Good News: Paul at 16% in LATEST Ohio WeAskAmerica Poll

[Matthew5]

If Romney wins the majority of states tonight, especially if the others only win one a piece, a lot of the talk of a brokered convention will be silenced. Tonight is pretty much the last hope for all the candidates, and unless they mount something serious Romney will essentially cruise the rest of the way to the nomination.

Santorum and Gingrich never had a mathematical shot anyway. They're only in it because they've managed to shore up a few disgruntled factions of the GOP. After tonight, I can see them begrudgingly teaming up with Romney to crush Paul. A brokered convention is an extremely low chance.

I must admit that my confidence is starting to wane in the delegate strategy pushed by the campaign. Maybe if the anti-Romeny sentiment were stronger...but it doesn't seem that way.

As far as the original topic, I commend those that have been in the fight since '07. I can only hope that those of us who have joined later can bring a wide sweeping victory to the liberty movement in this decade.

 

[freeforall]

Please get as many friends and family to vote for Ron today. Please!

I'm calling a few people and sending msgs to the people I know that support or have taken interest in Ron Paul. I have my sign in the window and everyone that votes in my precinct drives past my house (voting is basically in my backyard.) I'm home with the kids today, so that's the best I can do.

 

[Vet_from_cali]

Need twice that for a win

 

[tbone717]

Santorum and Gingrich never had a mathematical shot anyway. They're only in it because they've managed to shore up a few disgruntled factions of the GOP. After tonight, I can see them begrudgingly teaming up with Romney to crush Paul. A brokered convention is an extremely low chance.

I must admit that my confidence is starting to wane in the delegate strategy pushed by the campaign. Maybe if the anti-Romeny sentiment were stronger...but it doesn't seem that way.

As far as the original topic, I commend those that have been in the fight since '07. I can only hope that those of us who have joined later can bring a wide sweeping victory to the liberty movement in this decade.

I agree with you regarding the delegate strategy. For a short time, I thought that they were going to use the confusion about the delegate allocation as spring board to promote that Paul was potentially in second after the four caucus states, in order to create viability for him going into MI, AZ and today. But it didn't happen. Even if we did go to a brokered convention, there is no way in hell that the average voter would rally around a candidate that garnered such a small percentage of the primary season vote, but somehow backdoored his way into the nomination. But that is a entirely different topic.

So from where I am sitting right now, I wouldn't be surprised to see Romney win 7 or 8 tonight, and all things will fall into place from there. If that is the case, then we should be gracious in out loss, learn from our mistakes and not repeat them in the future.

 

[BUSHLIED]

I agree with you regarding the delegate strategy. For a short time, I thought that they were going to use the confusion about the delegate allocation as spring board to promote that Paul was potentially in second after the four caucus states, in order to create viability for him going into MI, AZ and today. But it didn't happen. Even if we did go to a brokered convention, there is no way in hell that the average voter would rally around a candidate that garnered such a small percentage of the primary season vote, but somehow backdoored his way into the nomination. But that is a entirely different topic.

So from where I am sitting right now, I wouldn't be surprised to see Romney win 7 or 8 tonight, and all things will fall into place from there. If that is the case, then we should be gracious in out loss, learn from our mistakes and not repeat them in the future.

well we will just have to wait and see..anything can happen. Let's hope for 3 wins for Paul (AK, ND, and ID) and a Santorum win in OH. F--K the GOP. The longer we can ride this out the better for the message of liberty.

 

[freeforall]

I'm calling a few people and sending msgs to the people I know that support or have taken interest in Ron Paul. I have my sign in the window and everyone that votes in my precinct drives past my house (voting is basically in my backyard.) I'm home with the kids today, so that's the best I can do.

Also, I find it interesting that I have only received responses from females that have voted so far despite reaching out to men and women equally.

 

[gte811i]

I agree with you regarding the delegate strategy. For a short time, I thought that they were going to use the confusion about the delegate allocation as spring board to promote that Paul was potentially in second after the four caucus states, in order to create viability for him going into MI, AZ and today. But it didn't happen. Even if we did go to a brokered convention, there is no way in hell that the average voter would rally around a candidate that garnered such a small percentage of the primary season vote, but somehow backdoored his way into the nomination. But that is a entirely different topic.

