Everything I hated about my own party all in one candidate called Trump.

From earlier this year:



Crafting the message or messenger has nothing to do with it.

Ron was about as Simon-Pure a messenger as you could get and he was roundly rejected.

Klamath is right, people don't want freedom.

The authoritarian Right wants a police state "Fortress America".

The authoritarian Left wants a doctrinaire "politically correct" state.

I agree with you about Ron, but the authoritarian Right wants a police state "Fortress America". The authoritarian left wants a police state "Fortress America". Wake up, those two sides are sleeping with the same dog, and share the same fleas. They have all been blackmailed by the NSA. The NSA has dirt on every elected official !!! Now who really own the NSA, I don't have a clue... Russia, China, Obama, Saudi Arabia, Iran? That we will probably never know.

But the actions of the U.S. Congress are totally abnormal. They are bought, owned, and protected by some entity.
 
From earlier this year:



Crafting the message or messenger has nothing to do with it.

Ron was about as Simon-Pure a messenger as you could get and he was roundly rejected.

Klamath is right, people don't want freedom.

The authoritarian Right wants a police state "Fortress America".

The authoritarian Left wants a doctrinaire "politically correct" state.

Most of the rank and file didn't have a clue what Ron was talking about. Do you know some even got the idea, from what they understood Ron to say, that he would not defend America, if we were attacked? And a couple of them from this very forum. They dropped him like a hot potato. One, I had spoken to on the phone several times before that and I did my best to change his mind, but nope, Ron just wasn't clear enough. I knew that too. He confused a lot of people. So, they didn't hear the message from him. Unfortunately, he wasn't the best messenger.

Be honest. Do you remember all the times we had to run all over creation trying to "fix" something that Ron said? I remember it. It was like, oh crap, not again.

But, you're right. Some do not want freedom and probably never will. But, a lot do.
 
Ron's message Never caught on and for every 1 person that cheered "we have been bombing them for 10 years" 9 said I will now never vote for that American hating sob.

No what is winning is to "form a police state to kick foreigners out". There is NOTHING encouraging about this election so far. It is worse than it ever was.

Ron was horrible at messaging too (though in a completely different way because with Ron everything came from principle). Ron's foreign policy itself is hardly distinguishable from say, Pat Buchanan's. Was Pat ever accused of being a, weak, American hating, loser? To the contrary, the media tried to paint Pat as a Nazi! What was the difference? Message. While Ron would often get in to the immorality of bombing and starving Arab children, Pat focused entirely on Americans. Pat knew that Americans don't care about dead Arab kids (maybe he genuinely doesn't either for all I know) and even broaching the issue was pure political poison. "America First" is the way you successfully pitch non-interventionism to the American public.

This election cycle is the most favorable for one that has ever been for the Liberty Movement. We need to stay focused and not let the stumbles of any particular candidate take our eyes off of the ball. There are a lot of races out there.
 
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Ron was horrible at messaging too (though in a completely different way because with Ron everything came from principle). Ron's foreign policy itself is hardly distinguishable from say, Pat Buchanan's. Was Pat ever accused of being a, weak, American hating, loser? To the contrary, the media tried to paint Pat as a Nazi! What was the difference? Message. While Ron would often get in to the immorality of bombing and starving Arab children, Pat focused entirely on Americans. Pat knew that Americans don't care about dead Arab kids (maybe he genuinely doesn't either for all I know) and even broaching the issue was pure political poison. "America First" is the way you successfully pitch non-interventionism to the American public.

This election cycle is the most favorable for one that has ever been for the Liberty Movement. We need to stay focused and not let the stumbles of any particular candidate take our eyes off of the ball. There are a lot of races out there.
Buchanan got his ass handed to him multiple times and he was a damned good speaker. The raise of trump is showing a miserable downturn in the liberty movement.
 
Suddenly realized why I dislike Trump so bad. He is everything I was ashamed and didn't like about elements of my own party.

A flip flopper.
A chickenhawk
a croney capitalist
Disgusting attitudes about women
Extreme hatred of Hispanics
Part of the establishment that has led us so wrong
Racist.
Anti free trade.
country club republican
macho man that is really a coward
Slimy slick salesman
inherited wealth rich brat
Support for torture

I'd say you represent most of what I hate about some RP supporters.

