so it's not just me telling you, it's God." Pay off debt, don't take on new debt (ever), and live within your means. I was floored. I already understood all that stuff, but I was amazed that his course is completely common-sense and biblical.

 

[mtr1979]

I attended a Dave Ramsey course as part of another ministry program and I have to say I misjudged him. I saw his book everywhere and assumed it was some kind of prosperity-gospel garbage because I was literally judging the book by the cover. Nope, Ramsey is all about eliminating debt and living in your means. His course boils down to: "eat your monetary vegetables, and here's where the Bible says you have to do that, so it's not just me telling you, it's God." Pay off debt, don't take on new debt (ever), and live within your means. I was floored. I already understood all that stuff, but I was amazed that his course is completely common-sense and biblical.

I actually agree with a lot of what he has to say. A passage he always says is " the borrower is a slave to the lender". I myself never go into debt. I bought my car in 2022 buy writing a check. I live within my means.

It is just the way the guy comes off his messaging makes him come off as a pr!ck. I feel the same way about Charlie Kirk. I'm very cautious of people doing the Christ Grift.

 

[ClaytonB]

It is just the way the guy comes off his messaging makes him come off as a pr!ck. I feel the same way about Charlie Kirk. I'm very cautious of people doing the Christ Grift.

Well, he can have a kind of grumpy tone, however, the truth can be harsh and sometimes it's just best to tell it straight. The fact that the American church needs someone like Dave Ramsey to teach believers what every pastor should already be teaching their congregations is itself a symptom of something deeply wrong in the church. When did Christians become comfortable going into debt to unbelievers, who are citizens of a hostile kingdom? The home mortgage is widely held in high regard but many young believers who have a home mortgage are underwater for a good solid 30 years, and that's assuming nothing catastrophic happens, such as an accident, natural disaster or health emergency. I learned the dark side of the American financial system in the wake of my divorce and ending up nearly bankrupt for over a decade, hounded by creditors. There is a very large overlap between debt-collection and demonic wickedness. It is a system whose ultimate goal is to destroy your soul, not just your body. You'll never hear that from the pulpit of any mainstream evangelical church...

 

[Intrepid]

I attended a Dave Ramsey course as part of another ministry program and I have to say I misjudged him. I saw his book everywhere and assumed it was some kind of prosperity-gospel garbage because I was literally judging the book by the cover. Nope, Ramsey is all about eliminating debt and living in your means. His course boils down to: "eat your monetary vegetables, and here's where the Bible says you have to do that, so it's not just me telling you, it's God." Pay off debt, don't take on new debt (ever), and live within your means. I was floored. I already understood all that stuff, but I was amazed that his course is completely common-sense and biblical.

I took Dave Ramsey's "Financial Peace" course 7-8 years ago. I loved it and still do. Sitting pretty right now completely debt-free with a comfortable home and a 2024 car.

Another of his fav sayings is, "It's not my money, it's God's money. I'm just a steward of it. And if I don't manage it well, why would he see fit to give me a whole bunch of it?"

 

[Snowball]

@mtr1979, you will always be Catholic.

you got Novus Ordo, Latin Mass, Melkite rite and whatever under the umbrella to choose from
but you'll always be a baptised and confirmed Catholic, so whatever your problem is, get over it.
there is no question which can't be satisfactorily answered, except for those which are in the Mystery of God.
the Church is still rich with whatever you're looking for. Look for it, and listen.

until you're ready for Confession, do what I do. Confess to God but don't receive Communion yet.
You can go to the bathroom at that time. Trust me. You can also pray, read, do chaplets and devotions,
go to events and lots of things... no need to leave for something else.

 

[Invisible Man]

@mtr1979, you will always be Catholic.

you got Novus Ordo, Latin Mass, Melkite rite and whatever under the umbrella to choose from
but you'll always be a baptised and confirmed Catholic, so whatever your problem is, get over it.
there is no question which can't be satisfactorily answered, except for those which are in the Mystery of God.
the Church is still rich with whatever you're looking for. Look for it, and listen.

until you're ready for Confession, do what I do. Confess to God but don't receive Communion yet.
You can go to the bathroom at that time. Trust me. You can also pray, read, do chaplets and devotions,
go to events and lots of things... no need to leave for something else.

That's true. All who have joined themselves to Christ through faith belong to his catholic Church. No one denomination has a claim to that.