god or no god?

[Becker]

Negative, it's the same reasoning. There is no irony.

so you admit its the same reasoning? Ok.

 

[Becker]

"What is this thing called "the state" and why do you have a right to aggress against me? And force me into it's framework?"

I can turn the question on you. What are your so called "rights" and why do you have a right to not be aggressed on? And force me into your prescriptive model?

 

[Conza88]

I can turn the question on you. What are your so called "rights" and why do you have a right to not be aggressed on? And force me into your prescriptive model?

No, the burden of proof rests with you. I'm not forcing you into anything. Ignorance ain't bliss, educate yourself.

 

[Becker]

No, the burden of proof rests with you. I'm not forcing you into anything. Ignorance ain't bliss, educate yourself.

burden of proof is on the person making the extraordinary claim, not the positive claim.
Since you are the one advocating the claim that your system is better than the status quo, YOU have the onus.
You ARE forcing me to your system, or you would if you could. Educating myself isn't changing the FACT that you are forcing your system of NAP, voluntaryism, ancap, whatever you call it, against me, who has never agreed to it. I didn't say your system is wrong, bad, impractical, or immoral (even though I can make arguments for all of them), but I can say for great certainty that not all humans will agree, and you'd be forcing it on other people by not allowing them to disobey your rules, and live without consequences.

 

[jmdrake]

SWEET. So as long as I can say or prove that the oppressed are masochists, what's next? I'm not the oppressor. How nice!

The oppressed standing up against you is absolute proof that they aren't masochists. Really your arguments make no sense. I think you know that though and you're just typing for the heck of it.

It's not possible to have a country of 100% anything (other than human), so this point has no value.

It has plenty of value for someone willing to see it. The original point is that oppression (people being thrown in prison, killed etc) happens in part because people have a spark inside that drives them to rise up against oppressors. Take North Korea for instance. There are people who support the regime. If there weren't the regime would fall. Those people are suffering but don't realize it. The people being killed or thrown into prison are those who still have some level of resistance.

Please name a country that's 100% Christian
another one that's 100% sadist
another one that's 100% criminal
another that's 100% crime free.

Your counterpoints are irrelevant. I think you know that. If you don't then you need to rethink the entire thread. Again the point that I'm making is that oppressors oppress (imprison and/or kill) people who resist their oppression. That doesn't mean that the general population isn't suffering. But the general population isn't being oppressed if they willingly go along with the mismanagement.

Chimpanzees kill each other all the time? Not enough to become extinct, right?

Human beings kill each other all the time but not enough to become extinct. So what's your point?

 

[Phil]

One cannot prove there is any sort of deity, and one cannot prove there is not any sort of deity. It is all based on faith. If you would prefer to follow one of the books that claim to be the word of a deity, be my guest. Until there is undeniable proof that has not been recreated or rewritten by a prophet (like the Bible), I will have my doubts that there is a deity, yet will keep my mind open that the possibility for a hidden deity is out there.

 

[Revolution9]

One cannot prove there is any sort of deity, and one cannot prove there is not any sort of deity. It is all based on faith. If you would prefer to follow one of the books that claim to be the word of a deity, be my guest. Until there is undeniable proof that has not been recreated or rewritten by a prophet (like the Bible), I will have my doubts that there is a deity, yet will keep my mind open that the possibility for a hidden deity is out there.

...and yer a Doctor and this crap is the best you can come up with. I am glad my schooling never got in the way of my education. Let me guess..yer degree is psych?

Rev9

 

[Phil]

...and yer a Doctor and this crap is the best you can come up with. I am glad my schooling never got in the way of my education. Let me guess..yer degree is psych?

Rev9

No, I'm not a doctor; it's a nickname. Could you explain why you're insulting me?

 

[Wesker1982]

Could you explain why you're insulting me?

He thinks ad hominems are effective arguments. Probably too much rum, argh!

 

[Becker]

Human beings kill each other all the time but not enough to become extinct. So what's your point?

you tell me, why did you bring it up. How about you answer my question, are humans expected to have lower or higher rate of kin homocided compared to ants, or apes, or fish?

 

[Revolution9]

No, I'm not a doctor; it's a nickname. Could you explain why you're insulting me?

WTF? Yer not a doctor but just playing one on a forum. Carry on. I retract what i said as thought you were an ivory tower ensconced shithead laying out 101 psychobabble like they actually knew something.. Clue one.. Yer first mistake is if you are looking for a God "out there". All assumptions after that fail from extending from the wrong premises. As well having a correct idea of the concept is helpful. It is easy to dismiss an anthropomorphic deity due to limitation of anthropomorphs. It is not so easy to dismiss an energetics law based concept that unifies all the systems and activities in this universe under a single conductor.

Rev9

 

[Becker]

Your counterpoints are irrelevant.

I can't win this argument, so I'll say your points are irrelevant. Easy enough.

 

[MaxPower]

I wish to share something I was watching tonight and thought might be relevant to this discussion:

 

[LibertyRevolution]

Science > Faith.

Faith says: This is how it is, because we said so, and if you see something that disagrees with that, then its the devil!
Science says: I think this is how it is, lets test that theory and see if it gives us our predicted outcome, and if it doesn't, lets try something else.

Anyways...
String theory only works if you view it with the understanding that there are 11 dimensions.
Then all the math works, as in you can use the math to predict the outcome of an event.
They are doing currently running tests that are giving back data that is is pointing towards the fact that we live in a multidimensional space-time...

Here is a story about how dark flow may be linked to gravitational forces from outside our universe:
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2008/11/081105-dark-flow.html

Faith would say, God is tugging on the universe on that side because that is what he felt like doing...
I mean seriously, you people that believe in religion are living in the damn stone age...

 

[tttppp]

The only way for the universe to come into existence is for it to have always existed. The only way this could be possible is if zero=infinity. In infinity, there is no beginning or end. Therefore, there is no God who created the universe.

 

[Johnny Appleseed]

this is sooooo 2011 everyone knows now that science and religion both get in the way of mans natural understanding of his Creator