-What are his "disgusting" attitudes about women?

-Give me one shred of evidence that he has an "extreme" hatred of Hispanics.

-Give me one shred of evidence that he is racist.

-Give me one shred of evidence that he is anti-free trade.

Some of the others you may have a point, but ultimately you are no better than a marxist, I recall Ron being constantly called "racist" and "sexist" and all that shit over and over, those are just lazy attacks from weak minded people.
 
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I'd say you represent most of what I hate about some RP supporters.

-What are his "disgusting" attitudes about women?

-Give me one shred of evidence that he has an "extreme" hatred of Hispanics.

-Give me one shred of evidence that he is racist.

-Give me one shred of evidence that he is anti-free trade.

Some of the others you may have a point, but ultimately you are no better than a marxist, I recall Ron being carelessly being called "racist" and "sexist" and all that shit over and over, those are just lazy attacks from weak minded people.

He changes trophy wives more often than some people trade in their cars, and poses them nearly nude on the cover of Vanity Fair. His whole platform is 'Deport Hispanics' and it's the only actual policy stance on his whole website. He buys influence, and proudly admits doing so on national television and radio.

Now, I admit he's awfully hard to pin down on anything, since he has loudly proclaimed that he has no positions, knows nothing, and won't hire people to teach him enough to take a position unless and until we turn out to be stupid enough to elect him. But we know he bores easily of trophy wives, stands on a platform with one plank--deport brown people, and would rather bribe politicians than compete with his competition. We do know this much about him.

How do you manage to miss all this stuff? Why would we have to show you this?
 
Forum's kludgy this morning. Doesn't seem to be slowing the Trump Chumps much, though.
 
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I sell my products nearly all over the world excepting the countries that have high fraud rate and lousy mail. I buy products from all over the world with the same exceptions.
The worst possible place is Britain. The highest tariffs and they that don't even tell the buyer if they are holding their package. For the most part I don't see a problem with free trade. Get somebody like trump in and the inflation is going to go through the roof with tariffs. If Americans can't compete it isn't because of migrants it is because of the regulations our own government puts on US businesses and a mindset with American laborers that low skilled labor deserves 15 bucks an hour.
The whole tariff thing is a sure way with all the other factors to bring on another depression. When that happens Trump will declare war on China to solve our problems.
 
Ron's message Never caught on and for every 1 person that cheered "we have been bombing them for 10 years" 9 said I will now never vote for that American hating sob.

No what is winning is to "form a police state to kick foreigners out". There is NOTHING encouraging about this election so far. It is worse than it ever was.

Oh brother, this crap again? Hey genius, we controlled the border pre-1965, was America more of a police state then? Where the hell do you guys keep getting this idiocy that having a border requires a police state? I have stated several times now that enforcing the border could be done with some very simple steps that would actually reduce the need for police actions, but hey, keep on believing what you want to believe and doing the chicken little thing.

He changes trophy wives more often than some people trade in their cars, and poses them nearly nude on the cover of Vanity Fair. His whole platform is 'Deport Hispanics' and it's the only actual policy stance on his whole website. He buys influence, and proudly admits doing so on national television and radio.

Now, I admit he's awfully hard to pin down on anything, since he has loudly proclaimed that he has no positions, knows nothing, and won't hire people to teach him enough to take a position unless and until we turn out to be stupid enough to elect him. But we know he bores easily of trophy wives, stands on a platform with one plank--deport brown people, and would rather bribe politicians than compete with his competition. We do know this much about him.

How do you manage to miss all this stuff? Why would we have to show you this?

I didn't miss anything, and you are as I said about Klamath, as bad as any Marxist, you lie to smear people. Trumps views on immigration apply to everyone, never has it just been directed at Hispanics, you are just like people who say Ron was anti-Semitic because he wanted to cut off aid to Israel, but he wanted to cut off aid to everyone, like them, you fail.

As to how he treats his wives, well, they were adults, made their own choices, whether or not it's "disgusting" is a matter of opinion, you are certainly entitled to that opinion, but it is not a fact.

He has bribed people, OK, I didn't dispute that, so not sure why you mentioned it.

