Peace Piper
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I've noticed that this topic tends to reveal closet authoritarians. It's fascinating.
Guns don't kill people, prescription SSRI's* do.
- Thread starter afwjam
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I've noticed that this topic tends to reveal closet authoritarians. It's fascinating.
Is anybody a better libertarian is they oppose big pharma?
Cbrons has a radio show that blasts the establishment. He also promotes libertarian writers. Just because he does not share your views on medicine does not mean he is an authoritarian.
I have campaigned for ron paul in 2012, i went to the events waved the signs.
Are we any less libertarian just because we like modern medicine?
Well, so far we have : Prozac Defense. Ambien Defense. Zoloft Defense. Paxil Defense. Effexor Defense. All have been used successfully in numerous murder/attempted murder/assault cases, google-fu will net a lot of them.
Is there a Marijuana Defense*? Alcohol? Cocaine? Heroin? Bath Salts? It amazes me just how far we've fallen where the people of this country allow such things as SSRI's and SNRI's to even exist. If people really knew that the pharma companies don't even really know how they work, the actual suicide data on these drugs, and what they do to the very core of your emotions-there would be NO market for them.
*I realize there were a multitude of cases defended successfully on the "Marijuana made me do it" angle, but this was also during a time they believed it made you turn into a bat and grow fangs, and if you were Mexican or African it made you want to rape white women.
tod evans
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Legislation either authorizing or criminalizing the use of any drug is beyond the scope of any federal agency.
The public must be educated honestly and then permitted to choose their poison..
The public must be educated honestly and then permitted to choose their poison..
Well, so far we have : Prozac Defense. Ambien Defense. Zoloft Defense. Paxil Defense. Effexor Defense. All have been used successfully in numerous murder/attempted murder/assault cases, google-fu will net a lot of them.
Is there a Marijuana Defense*? Alcohol? Cocaine? Heroin? Bath Salts? It amazes me just how far we've fallen where the people of this country allow such things as SSRI's and SNRI's to even exist. If people really knew that the pharma companies don't even really know how they work, the actual suicide data on these drugs, and what they do to the very core of your emotions-there would be NO market for them.
*I realize there were a multitude of cases defended successfully on the "Marijuana made me do it" angle, but this was also during a time they believed it made you turn into a bat and grow fangs, and if you were Mexican or African it made you want to rape white women.
Meh, people like cbrons will just dismiss her because she doesn't have letters behind her name.
Great vid, thanks, I'm adding it to my collection of pharma rep confessions.
donnay
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Peace Piper
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yes those are fantastic, thx for posting, I've reposted and forwarded
She is articulate, smart and knows exactly what she's talking about.
Hard to argue with that, how soon does a WooWooer call her a scientologist?
Do you know a guy named steven novella?
cbrons
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Pharm reps are some of the dumbest airheads I've ever met in medicine and yes they are typically uneducated and taught to recite talking points.
Don't say anything bad C, I would advice against it. It'll just get you banned.
Peace Piper
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And THERE you have it, Ladies and Gentlemen.
How could the poster recognize talking points anyway?
They didn't bother looking at her video,because
if they did they wouldn't call her dumb. Or maybe they would.
One thing is for sure, if this poster is a medical professional, he/she flunked bedside manner.
Maybe that's like the Hippocratic Oath these days-subject to lawyer speak, and the meaning of "is".
Disgusting.
Edited to add: This Big Pharma Rep/Drug Pusher was good enough at suckering "educated Doctors" to keep her job for 15 years. What does THAT say about these "educated Doctors"?
To some people, being "educated" means mastering fact regurgitation. And they think everyone that doesn't eat their particular facts and spit them up on command is not "educated". It would be funny if it wasn't so sad.
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Peace Piper
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Now I do--
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Novella
Novella is a medical advisor to Quackwatch,[3] an associate editor of the Scientific Review of Alternative Medicine,[4] and the executive editor of the blog Science-Based Medicine.[5] Among other topics, Novella has published on homeopathy[6][7] and AIDS denialism.[8] In 2009, he was the board chairman when the Institute for Science in Medicine was founded.[9] He has also taught a course for The Teaching Company titled "Medical Myths, Lies, and Half-Truths: What We Think We Know May Be Hurting Us."
Novella is president and co-founder of the New England Skeptical Society and hosts that organization's podcast, The Skeptics' Guide to the Universe. He writes the monthly Weird Science column for the New Haven Advocate and contributes to several blogs. Novella has also appeared on several television programs, including Penn & Teller: Bullshit!.[10]
Novella was one of the first 200 to sign the Project Steve petition,[11] a tongue-in-cheek parody of the list of "scientists that doubt evolution" produced by creationists.
In January 2010 Novella was elected as a Fellow of the Committee for Skeptical Inquiry[12]
Novella keeps a blog, Neurologica, "your daily fix of neuroscience, skepticism and critical thinking"
********************
I don't need to know anymore about Novella, if I want establishment pablum all I have to do is turn on CNN and listen to that insufferable Sanjay Gupta or whatever his name is. Or any other spouters of "commonly accepted" bs, the same type of thinking that Galileo learned about.
