Help Mail 40,000+ Rand Paul Super Brochures and Stickers

[William Tell]

Curt, please address the previously ignored concerns in the other thread:

Hey Curt, how about fill in these blanks:

Flyer printing cost:
Bumper sticker printing cost:
Perceived value of having your website on 40,000 pieces of mail:
Envelope stuffing cost:
Postage cost:
Other costs (explain):
Expected profit:

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showth...40-000-Rand-Paul-Super-Brochures-and-Stickers

Also, what is the reason for sending a brochure instead of an email?

........

 

[nayjevin]

Unfortunately this project seems to fail all tests of vetting. Observe, immediately appeal to emotion 'winning' instead of facts. In other thread, the claims Curt just made have been called into question, it is not clear that the superbrochures were responsible for Ron's growth in popularity. But these are posted in lieu of a reasonable response. In other thread, project leader retreats and claims victimhood, then appeals to sympathy. Very simple questions cannot be answered. Let's not forget that the original superbrochure would have gone out with a link to zeitgeist had members of this forum not voiced concern.

Here's some history (reading these can be hilarious if you distance yourself enough to go with the notion this is a big prank)

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showth...-SuperBrochure-Project-s-Effectiveness/page16

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showth...ults-for-Connecticut&highlight=super+brochure

 

[nayjevin]

How much are you making?

deflection

I ask because I made way more working for Ron Paul's Official Campaign than in the grassroots.

cleverly does not answer question

I even tried NOT getting paid from the Official campaign, but they said I couldn't do that.

could have volunteered. cannot fill official capacity without nda, i suspect

I make what people want.

What people want is to be part of a good grassroots project. If they believe it's good, it doesn't mean that it is good.

You have made it clear that people outside of the areas you deem important are a waste of resources.

true, i've had issues with collins' opinon of 'what is important,' but never would i act as though there is no such thing as a waste of resources.

this project sends 'free' things to 4 year old addresses, minus profit, at an inflated printing cost, and there are serious concerns as to whether the content of the brochure is actually beneficial to be seen by anyone. and the same information could be sent in an email for free. and it has this for-profit website address all over it. hey everybody, pay for me to send out 'free' stuff with my logo on it.

Sorry Florida, California, etc... Why do you care?

appeal to emotion, not a sensible one. florida and california would take a lot more than 40,000 to make a dent, assuming the material is good. same reason nh is the place for the free state project, plus in the election working on early states has more bang for buck as it creates steamroll effect. (that's why literally every single campaign ever focuses on early states)

We are doing what it takes to actually win. People who want to win will support us.

Baseless claim followed by appeal to emotion. Fishing for suckers.

tldr

doesn't answer simple questions and retreats to manipulation possibly blinded by profit motive

 

[nayjevin]

Ron had name recognition problem, Rand does not. Strategy entirely different. Rand has early official campaign volunteer strategy, time is almost definitely best spent there for most people. Grassroots projects will be effective when they encourage positive activity that would not have occurred otherwise without taking resources from another source. this project fails those tests as it competes for small donor dollars and creates impression something is already being done in whatever state is chosen.

 

[nayjevin]

As a comparison, a postcard with official rand website on it and official logo is probably not worth doing IMO.

 

[Matt Collins]

How much are you making?

I don't work for the campaign or any PAC affiliated for Rand at this time.

I ask because I made way more working for Ron Paul's Official Campaign than in the grassroots. I even tried NOT getting paid from the Official campaign, but they said I couldn't do that.

Some people have to make a living in order to serve. Not everyone is able to work for free.

Which brings me to the next question... how much did you make off of the 2012 Super Brochures? What was your gross and your net?

I make what people want.

So? That isn't how to win an election. It may be how to enrich yourself or at least make yourself feel good, but it has no relevance towards winning a primary. And in fact your pet project may actually be harming the cause unintentionally.

You have made it clear that people outside of the areas you deem important are a waste of resources. Sorry Florida, California, etc...

Yes, exactly. Voters who live in those states will NOT play an electoral part in helping Rand to win the nomination.

We are doing what it takes to actually win. People who want to win will support us.

No you're not. "A" for effort, but it is sorely misguided if not outright selfish. Do something productive and go to Iowa or NH and distribute the campaign's literature if you want to be effective.

 

[Uriah]

@ po14015
Start answering questions here in this forum or you will irreparably harm your reputation and lose out on potential support.

 

[nayjevin]

"A" for effort, but it is sorely misguided if not outright selfish.