So from where I am sitting right now, I wouldn't be surprised to see Romney win 7 or 8 tonight, and all things will fall into place from there. If that is the case, then we should be gracious in out loss, learn from our mistakes and not repeat them in the future.

I really disagree. The whole point of an open convention is the fact that no one won! The people did not or could not decide, so delegates decide for them. Everything is on the table in an open convention . . . Palin, Bush, etc.

I really do not get the moaning and groaning that goes on around this forum. I'm starting to think the majority of people that post are just paper internet tigers.

GOTV is important, PFH is important. But honestly, actually really changing peoples opinions takes a lot more than just a couple of phone calls. It takes a lot of conversations, research, time, etc. The beast we are up against has been going on for about 100 years. To honestly think that we'll be able to change peoples opinions in a week or 2 week period before an election when the MSM, GOP establishment, and who knows what else is bombarding the airwaves with propaganda is a little disingenuous.

The real action, the real fight is at the local level. If you are not involved at the local level in your local GOP-then you are a paper tiger.

If you have enough support at the local you can take the fight to the state level, then to the national level. Everything rolls up.

I personally am a very firm believer that the course we are on as a country is unsustainable. I lived in a country that had an economic collapse; if you aren't trying to make a change at the local level now . . . well.

People always get the government they deserve.

 

[Matthew5]

I really disagree. The whole point of an open convention is the fact that no one won! The people did not or could not decide, so delegates decide for them. Everything is on the table in an open convention . . . Palin, Bush, etc.

Exactly, everything is on the table, therefore empowering the establishment even more.

I really do not get the moaning and groaning that goes on around this forum. I'm starting to think the majority of people that post are just paper internet tigers.

GOTV is important, PFH is important. But honestly, actually really changing peoples opinions takes a lot more than just a couple of phone calls. It takes a lot of conversations, research, time, etc. The beast we are up against has been going on for about 100 years. To honestly think that we'll be able to change peoples opinions in a week or 2 week period before an election when the MSM, GOP establishment, and who knows what else is bombarding the airwaves with propaganda is a little disingenuous.

The real action, the real fight is at the local level. If you are not involved at the local level in your local GOP-then you are a paper tiger..

"All politics is local", I get that. But I think you go too far in calling anyone not involved in their local GOP a paper tiger. You can be party-less and still make a huge difference. Also, you're assuming that one's sphere of influence is larger than the GOTV and PFH network. I would argue the reverse, if you merely just talk to your sphere of influence (i.e. friends, family, and social media) about the issues and you don't do any of the grunt work, you're a paper tiger. But I think there's lots you can do without being a GOP apologist.

You have a valid point, education must take place to counter propaganda. However, the political machine that is representative democracy still exsists. So traditional campainging cannot be dismissed. Changing people's opinions can be as simple as a GOTV or tableing at a park.

 

[Merk]

Last is not good. Sorry but being realistic. Ron NEEDS a WIN. The blackout is so complete that many people don't realize he is still in the race.

Ron NEEDS a WIN!

 

[Matthew5]

Last is not good. Sorry but being realistic. Ron NEEDS a WIN. The blackout is so complete that many people don't realize he is still in the race.

Ron NEEDS a WIN!

I agree, "Good News" in the title is very relative here. It's valuable to many veterans, but very disheartening for a political campaign overall.

 

[V3n]

Don't let Ohio get you down. They cheat anyway.
If you're in Ohio - GOTV - it is your duty!
But if you don't live in Ohio, I wouldn't spend many brain cycles focusing/thinking/worrying about it - the State is too far gone.

Flashback to Presidential Election 2004:
http://gizmodo.com/5825014/how-the-2004-presidential-election-may-have-been-hacked

Ohio's 2004 presidential election is one many won't forget. Democrat John Kerry was the leader and exit polls pegged him as the winner. Defying explanation, a last-minute shift in votes favored Republican George W. Bush and propelled him to victory.

"The computer system and SmarTech had the correct placement, connectivity, and computer experts necessary to change the election in any manner desired by the controllers of the SmarTech computers."

