Greece elections 2012: live coverage
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MarcusI
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Note on the reported Exit Polls:
The two exit poll results reported at 7pm were only partial at 75% and 80% of their respective samples. It is being reported that the (more) conclusive exit poll results will be posted at 9pm. [2 pm ET]
Sources from the Interior Ministry also say that their First Estimate on Results will also come later than usual at around 9.30pm [2.30 pm ET] with more conclusive Estimates on Results even later (on May 6th this was around 11pm [4 pm ET]).
The two exit poll results reported at 7pm were only partial at 75% and 80% of their respective samples. It is being reported that the (more) conclusive exit poll results will be posted at 9pm. [2 pm ET]
Sources from the Interior Ministry also say that their First Estimate on Results will also come later than usual at around 9.30pm [2.30 pm ET] with more conclusive Estimates on Results even later (on May 6th this was around 11pm [4 pm ET]).
MarcusI
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Note on the reported Exit Polls:
The two exit poll results reported at 7pm were only partial at 75% and 80% of their respective samples. It is being reported that the (more) conclusive exit poll results will be posted at 9pm. [2 pm ET]
Sources from the Interior Ministry also say that their First Estimate on Results will also come later than usual at around 9.30pm [2.30 pm ET] with more conclusive Estimates on Results even later (on May 6th this was around 11pm [4 pm ET]).
The two exit poll results reported at 7pm were only partial at 75% and 80% of their respective samples. It is being reported that the (more) conclusive exit poll results will be posted at 9pm. [2 pm ET]
Sources from the Interior Ministry also say that their First Estimate on Results will also come later than usual at around 9.30pm [2.30 pm ET] with more conclusive Estimates on Results even later (on May 6th this was around 11pm [4 pm ET]).
MarcusI
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First full exit poll (from Net TV):
New Democracy has between 28.6pc and 30pc, and radical left group Syriza has between 27.5pc and 28.4pc.
Greek state TV (Net TV) estimates that on those exit numbers New Democracy and Pasok could form a coalition. The 300 seats would be distributed thus:
New Democracy 127 (including the bonus 50 for winning), Syriza 72, Pasok 32, Independent Greeks 21, Golden Dawn 19, Democratic Left 16, Communist Party of Greece 13.
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New Democracy and Pasok would have 159 seats, 151 are needed. Probably the euro will survive a few monts more if this results will be confirmed during the evening.
New Democracy has between 28.6pc and 30pc, and radical left group Syriza has between 27.5pc and 28.4pc.
Greek state TV (Net TV) estimates that on those exit numbers New Democracy and Pasok could form a coalition. The 300 seats would be distributed thus:
New Democracy 127 (including the bonus 50 for winning), Syriza 72, Pasok 32, Independent Greeks 21, Golden Dawn 19, Democratic Left 16, Communist Party of Greece 13.
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New Democracy and Pasok would have 159 seats, 151 are needed. Probably the euro will survive a few monts more if this results will be confirmed during the evening.
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Pauls' Revere
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1843: New exit poll via Antenna TV: New Democracy - 28.6-30%, Syriza - 27-28.4%, Pasok - 11-12.5%, Independent Greeks - 6.8-7.8%, Golden Dawn - 6.5-7.1%, Democratic Left - 5.8-6.6%, Communists - 4.8-5.6%
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MarcusI
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If you are rooting for a faster incoming desaster, root for Syriza, if you would like a few months (or years) more of relative, superficial stability, root for New Democracy
(the only party Ron Paul would maybe vote for in Greece will probably be below 0.5%)
(the only party Ron Paul would maybe vote for in Greece will probably be below 0.5%)
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Pauls' Revere
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So, this is about how fast this train wreck is going happen.
Pauls' Revere
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Meanwhile in FRANCE:
1903: Election news from another eurozone state: Francois Hollande's Socialist Party have won an absolute majority in the lower house of parliament, on the basis of exit polls. This should strengthen Mr Hollande's hand in pushing for growth action in the EU. Read our story.
1903: Election news from another eurozone state: Francois Hollande's Socialist Party have won an absolute majority in the lower house of parliament, on the basis of exit polls. This should strengthen Mr Hollande's hand in pushing for growth action in the EU. Read our story.
It's also the flavor of disaster that's at stake. If I were a greek, I would be horrified by my country's economic policy actually being determined by Germany, which seems to be the plan with New Democracy.
Pauls' Revere
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or the EU for that matter. Perhaps with Syriza the crisis will be intense but shorter and at the discretion of Greeks? Is this a fair analyses?