I sell my products nearly all over the world excepting the countries that have high fraud rate and lousy mail. I buy products from all over the world with the same exceptions.
The worst possible place is Britain. The highest tariffs and they that don't even tell the buyer if they are holding their package. For the most part I don't see a problem with free trade. Get somebody like trump in and the inflation is going to go through the roof with tariffs. If Americans can't compete it isn't because of migrants it is because of the regulations our own government puts on US businesses and a mindset with American laborers that low skilled labor deserves 15 bucks an hour.
The whole tariff thing is a sure way with all the other factors to bring on another depression. When that happens Trump will declare war on China to solve our problems.

Oh really, so is that why America was far more prosperous when we had tariffs and virtually no 3rd world illegal aliens or even legal 3rd world immigrants? Amazes me how people will so fiercely deny reality to cling to their ideals.
 
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I'd say you represent most of what I hate about some RP supporters.

-What are his "disgusting" attitudes about women?

-Give me one shred of evidence that he has an "extreme" hatred of Hispanics.

-Give me one shred of evidence that he is racist.

-Give me one shred of evidence that he is anti-free trade.

Some of the others you may have a point, but ultimately you are no better than a marxist, I recall Ron being constantly called "racist" and "sexist" and all that shit over and over, those are just lazy attacks from weak minded people.
Then leave. as far as your other points it wouldn't make the slightest bit of difference how much evidence I presented as it has been proved Trump supporters don't use logic or facts in their support. I am sure you are for single payer healthcare now too.
 
Last time around, they voted for the establishment. This time around, they don't want the establishment.

They think Rand is establishment. That's largely why his numbers are where they are. That, plus he is not addressing the issues that the VOTERS care most about and if he mentions them, he is so nuanced, that it's difficult to distinguish him from all the others.

Anyway, that's what I think is going on.

That's nothing new. In 2008, remember John McCain was called a "Maverick," and painted as being extremely anti establishment. Their choices have nothing to do with establishment or anti establishment, but with their willingness to be deceived. If an establishment guy is more willing to deceive them, they vote for that guy. If an anti establishment guy is more willing to deceive them, they vote for that guy. The one thing they want absolutely nothing to do with, is the truth. Someone on Ron Paul Forums in 2007 promoting John McCain would have been ridiculed even more intensely than the Trump supporters are today.
 
That's nothing new. In 2008, remember John McCain was called a "Maverick," and painted as being extremely anti establishment. Their choices have nothing to do with establishment or anti establishment, but with their willingness to be deceived. If an establishment guy is more willing to deceive them, they vote for that guy. If an anti establishment guy is more willing to deceive them, they vote for that guy. The one thing they want absolutely nothing to do with, is the truth. Someone on Ron Paul Forums in 2007 promoting John McCain would have been ridiculed even more intensely than the Trump supporters are today.

Probably. If someone was doing what AuH20 was, but he's gone and the attacking and ridiculing is still going on.

I don't think it's a matter of deception. It think it's a matter of what they see from everyone else in comparison. Including Rand, unfortunately.
 
Then leave. as far as your other points it wouldn't make the slightest bit of difference how much evidence I presented as it has been proved Trump supporters don't use logic or facts in their support. I am sure you are for single payer healthcare now too.

You don't represent this place, how dare you tell him to leave!! :mad:
 
You don't represent this place, how dare you tell him to leave!! :mad:
You however have a strong history of banning many people when you didn't like their opinions. I am sure you had the highest ban rate of any mod in you day.
 
Then leave. as far as your other points it wouldn't make the slightest bit of difference how much evidence I presented as it has been proved Trump supporters don't use logic or facts in their support. I am sure you are for single payer healthcare now too.

Lol, logic and facts. Let me give you a few of those:

1. I said some, not all, so, why should I leave?

2. I'm not a Trump supporter, never once claimed that I was, I'll defend my worst enemy against false accusations.

3. You've not provided any evidence to support any of the things I called you out on, in fact I presented several facts to the contrary which you ignore.
 
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Lol, logic and facts. Let me give you a few of those:

1. I said some, not all, so, why should I leave?

2. I'm not a Trump supporter, never once claimed that I was, I'll defend my worst enemy against false accusations.

3. You've not provided any evidence to support any of the things I called you out on, in fact I presented several facts to the contrary which you ignore.

I'm not a Trump supporter, never once claimed that I was
-but you are.
 
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