To make things even more intriguing, SmarTech was owned by Michael Connell who mysteriously died in a 2008 single-engine plane crash shortly after being served a subpoena in this case. His full testimony will never be heard.

then to tie up other loose ends: http://www.alternet.org/story/58328/

In 56 of Ohio's 88 counties, ballots and election records from 2004 have been "accidentally" destroyed, despite a federal order to preserve them -- it was crucial evidence which would have revealed whether the election was stolen.

So this was a State he'd never be ALLOWED to win anyway.
But if you live here, don't let that keep you from getting out - GET OUT AND GIVE THEM A FIGHT!!!

 

[Merk]

THen we're not helping ourselves by providing headlines like this one:

Ron Paul: I know my chances are slim (7:09)
Mar. 4, 2012 - As the GOP Presidential candidates gear up for Super Tuesday, Bob Schieffer speaks with Ron Paul about his chances of winning the nomination and what his measurement of success is.

htt p://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/ron-paul-i-know-my-chances-are-slim-709/2012/03/04/gIQAe2yBrR_video.html

 

[Cabal]

Good news: you have a 16% chance to live! CONGRATS!

 

[PolicyReader]

Believe me if the Results are something like this:

Romney-32
Santorum-28
Paul-20
Gingrich-20

or even

Romney-32
Santorum-27
Gingrich-21
Paul-20

This would be news. The media is all eyeing Ohio. If the votes were this spilt up, I think we would be looking at a brokered Convention type scenario. This would have been the closest primary race yet...

Also with Santorum off the ballot within several of the districts in Ohio the poll totals and the vote total won't match as tightly, this is good news within those districts.

 

[jbauer]

Winner winner chicken dinner. This is about the message not the man. The question is who becomes our man/woman when/if the Dr calls it a day and how do we take the people we've convinced and convince them to keep up the fight with someone new?

We are winning in the long run folks, don't be discouraged. This is not a one year campaign for liberty, this a decades long effort.

 

[gte811i]

Exactly, everything is on the table, therefore empowering the establishment even more.




"All politics is local", I get that. But I think you go too far in calling anyone not involved in their local GOP a paper tiger. You can be party-less and still make a huge difference. Also, you're assuming that one's sphere of influence is larger than the GOTV and PFH network. I would argue the reverse, if you merely just talk to your sphere of influence (i.e. friends, family, and social media) about the issues and you don't do any of the grunt work, you're a paper tiger. But I think there's lots you can do without being a GOP apologist.

You have a valid point, education must take place to counter propaganda. However, the political machine that is representative democracy still exsists. So traditional campainging cannot be dismissed. Changing people's opinions can be as simple as a GOTV or tableing at a park.

I've done PFH grunt work, etc. and I can tell you my sphere of influence is way more effective with friends and family vs. PFH. And please, no turning the argument, I never said anything about being a GOP apologist.

Too many people can't seem to understand the GOP isn't some monolithic block. Just like the government isn't some ephemeral "thing". The GOP and the government are just people, they are individuals.

People say, well I'll never vote for the GOP or I'll never join them, etc. If you want to effect change thing you've got 2 choices, create your own group (good luck with that, Libertarian Party . . . ) or you can use the existing power structure and take it over.

Now you tell me, which is easier?

And FYI, I've got myself, my wife, both parents, my brother (and possibly a sister-in-law) coming to the local delegate convention. Now, which is going to get more bang for the buck . . . spending 5 hours on PFH listening to phone rings and possibly convincing 5 people to show up and vote . . . or getting 5 people to be delegates at their local convention?

I love to do tabling, GOTV, etc. but as far as a bang for the buck, you get more success and more high commitment with your own personal circle.

 

[WD-NY]

If Santorum only wins OK and nothing else, I wouldn't be surprised to see him suspend. He was leading in OH and TN at one point, so losing those two would signal that the campaign is all but over for him in my opinion.

We should be so lucky.

The guy perpetuates the worst aspects of the religious right. I think many of these voters, if given the chance to hear Paul's message without some blowhard like Santorum sending their "ids" into a tizzy (by yelling about Iran nukes, contraception, and gay marriage revving up their blood-pressure), would finally understand how they're being played by politicians like Santorum (and talking-heads like Rush/Levin/etc.).

