Just got off the phone with HQ

[GoRonGo]

I don't think a recount would be productive.

Hypothetically if there is a recount and he doesn't get pass Huck (Quite a bit of votes to be picked up) he still won't get any delegates, and if he does pass Huck wouldn't it be 1 anyway.

Save money for SUper Tuesday and beyond.

 

[JosephB]

I support a recount on principle. If we don't act now, fraud will continue. The vote count concerns all American citizens, not just Ron Paul supporters. I support a complete recount because it seems Obama was cheated too. However, I am sorry to say a recount will probably be a fraud too. So awareness is key. With more awareness it makes it harder for the enemy to control, manipulate, and deceive. This is truly an infowar. May the power of spirit be your guide.

 

[Hardrock]

This has been an interesting thread......

Some sound wisdom, and some venting........it's a natural process.

I just hope that cooler heads will prevail here.

Vote fraud is a fact of life. It happens to some degree in every election.
It's been made more prevalent by our failure to prevent "electronic" vote tabulation.
We dropped the ball then, and we will drop it again
if we don't absolutely INSIST on sending those worthless POS machines
to the scrap heap where they can be recyled into something of actual use.

Don't bash HQ until you understand WE (you and I) dropped the ball by ever allowing
technology to become our "master."
Understand they are handicapped by the machines.
If you can't get tamper-proof data the first time around, you're foolish to think a re-count
won't invite more "fiddling".

HQ has already, no doubt, pissed and faunched just like us, and arrived at a "most beneficial" position to take.

Am I upset about it? Hell NO! I'm outright PISSED OFF about it! Upset doesn't even begin to acurately describe what I feel!
I share the same feeling as most of the rants in this thread.

BUT! BUT, there IS such a thing as trippin' over your own d!*k!

As some have mentioned, blowback however minute, is still blowback.

If you want to gamble, consider the odds, calculate the risk, and check the pot.

There is nothing to gain here but grief.

Is there a principal at stake? Sure. One.....honest voting.

Handicap the entire RP campaign by creating more tension and chaos among the voters,
and you jepordize the entire RP message.
Controlled chaos is how the other side wins elections.
We have to be smarter.

The message of Freedom and Liberty hold far more valued "principals" than just that one.


We're temporarily behind the 8 ball, but the opposition already knows that....
Damned if we object, damned if we don't.


Don't be so quick to do just what they want us to do.
Don't go squalling like the scrawny kid that didn't get picked at recess.
Stay focused on the campaign, and START gathering evidence, hard evidence
to support your claims. I believe it's there.
An independent approach apart from the campaign is absolutely a must.

As a last resort, and I mean a LAST resort, dump it in the public's lap right before the fat lady sings. If we see there's no chance in heel RP can win, throw a wrench in their machine.
Scream bloody murder!
If "Shock and Awe" got the bastards in, "Shock and Awe" may scatter the herd just when they think they have it in the bag.


On the bright side, even WITH questionable vote tallies, we STILL made a stand in IA, and a showing in NH.
Few people stop to realize just how big of a Beast we're battling here.
Our numbers might not be impressive if we were running a "business as usual" AssHat for a candidate, but you have to remember THIS IS A REVOLUTION!
Nobody said it would be easy.......

My 2$

 

[walt]

I just spoke to somebody from HQ and asked for a recount. He told me that they are getting many many calls like mine. I've never called HQ for anything but I felt this was important after looking over some of the evidence.

Do you know what I was told? That they are "aware of the situation"

The person went on to say that if you request a recount that can have blowback and cause voters to think you're a fringe candidate.

I got the impression that the top was telling the people answering the phones to answer this way.

WHAT A LOAD OF CRAP!

What difference does that make if it is CLEAR that not all of the votes are being counted?

It MATTERS NOT what anybody thinks - Ron Paul will NOT win this election because they are FIXING IT so at the very least LET'S PROVE IT!!!!

Just my two cents. If you happen to feel the same way I don't know - give them a call too.

welcome to the ineptitude. I feel sorry for these people answering the phone, they are given no information and no power to take action on great calls like yours. It's about leadership - they have no leaders who understand bottom up culture building.

 

[khorbis]

Both arguments - recount or no - each have their merits, in my opinion. The "fraud" mentioned is, let's be honest, PURE speculation at this point. However, I HAVE heard enough evidence of POSSIBLE fraud that might warrant a recount IF we can get both the grassroots major and campaign to gather the evidence into a plausible argument on its behalf. If some of you REALLY think that a recount is really necessary, then the first step HAS to be fact-finding. Put together a missive; the grassroots, I daresay, will dissect ANYTHING proposed in a matter of hours (or minutes), so don't be bashful if you are truly commited. If the pro-recount argument really holds water, then no one should object to a clear presentation of factual evidence (if such exists).

Regardless, I think both sides of this argument should treat each other with a little more "grassroots comradarie." We're all on the same team, right?

...RIGHT?