Establishment medicine failed me twice, and both times these establishment "doctors" were not the least bit interested in what actually did work. Western medicine surely has it's place, and for treating symptoms it's very good. But these people are just people, with a hundred grand in debt to worry about. They make mistakes too.
Establishment medicine also drugged up my dear Mother and ruined the last "golden" years of her life. 14 pills and the God Damned "Doctor" had no explanation of WTF was going on when questioned about it. Then, the arrogant bitch treated me like I was "typically uneducated and taught to recite talking points." She was fired. More people need to do that-fire these arrogant jerks.
For those reasons, I am an enemy of Big Pharma and all health professionals without an open mind. Of course it's hard to keep an open mind when all your time is taken up trying to figure out how to pay back student loans.
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donnay
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I have nothing but contempt for these allopathic doctors who cannot think for themselves and treat each patient on an individual bases. I am currently in a situation that is very rapidly turning into a Cluster Fuck because of a couple of doctors who like using Big Pharma to drug their patients into oblivion. Then when they are ordered (by me and my family) to cease and desist all mind altering drugs, they try telling me that my aging parents have dementia and early stages of Alzheimer's.
So Chris Bronson spare me with your blah, blah, blah, nonsense about how Big Pharma reps are dumb. Because many of us, who have paid attention know that Big Pharma reps are cunning and conniving and are paid big bucks to be that way. They also are the wheelers and dealers out there giving doctors the incentives to push these drugs on unwitting people--especially the elderly!
Sources:
Pharmaceutical firm caught in kickback scheme
Doctors rarely face consequences for taking pharmaceutical kickbacks
Docs on Pharma Payroll Have Blemished Records, Limited Credentials
So Chris Bronson spare me with your blah, blah, blah, nonsense about how Big Pharma reps are dumb. Because many of us, who have paid attention know that Big Pharma reps are cunning and conniving and are paid big bucks to be that way. They also are the wheelers and dealers out there giving doctors the incentives to push these drugs on unwitting people--especially the elderly!
Sources:
Pharmaceutical firm caught in kickback scheme
Doctors rarely face consequences for taking pharmaceutical kickbacks
Docs on Pharma Payroll Have Blemished Records, Limited Credentials
Told ya.
The problem with people like you in this industry is you think because people aren't as "smart"(haha) as you, then ANYTHING they say regarding these meds is dismissible. You are EXACTLY like the Doctors we were exposed to when my wife(and several other family members/friends) was prescribed these BULLSHIT meds. Exactly like them. We tell you about these side effects, you dismiss it, and usually in the same condescending tone you use here. Because, after all, we're all just uneducated idiots. We're not capable of recognizing something wrong with someone we're with EVERY SINGLE DAY OF THEIR LIVES, as opposed to quacks like yourself who see patients at most every couple of months. One of her doctors only saw her every six months. So, clearly, you would know better than the patient's families, right?
Further, this isn't a shot just towards the psychiatric industry...most of my wife's doctors were all Neurologists prescribing the SSRI's....In fact, the only thing that actually helped my wife at times was Xanax, and that was prescribed by a Psychiatrist who saw her for all of 5 minutes, and we never physically stepped foot in his office again, all while he "treated" her with refills and short conversations over the phone with his head nurse for over a year. Those conversations were "Oh, you need a refill, OK, come pick it up whenever you're ready".
My wife was on twice the recommend dose for Effexor, Lamictal and Kepra - all at the same time, because of narcissists like yourself. People like yourself ignored the warnings and side effects, until it almost killed her via gran mal seizures. Twice. Then, you'd just prescribe MORE medicine, because there's just NO WAY it could be the meds causing it, even though potentially fatal/unstoppable seizures are listed on the box as a potential adverse side effect.
She now has permanent brain damage from those meds, and those seizures. If we were still seeing people like you, she'd probably be dead now. Think about the dosages she was on, then explain to me how she doesn't take ANY medicine now, and has NO problems whatsoever(aside from the damage they caused) seizure related(which was the original "problem" that landed her on these meds)? It doesn't take a medical degree to figure it out.
I suggest you find another line of work, before you end up killing someone, or pissing a family member/ spouse off with your condescending and dismissive attitude to the point they yank you over your desk, like I did to one of her doctors. I only wish I could be a picture on the wall of your office to witness it.
ETA: I'm sure the fact that ALL of her doctors were receiving, at minimum, 12k/per year from different pharma companies had nothing to do with her or others being prescribed these drugs. One doctor received nearly 230k in 2008 alone from the company that makes Effexor. He had her on twice the recommend dose. Nothing to see there.
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Its his opinion. Not mine or anybody else's. Calm Down. You guys are taking this too seriously. What if the evil doctors were right. What if your mother DID (hypothetical)have dementia and/or signs of Alzheimers.
Steven Novella is definitely not an establishment hack. Read his blog, its very educating.
Okay Donnary, PeacePiper all of you. You Win. Vaccines and SSRIs are bad. But don;t discount Cbrons for being a medical student, just because he made a few snarky comments. Cbrons is a libertarian Like YOU Like ME. Not closet authoritarians. If you really think that, then your no better then the evil doctors.