LibertAtOnce
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So I havent been reading mush about this in the past few weeks, could you slightly break down the parties for me?
Seems like its going to be a lose/lose situation anyways.
Seems like its going to be a lose/lose situation anyways.
MarcusI
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I'm mainly with you, but the Problem is, as far as I understand news of today, even Syriza and their leader Tsipras would change their course to stay in the Euro zone. One doesn't know how far they will go, but also most of the european establishment is trying to keep Greece in the euro, as they are afraid of a fast breakdown. Only some German politicians are saying that they won't compromise anymore, but I don't believe them anymore.
I hope that Greece can recover with its own properly devaluated currency. But we will have to wait a few months more. And if Germany agrees to Eurobonds, a few years more. Until Europe plundered the whole of the platinum German credit card. (While Germany also is highly indebted, but the (export) industry is still working very well, so our credit card is still worthy)
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MarcusI
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New Democracy - Establishment, "Conservative", pro-Euro, pro-"Austerity policy" imposed on Greece by EU
Syriza - far-left socialist, new party-coalition, pro-Euro, anti-"Austerity policy" imposed on Greece by EU
PASOK - Establishment, traditional socialist party, pro-Euro, pro-"Austerity policy" imposed on Greece by EU (but not as much as New Democracy)
KKE - old communist party, probably anti-Euro, anti-"Austerity policy" imposed on Greece by EU
Independent Greeks - new right-wing party, pro-Euro, anti-"Austerity policy" imposed on Greece by EU
Golden Dawn - Open fascist, neo-nazi party, anti-Euro, anti-"Austerity policy" imposed on Greece by EU
Democratic Left - don't know exactly, but probably somewhere between Syriza and PASOK.
(Pro-Euro = wish to keep the Euro as currency)
Correct me, Athena, if you do know better
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As I was afraid of:
19.17 German Foreign Minister Guido Westerwelle says Germany could be flexible on the timing of the reforms that Greece has to make as part of its bailout package - but not the meat of the deal:
Quote: "There can't be substantial changes in the engagements. But I can imagine we discuss again a delay. "
First steps, that will lead to more sell-out.
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Pasok leader made a not expected step a few minutes ago and said, that Pasok would not join a coalition without Syriza. I think they are afraid to vanish from the political scene if they accept the EU-forced reforms, but Syriza stays in the opposition, fighting against this forced reforms. This could lead to longer coaltion talks. But somehow they will manage to stay in the Euro for the next few months or years, I predict.
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See, I guess I'm sort of nursing a pet conspiracy theory over here that the massive propaganda effort directed against Syriza/Tsipras is being funded by ECB banksters, cos they are really genuinely scared of of them not being properly controllable. So, they might really just kick Greece out, and maybe Italy et al might follow, which could at least in theory weaken the international banking cartel's death grip on the global economy. lol.
I really know how crazy that sounds, but geopolitics and international finance really are a trip, so you never know!
MarcusI
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To be honest, I have no inside view of Syriza, but that the establishment bankster scene will do anything to stay in power in the background is something I started to believe in about a few month ago, after reading "End the Fed" in German and a few other books.
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Official exit numbers are in, and New Democracy are on course to win. The numbers:
ND 29.5pc,
Syriza 27.1pc,
Pasok 12.3pc,
Independent Greeks 7.6pc,
Golden Dawn 7pc,
Democratic Left 6.2pc,
Communist Party of Greece 4.5pc.
These are numbers from Singular Logic, commissioned for the job by the Greek government.
My understanding is basically the same, except from what I know of Syriza, it's just a hodge podge of leftists without any real plan, and some might be anti-euro more or less. It's just the political expression of the Greek rage over the ero crisis, last-minute thrown together to do something more politically useful than, like, rioting and striking and protesting.
I think so. The ECB has really come out of the closet for the fascists they are this year, removing democratically elected greek officials, and italian officials, telling the irish they weren't ALLOWED to even hold elections, etc.
These are truly wild and crazy times.
MarcusI
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Yes, they are, they are...
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The British "Guardian" on the official exit poll posted above:
"While the official projection could still change, it proved highly accurate in the May election. Costas Panagopoulos of pollster Alco, said it would have declined to publish a forecast as the figures are just too close. We will see as the night wears on."
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The British "Guardian" on the official exit poll posted above:
"While the official projection could still change, it proved highly accurate in the May election. Costas Panagopoulos of pollster Alco, said it would have declined to publish a forecast as the figures are just too close. We will see as the night wears on."
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