 

[Opulen]

At first I wanted a recount but then I realized that Dr. Ron Paul knows what is going on. Im sure Cong. Paul knows what the steps to be taken. Lets just move on to the next which is Michigan. Just continue what we are doing since day 1 and the real plan will unfold. Have faith in our good doctor

 

[slacker921]

"Asking for a recount when you're in fifth place is a PR nightmare. It'll do more harm than good."
+10

it would be a huge mistake UNLESS the people of NH were demanding a recount. If there really was huge fraud like people are making it out to be then the voters in NH in those small towns where 100 people voted and McCain won by a landslide would KNOW and would be raising a stink about it. Are they? Are newspapers in NH filled with articles and letters to the editor from residents about why their great state voted for a pro-war candidate? I haven't seen any.. sadly they seem pretty satisfied with the outcome.

We're talking about getting 1 delegate if that... it's time to focus on Michigan, Florida, Nevada, and South Carolina.

 

[zakkubin]

Obviously the arguement that it's "just 31 votes" is rediculous. How many are there that we don't know about? And should we believe it will stop when we get to the larger states?

BUT HQ is right they should not ask for a recount now. And we certainly should not bogg their already limited resources down with repeated calls of the same request.


My advice- Look for evidence of fruad or mistakes in other candidates mainly Obama. Our best hope is that our HQ can piggy back a recount request with another "upper tier" candidate such as Obama.

 

[00WS6TA]

I agree, this is egregious and MUST be addressed!

 

[TheTyke]

I am in the group favoring a recount. As has been said many times, if vigilance and awareness isn't increased, it will just happen elsewhere.

But I also think Ron Paul knows what he's doing. If he deems it unwise for the campaign to demand a recount, then he is probably leaving it to us to do so.

 

[peacemonger]

I don't think a recount is necessary. We didn't win. It is that simple. Get over it. We don't need to look like sore losers. Nobody likes a sore loser.

If you want to be winners, we have to start acting like it. Do you guys know how winners act? I'll tell you. Winners work hard in their neighborhoods. They talk to their family members about their core beliefs and try to convert anyone who will listen. They go door to door. Winners donate to the national campaign and the grassroots. Winners do not whine even when they feel cheated. Winners suck it up, stand up straight, and focus ALL of their efforts on the goal. Talking of a recount is just a distraction and a waste of time. Do you think the American people care if we got 15% or 8%. NO. Whether we are 5th or 3rd is irrelevant. We lost. Stop acting like whining children. I love you guys, really... but you are pissing me off.

Here is what I know about elections. Hacking these voting machines would take a coordinated effort involving many people. If lots of people were involved in some grand conspiracy like this, then somebody would probably get nervous and spill the beans. Small conspiracies on a city or county level could work, but grand conspiracies on a state or national level have to involve too many people. Someone would get drunk and brag to a friend at a bar. Some husband would have to tell his wife. Some boyfriend would break up with his girlfriend and she would expose him to take revenge. Somebody would talk. This is why conspiracies don't work. Please regain your composure. The tin foil hat image has done enough damage to the campaign. Focus all efforts on winning South Carolina, Michigan, and Nevada NOW.

Lets raise some money. Lets get out there and try to WIN this thing. When we get a clear majority at the ballot box, say 40% or 50% or more, then there will be no doubt that we are winning. We have to get our numbers up. At that point, we will see that the establishment will be unable to rig the vote count. Right now we are not even a blip on the radar so a recount will make us look like kooks.

 

[Electric Church]

I just spoke to somebody from HQ and asked for a recount. He told me that they are getting many many calls like mine. I've never called HQ for anything but I felt this was important after looking over some of the evidence.

Do you know what I was told? That they are "aware of the situation"

The person went on to say that if you request a recount that can have blowback and cause voters to think you're a fringe candidate.

I got the impression that the top was telling the people answering the phones to answer this way.

WHAT A LOAD OF CRAP!

What difference does that make if it is CLEAR that not all of the votes are being counted?

It MATTERS NOT what anybody thinks - Ron Paul will NOT win this election because they are FIXING IT so at the very least LET'S PROVE IT!!!!

Just my two cents. If you happen to feel the same way I don't know - give them a call too.

"Blowback?" get serious. You think people are stupid enough to believe that?


This is another load of crap folks!!!!

See how sneaky these creeps are? This is high level psyop folks. They're pullin out all the stops to get us to implode.

To the ignore dungeon with ya

 

[AFM]

I don't think a recount is necessary. We didn't win. It is that simple. Get over it. We don't need to look like sore losers. Nobody likes a sore loser.

If you want to be winners, we have to start acting like it. Do you guys know how winners act? I'll tell you. Winners work hard in their neighborhoods. They talk to their family members about their core beliefs and try to convert anyone who will listen. They go door to door. Winners donate to the national campaign and the grassroots. Winners do not whine even when they feel cheated. Winners suck it up, stand up straight, and focus ALL of their efforts on the goal. Talking of a recount is just a distraction and a waste of time. Do you think the American people care if we got 15% or 8%. NO. Whether we are 5th or 3rd is irrelevant. We lost. Stop acting like whining children. I love you guys, really... but you are pissing me off.

