Elizabeth Warren: Why Isn't The Minimum Wage Today $22/Hour?

[angelatc]

Warren, Obama and McCain. 3 of a kind.

Sleezestaks !

 

[angelatc]

I'm in agreement with you on the minimum wage matter.

Not arguing in favor of "living wage" or anything like that, but we've had a minimum wage for a while, and I think it should keep up with inflation.

OK, now I know I'm not crazy.

 

[jbauer]

Please define "their fair share of the pie." Are you implying that businesses are "giving away" money to "skilled" labor? They pay a market rate for a given skill.

Honestly I don't know what the "fair share" is its what one is willing to pay. It just interesting to note the vast rise in excecutive pay since the 80s realitive to the stagnation of the common man. With that said why has executive pay increase 100x+ fold? Are the conducting 100x+ the work?

 

[angelatc]

I wonder if life is easier or more difficult being this stupid? Ignorance is bliss, but damn.

I am fairly convinced that life is easier when you're stupid and mean. Without the internal drive to be correct, it's easier to get things done.

 

[anaconda]

When the value of an average man's labor goes below the cost of living the nation becomes a slow-motion death camp

Who has the responsibility to acquire a skill set that is worth a handsome wage to an employer? How would Ron Paul answer this question?

 

[angelatc]

Honestly I don't know what the "fair share" is its what one is willing to pay. It just interesting to note the vast rise in excecutive pay since the 80s realitive to the stagnation of the common man. With that said why has executive pay increase 100x+ fold? Are the conducting 100x+ the work?

Or maybe the obvious answer is obvious: there is a much bigger demand for CEO skills than low-end labor skills. Managing a company in the 80's was much different than managing a company today due to a myriad of factors.

Putting a nut on a bolt for 8 hours a day? Not so much. If anything, it's easier what with all the high tech tools and government work standards that CEO has to adhere to.

ANd of course, allowing unfettered transmigration increases the supply of labor, which also drives wage down.

 

[kcchiefs6465]

That's clearly a fault of government. Banks are businesses. They want survive and profit like any other business. If they can get bailed out and lobby for special treatment that isn't their fault. That is the fault of elected officials.

Enough from my tangent.

They deceived people a century ago into supporting the establishment of a central bank and this is just a consequence of it. The people never would have went for it had it not been deceptively coined the Federal Reserve System. There was a great deal of resentment towards 'money trusts' at the time and the people did not want banking consolidated into the hands of a few extremely wealthy men. Of course politicians cater to them. They control the money. Elizabeth Warren says mininum wage should be 20 dollars an hours yet she forgets this simple fact- A 'dollar' is not a dollar. They can't even tell us what a 'dollar' is. From 1913 to now, the purchasing power has eroded something like 97%. I have some really good graphics but imgur isn't uploading them for some reason.

Here is another great quote. This one from Sir Josiah Stamp, President of the Bank of England in the '20s, and second richest man in Britain- "Banking was conceived in iniquity and was born in sin. The Bankers own the earth. Take it away from them, but leave them the power to create deposits, and with the flick of the pen they will create enough deposits to buy it back again. However, take it away from them, and all the great fortunes like mine will disappear and they ought to disappear, for this would be a happier and better world to live in. But, if you wish to remain the slaves of Bankers and pay the cost of your own slavery, let them continue to create deposits."

 

[anaconda]

why has executive pay increase 100x+ fold? Are the conducting 100x+ the work?

I have not looked into this but it is a fascinating question. I have a suspicion that 1) there are some less-than free market forces at work here and that 2) being an effective CEO today may require a phenomenal "skill set" compared to 1950.

One thing that comes to mind is that a CEO who has served in, or dealt with, or made political donations to, government at a high level may have the contacts to effectively lobby for huge taxpayer funded contracts and/or lobby for preferential regulations. So, that CEO might be a very valuable factor in getting revenue and "market share" for his/her firm ( nothing wrong with schmoozing and selling, I just don't like it on my tax dime). Don't know if there's any truth to this but it's a question I have.

 

[angelatc]

I have not looked into this but it is a fascinating question. I have a suspicion that 1) there are some less-than free market forces at work here and that 2) being an effective CEO today may require a phenomenal "skill set" compared to 1950.

One thing that comes to mind is that a CEO who has served in, or dealt with, or made political donations to, government at a high level may have the contacts to effectively lobby for huge taxpayer funded contracts and lobby for preferential regulations. So, that CEO might be a very valuable factor in getting revenue and "market share" for his/her firm ( nothing wrong with schmoozing and selling, I just don't like it on my tax dime). Don't know if there's any truth to this but it's a question I have.

Sure there's lobbying involved. No major corporation can survive without lobbyists, because, as Google and Microsoft found out, if you don't go after the government they will come after you.

But just think how the markets have changed, and how many old corporations have gone under or been bought out by bigger companies. All of these happen at lightening speed compared to a generation ago, and the pressures from international competition is much greater than it ever was in the past. Keeping a company alive despite the endless needs of everybody else - consumers, customers, employees, government, suppliers, banks... takes as much art as skill.

Meanwhile, sweeping the floor after everybody goes home is still pretty much the same job as it ever was.