The sooner Santorum is out, the better.... but I doubt he'll suspend.

The media turned against Romney a few weeks ago (right after they realized that Romney could actually win over Ron and that Romney + Paul = win over Obama), so all Santo needs to do from now until the convention is continue feeding them 'red meat' (e.g. "Obama, what a snob!") that brings down Romneys/GOP approval/likability and they'll more than cover his lack of funds.

There's no way the media would ever allow Ron to 'educate' evangelicals about how they're being played. Then again, Ron seems entirely unwilling to give an election night speech that lays out in no uncertain terms why they should rally behind the true/honest 'christian', so perhaps they don't even need to run a pick and roll.

 

[doctorfunk]

Winner winner chicken dinner. This is about the message not the man. The question is who becomes our man/woman when/if the Dr calls it a day and how do we take the people we've convinced and convince them to keep up the fight with someone new?

The other issue is whether it will matter in the long run. If the system goes down before we can make a substantial difference, it's a moot point. None of the other candidates will do much to cut spending and likely get us into at least 1 more "war" in the middle east.

 

[gte811i]

The other issue is whether it will matter in the long run. If the system goes down before we can make a substantial difference, it's a moot point. None of the other candidates will do much to cut spending and likely get us into at least 1 more "war" in the middle east.

I'm not so convinced it's about making changes before the system goes down (I'd love that to be the case though!) but that it's about being in positions of influence and being ready to lead when the system goes down.

 

[tbone717]

We should be so lucky.

The guy perpetuates the worst aspects of the religious right. I think many of these voters, if given the chance to hear Paul's message without some blowhard like Santorum sending their "ids" into a tizzy (by yelling about Iran nukes, contraception, and gay marriage revving up their blood-pressure), would finally understand how they're being played by politicians like Santorum (and talking-heads like Rush/Levin/etc.).

The sooner Santorum is out, the better.... but I doubt he'll suspend.

The media turned against Romney a few weeks ago (right after they realized that Romney could actually win over Ron and that Romney + Paul = win over Obama), so all Santo needs to do from now until the convention is continue feeding them 'red meat' (e.g. "Obama, what a snob!") that brings down Romneys/GOP approval/likability and they'll more than cover his lack of funds.

There's no way the media would ever allow Ron to 'educate' evangelicals about how they're being played. Then again, Ron seems entirely unwilling to give an election night speech that lays out in no uncertain terms why they should rally behind the true/honest 'christian', so perhaps they don't even need to run a pick and roll.

A couple points. I think if Santorum does only win one tonight, he is likely to pack it in. Looking forward there are not many states that he can be really strong in, and the ones that he can are smaller states. If he would have pulled out a win in MI then the story would be different for him. But taking home OK alone out of a field of ten states pretty much signals the end for him, and a time to rally around the eventual nominee.

I noticed that too with Romney. I think the left now sees Romney as a far stronger challenger to Obama than they originally though, and if he does manage to court a portion of the libertarian wing with his VP choice, he is going to be even harder to defeat. The decked is already stacked against Obama this year with the shift in the electoral college, so I expect to see the left go after him hard. Santorum is a good party player (hell he endorsed Specter over Toomey), so I think he knows well enough not to help the Dems out in their cause, especially if it is evident that his shot at the nomination is all but over.

As far as the Paul campaign, well you and I are in agreement on a lot. They never played retail politics like they should have, they never changed gears (ie the same stump speech over & over). We have moved the goalposts so many times for that breakthru win, it's not even funny. Maybe he will indeed get one tonight. Honestly though, it is too little too late. Pulling out one win tonight isn't going to matter a whole hell of a lot to the average voter. He'll get some money from the loyalists of course, which will allow him to stay on the trail. But personally, I think he has been in "education" mode for a long time now and is out there solely to keep a few issues on the table, and hopefully have a hand in shaping the platform at the convention. I know it is hard for us Paul supporters to hear it, but it is simply the reality of the situation. Unless by some extraordinary means Paul pulls out 3 wins tonight, and makes some headlines, then I really think his chances to win this thing go from slim to none.

And Newt? Well he will win GA (yawn)