Consolation, almost no one is qualified to head a grassroots project. It takes great patience, a willingness to include the grassroots in planning (crowdsourcing) and an ability to recognize what criticisms are baseless and those that aren't. It takes skill in organization and communication and judgment, and a great idea that is effective and cost-effective and possible.

Also, not many are good at informing people with good intentions that their idea is a no-go. I certainly am not, I don't give benefit of the doubt when I think I'm seeing obstinance, a lack of desire to include anyone else in planning, evaded questions, and manipulation tactics.

 

[Eric21ND]

Trying to take the credit for Ron Paul's poll numbers going up like that hurts your credibility more than you can imagine.

I sincerely hope your efforts do some good, but at the same time I have to take into account the testimonies of activists who actually were on the ground in Iowa like Uriah.

I was on the ground and didn't encounter angry mobs upset over the Super Brochure. The counties where I know they were distributed either doubled or nearly doubled Ron's net vote count. We ran out of the handouts actually.

I do know some people associated with other PACs launched a smear campaign against them after promising they'd send a brochure and a 'For Liberty' dvd to voters.

What hurt Ron in Iowa were the newsletters, which the campaign had no good response for, yet they had two years to prepare for. Benton bungled that and many other things. Ron also wasn't on the ground enough in December. It's like once the media started hitting on the newsletters, the campaign's only response was to lay low and try to squeak out a win.

 

[SilentBull]

Is there any way we can stop this scammer from ruining Rand's campaign? Can he be legally stopped? He'll be sending out material with lies about a candidate's platform.

Notice how he said the first mailings will go to Ron supporters. And the others? To Republicans who will most likely be turned off by this. This guy obviously cares more about making money than actually helping. Not only that, he will HURT Rand's campaign after Rand has tried so hard to fine tune his message.

Notice how the guy won't respond when he gets caught lying about the price. The guy is a dick and a scammer. Someone stop this loser.

 

[Mike4Freedom]

Here we go again. Here are a few old threads from 2012 about the Superbrochures.
SB Effectiveness
My older post about how much money they are making on this

Most people vote based on a few issues. If there is something that a typical voter is against, they will not vote for that candidate. This is the reason why most politicians are very vague on actual solutions.

 

[Matt Collins]

The counties where I know they were distributed either doubled or nearly doubled Ron's net vote count.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/false-cause

What hurt Ron in Iowa were the newsletters, which the campaign had no good response for, yet they had two years to prepare for.

Incorrect... it was the last minute fake surge that Santorum was pushed in the media.

 

[Jamesiv1]

The point made in other posts about sales technique is true - address the prospect's hot-button issues, and nothing else. In fact, you only pitch him until he starts asking questions. You answer his question, then close. He asks another question, answer it and close. And so on until he signs the contract. "Always be closing."

Why? Because if you keep pitching you run the risk of saying something that will make him change his mind or give him a reason not to buy.

Translated to campaigning - we should have 4 or 5 *separate* brochures that talk about one issue only. Go door-to-door (or phone call to phone call) and do the same thing. They ask a question, you state Rand's position, and go for the close which would be something like "Can we count on your vote?"

They might reply, "Well... where does he stand on so-n-so issue?"

You state Rand's position, wait until prospect is nodding his head in agreement, and go for the close.

We're selling a candidate instead of a do-hickey, but it's exactly the same.

I vote No Super-brochure. Spend it on single-issue hand-outs on cheap paper (instead of expensive high-gloss), and an easy-to-use email system (with canned templates) that phone-bankers can use while you have them on the phone. BOOM, here's Rand's position.

Or instead of canned email templates, have PDF files of the single-issue hand-outs that can be fired off immediately.

p.s. The single-issue, low-cost hand-outs should have the official campaign's seal of approval. Rand's official logo, plus "I'm Rand Paul and I approve of this pamphlet". And his signature.

edit: On second thought, maybe both would be good as long as it's a 2-prong approach. Super-brochures probably have a good audience, and the single-issue handouts have a good audience. Use them both?

edit: On third thought, how about a PDF file of the Super-brochure that can also be emailed? You can still do a targeted mailing, but providing a free soft copy appeases the naysayers about the making a profit thing.

 

[Jamesiv1]

My thoughtful and carefully considered post begs the simple question:

Does this Super Brochure have the official campaign's blessing?

 

[William Tell]

Translated to campaigning - we should have 4 or 5 *separate* brochures that talk about one issue only. Go door-to-door (or phone call to phone call) and do the same thing.