Here is what I know about elections. Hacking these voting machines would take a coordinated effort involving many people. If lots of people were involved in some grand conspiracy like this, then somebody would probably get nervous and spill the beans. Small conspiracies on a city or county level could work, but grand conspiracies on a state or national level have to involve too many people. Someone would get drunk and brag to a friend at a bar. Some husband would have to tell his wife. Some boyfriend would break up with his girlfriend and she would expose him to take revenge. Somebody would talk. This is why conspiracies don't work. Please regain your composure. The tin foil hat image has done enough damage to the campaign. Focus all efforts on winning South Carolina, Michigan, and Nevada NOW.

Lets raise some money. Lets get out there and try to WIN this thing. When we get a clear majority at the ballot box, say 40% or 50% or more, then there will be no doubt that we are winning. We have to get our numbers up. At that point, we will see that the establishment will be unable to rig the vote count. Right now we are not even a blip on the radar so a recount will make us look like kooks.

For the hundredth time, its not about winning.

 

[Electric Church]

I don't think a recount is necessary. We didn't win. It is that simple. Get over it. We don't need to look like sore losers. Nobody likes a sore loser.

To the dungeons of ignorance with ya

 

[raheelp]

For the hundredth time, its not about winning.

Then what is it about? The more you win = more media time = more your message gets out there.

Right now we are only reaching like 8% of the people

 

[aricart]

Kill this recount talk. We need to focus on winning the other primaries. If there is fraud, it will come out eventually.

 

[ronpaul4freedom.com]

Need to move on!

For the love of God, please let NH go! We have 47 States left. However, we do need to do much better. I call on all Ron Paul supporters to travel to Detroit this weekend and volunteer there. We need to have 10 times the amount of supporters volunteering than the other candidates. It would send a message if we had 10,000 volunteers on Sun, Mon, and Tuesday instead of 100 volunteers. The Detroit HQ only has enough equipment for 100 volunteers, so bring your own Ron Paul attire and signs. I am leaving for Detroit on Sunday. I will see you guys there.

 

[Thomas Paine]

You have to realize that they might be right. If the vote was close then I could see it. But asking for a recount when you are in 5th place is going to make you a laughing stock. That's just the way it is.

I think the best thing we can do is publicize the voting inconsistencies ourselves to make people aware of it.

New Hampshire is water under the bridge. Time to saddle up for Michigan.

 

[sharedvoice]

It's amazing how some people think they can make demands to the official campaign for whatever reason.

Get off your lazy ass and contact the New Hampshire State Elections Board if you feel that strongly about a recount. http://www.doj.nh.gov/elections/complaints.html

The people of New Hampshire should decide for themselves whether they feel their vote has been properly counted. Remember this is all about personal responsibility,

Spamming the campaign with these requests are a waste of time, energy, and resources that otherwise could be used elsewhere.

Should there be a recount? Absolutely, if the people of New Hampshire are legitimately concerned and know for certain of any voting irregularities in their district/counties. Like the one in Sutton for example.

Should the campaign make an official request, demand, or pay for a state-wide recount? No thanks. That is absurd.

Besides, any recount performed should be free of charge since the mistake was made by the State Election Commission, not the people of New Hampshire who rightfully exercised their right in voting for their candidate.

If anything we should get a 31% discount for any recount fee for the 31 votes for Ron Paul that were unaccounted for and MIA.

Either that, or we could go in 50/50 with Obama supporters for a full independent recount, because he was also cheated in my view.

 

[time4change]

I don't think a recount is necessary. We didn't win. It is that simple. Get over it.

It's that simple. Yes trust everything. Never ask questions, even when it's obvious that something stinks.

If you want to be winners, we have to start acting like it. Do you guys know how winners act? I'll tell you. Winners work hard in their neighborhoods. They talk to their family members about their core beliefs and try to convert anyone who will listen. They go door to door. Winners donate to the national campaign and the grassroots.

So by your criteria, Ron Paul should have won by a landslide.

Here is what I know about elections. Hacking these voting machines would take a coordinated effort involving many people.

Have you bothered to watch even one of the videos posted here on these machines? All it takes is ONE person to slide a hacked card in, and it's over.
Watch this video: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4463776866669054201

Then, tell me again why "Hacking these voting machines would take a coordinated effort involving many people." Anyone who trusts these machines needs to get their head examined. I'm all for the grassroots teaming up with Obama's group, and others such as blackboxvoting.org, and making a stink out of this. I also agree with the idea that the campaign should stay out of it, unless absolutely necessary. I think true Ron Paul supporters never automatically trust anything.

I'm suspicious of any posts telling us to trust these machines.