 

[anaconda]

 

[angelatc]

They deceived people a century ago into supporting the establishment of a central bank and this is just a consequence of it. "

Those people are all dead. And while there's a lot of truth in that, the government still hasn't corrected the mistake?

 

[otherone]

The minimum wage has made a labor monopoly for employers of unskilled workers. Employers don't have to compete for them, as everyone at the bottom pays the same. Remove the minimum wage, and the initial reaction by the market will be to lower wages, followed by an increasing wage war to attract employees.

 

[anaconda]

Sure there's lobbying involved. No major corporation can survive without lobbyists, because, as Google and Microsoft found out, if you don't go after the government they will come after you.

But just think how the markets have changed, and how many old corporations have gone under or been bought out by bigger companies. All of these happen at lightening speed compared to a generation ago, and the pressures from international competition is much greater than it ever was in the past. Keeping a company alive despite the endless needs of everybody else - consumers, customers, employees, government, suppliers, banks... takes as much art as skill.

Meanwhile, sweeping the floor after everybody goes home is still pretty much the same job as it ever was.

I believe we are on exactly the same page here. And I assume that we both would like to eliminate or greatly reduce the circumstances whereby "the government comes after the corporation" and "the corporation goes after the government."

 

[angelatc]

I believe we are on exactly the same page here. And I assume that we both would like to eliminate or greatly reduce the circumstances whereby "the government comes after the corporation" and "the corporation goes after the government."

Absolutely. Paypal and that direct lender-to-borrower site also came to mind after I typed that. They had innovative ideas, satisfied customer bases, and were targeted for investigation by the government just because they existed.

But the world is what it is - a CEO with the patience and skill to navigate the endless minefields is an asset that corporations can't easily replace. On the other hand, as a staff accountant, I could be swapped out by any number of people. Therefore I didn't make as much as the CEO.

 

[anaconda]

The minimum wage has made a labor monopoly for employers of unskilled workers. Employers don't have to compete for them, as everyone at the bottom pays the same. Remove the minimum wage, and the initial reaction by the market will be to lower wages, followed by an increasing wage war to attract employees.

Employers will hire a minimum wage worker only if that worker's contribution to the marginal revenue product for that firm exceeds the minimum wage. If the minimum wage goes away, an employer now has the option of hiring additional, yet even less skilled, workers because, while they result in a lower addition to the marginal revenue product of the firm, the firm can further increase its profits by doing so. Among unskilled labor, there is still very much a stratum of work quality and skills. Not everyone can qualify to be a fast food service worker, as this requires a certain skill set as well. So, firms will very much compete for the best minimum wage labor as they all are seeking to hire the the most productive members of that labor group. It would be incorrect to assume that, below the minimum wage, "anyone" can do the particular job and that the labor pool is somehow homogenous.

 

[TaftFan]

Notice where the new trend starts.

 

[Deborah K]

Couldn't you say the cost of living has been screwed up by other outside forces as well? What about the CEO-worker pay relationship? What about the dramatic rise in healthcare costs with full time vs part time employees?

She's probably never going to attack the monetary system as we woudl want to see her do but her complaint isn't all that far off from ours. She's just attacking the same beast from a different angle pitching to a different crowd.

But her solution perpetuates the problem.

 

[kcchiefs6465]

Those people are all dead. And while there's a lot of truth in that, the government still hasn't corrected the mistake?

Propaganda is a hell of thing. Keep telling people something for long enough and eventually they'll believe it. Most of the people now, who are favorable towards the Fed, are the results of public school indoctrination that more or less teaches that the Fed protects us against the booms and busts. They never mention that is isn't federal and they never mentioned how it was implemented. They also never mention the '20s, the '70s etc. with regards to what the Fed's mission statement is supposed to be. [controlling the highs and lows of our economy] Honestly, I don't think I read more than a few paragraphs on the Fed the entire time I was in high school. And they were all positive. The money reaches far and long. There are still many [I think the majority of] people who do not know what the Fed is, how it came into place, or how it manipulates our money.

The politicians will be politicians. They run to get elected. Hardly a one has any type of back bone or principle. It is a cess pool of corruption and 'sold souls.' Elizabeth Warren might see there is a problem, but she does not know how to begin to address it. Someone ought to send her a copy of 'The Creature From Jekyll Island,' as well as Ron Paul's, 'Dollar Hegemony' speech. Now these banksters "can't" (won't) even be prosecuted for their litany of offenses because if they are, it could affect our already shaky economy negatively. Eric Holder ought to be impeached for even saying such horseshit. Without an actual full audit, we will never even truly begin to grasp how far it all reaches.

 

[anaconda]

Notice where the new trend starts.

What real wage is depicted here? U.S.? Average? Median? College educated? High school education? Etc. Thanks.

 

[Deborah K]

Sure there's lobbying involved. No major corporation can survive without lobbyists, because, as Google and Microsoft found out, if you don't go after the government they will come after you.

But just think how the markets have changed, and how many old corporations have gone under or been bought out by bigger companies. All of these happen at lightening speed compared to a generation ago, and the pressures from international competition is much greater than it ever was in the past. Keeping a company alive despite the endless needs of everybody else - consumers, customers, employees, government, suppliers, banks... takes as much art as skill.

Meanwhile, sweeping the floor after everybody goes home is still pretty much the same job as it ever was.

You're on fire, girl.