Ron had 10 or more of those as I recall. And they pitched him in a way that made him sound good to Primary voters.

 

[devil21]

A hybrid solution of these two posts would be very effective.

This shit again. The last thing you want to do if you are trying to win an election is start listing off a candidate's positions without learning what that audience cares about. As soon as a non-supporter reads ONE thing in the list he doesn't like, you've lost him.

The point made in other posts about sales technique is true - address the prospect's hot-button issues, and nothing else. In fact, you only pitch him until he starts asking questions. You answer his question, then close. He asks another question, answer it and close. And so on until he signs the contract. "Always be closing."

Why? Because if you keep pitching you run the risk of saying something that will make him change his mind or give him a reason not to buy.

Translated to campaigning - we should have 4 or 5 *separate* brochures that talk about one issue only. Go door-to-door (or phone call to phone call) and do the same thing. They ask a question, you state Rand's position, and go for the close which would be something like "Can we count on your vote?"

They might reply, "Well... where does he stand on so-n-so issue?"

You state Rand's position, wait until prospect is nodding his head in agreement, and go for the close.

We're selling a candidate instead of a do-hickey, but it's exactly the same.

I vote No Super-brochure. Spend it on single-issue hand-outs on cheap paper (instead of expensive high-gloss), and an easy-to-use email system (with canned templates) that phone-bankers can use while you have them on the phone. BOOM, here's Rand's position.

Or instead of canned email templates, have PDF files of the single-issue hand-outs that can be fired off immediately.

p.s. The single-issue, low-cost hand-outs should have the official campaign's seal of approval. Rand's official logo, plus "I'm Rand Paul and I approve of this pamphlet". And his signature.

edit: On second thought, maybe both would be good as long as it's a 2-prong approach. Super-brochures probably have a good audience, and the single-issue handouts have a good audience. Use them both?

edit: On third thought, how about a PDF file of the Super-brochure that can also be emailed? You can still do a targeted mailing, but providing a free soft copy appeases the naysayers about the making a profit thing.

Jamesiv is absolutely correct regarding how to pitch. So how about a variety of brochures, each addressing a single issue (2nd amendment or national DEFENSE) or a couple of linked issues (evangelical targeted that addresses abortion and gay marriage in one, for example), BASED ON OFFICIAL CAMPAIGN PLATFORM, and allow the activists on the ground to determine which brochure(s) to distribute based on their interactions with each prospective voter? The one-size-fits-all-brochure is a BAD idea.

Scenario:
Activist goes to a door in Iowa, speaks to resident, determines by conversation what is important to that resident using Jamesiv approach above, activist then gives appropriate brochure(s) to that resident telling them "I think you will like what you read and we would appreciate your caucus vote." Move to the next door and start over. This is a variation of a tried and true method to win votes outside of polling places. Yes, it will require more work on OP's part to create and distribute multiple brochure versions but it would be effective.

 

[Crashland]

If you're looking to support a grassroots effort then I recommend checking out orenbus's efforts with randpauldigital. Seems the money would be much better spent. If you want to order brochures or other merchandize *for yourself* to distribute, then maybe consider this one, but don't send money to have these super brochures mailed by someone else.

 

[CPUd]

Curious why he went ahead and printed some (without even coming here to get input on the content) before trying to sell them. Shouldn't it be the other way around?

 

[RichardAlpert]

this is turning ugly

just ask the campaign if they're OK with the brochures, and if they are, then let's do this!

if note, then, for the love of God, do NOT waste people's hard-earned money to HURT the campaign

 

[Barrex]

There are 2 mayor concerns: profit and weather it helps or hurts.

1.Profiteering:

Yeah they are raking in the cash from this. I did some math. They said it cost them 7 Cents to print out a brochure. They get bulk mailing rates and I decided to look those prices up:

So they are sending these from an NDC(Network distribution center) and in large bulk quantities. It costs 20.4 Cents to mail each one like this.

So they ask for .55 cents and it costs 27.4 cents to make and ship them. 55 cents - 27.4 cents = 26.85 cents.

So since they are doing them in 30000 group batches, 30000 brochures costs 8220 dollars to ship, .7 cents x 30000 = 2100 to make the brochures

That is 10,330 total cost.

30000 x .55 cents = 16500

So that means they are making 6167 dollars of profit afterwards. Now they sent out around a million of these already.

My math indicates they have made around 374,000 dollars already.

Now you understand the big push?

I think if you are able to prove that you are not profiting people would be a lot more receptive to your project.