Confirmed: PayPal sabotages New Hampshire vote recount
- Thread starter JimInNY
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mikeInAZ
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Agreed. I'm just saying it's the perception of Western Union, or the stigma if you will. I think it would have hurt the donations. You'd have people saying "What the hell is this Western Union link. I'm not sending money via Western Union!" But it's a moot point now I guess.
Thousands of people have had similar problems with PayPal over many years.
http://paypalwarning.com/
http://paypalsucks.com/
Read em and weep, Or get angry.
http://paypalwarning.com/
http://paypalsucks.com/
Read em and weep, Or get angry.
LOL
Those would be the kids who're like, 18, who seem to be the voice of this campaign who grew up in the Internet generation.
Sad, too. I know people that think Paypal , being owned by Ebay, is in business for another reason.. mainly, skimming off the top for ebay.. because ebay is about auctions and what not. Western Union IS about Money transfers.
*sighs* That's just all sad.
I agree with the people here pointing out that this is a common event with PayPal, and that it was a bad idea for the GW's to use PayPal. It's just an unfortunate event, that's all.
I also agree that we should move on from this. RP said himself that the numbers in NH jived and that we shouldn't spend any time/energy/money on this. It's a waste to keep looking back and focusing on what "maybe, possibly, could have maybe been a few extra votes for RP" when we have so much work ahead of us.
Now... if there is no possible resolution for this issue (i.e. there's no way NH is going to accept the payment at this point and the money is just gonna sit there), then I would suggest that everyone petition the GW's to give all of the money to Ron Paul's campaign on MLK day, to increase the results of the next money bomb.
Just a thought.
WATYF
I also agree that we should move on from this. RP said himself that the numbers in NH jived and that we shouldn't spend any time/energy/money on this. It's a waste to keep looking back and focusing on what "maybe, possibly, could have maybe been a few extra votes for RP" when we have so much work ahead of us.
Now... if there is no possible resolution for this issue (i.e. there's no way NH is going to accept the payment at this point and the money is just gonna sit there), then I would suggest that everyone petition the GW's to give all of the money to Ron Paul's campaign on MLK day, to increase the results of the next money bomb.
Just a thought.
WATYF
liberty_Forever
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Yeah, this was obviously a deliberate trick to prevent discovery.
Hopefully Kucinich has better luck.
Hopefully Kucinich has better luck.
mysticgeek
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They should just send that money to the Campaign on MLK day. But there is much to suspect in this ... You cannot just instantly take money out of a paypal account and I doubt the state secretary accepts paypal.
liberty_Forever
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I called the SOS . This is confirmed by me as off 11:30AM EST 1/16/08.
They said there is a Democratic recount, but no Republican recount because the "money was not provided"
[email protected]
Secretary of State - William M. Gardner
Senior Deputy Secretary of State - Robert P. Ambrose
Deputy Secretary of State - David M. Scanlan
State House, Room 204, Concord, N.H. 03301
Phone: 603-271-3242 Fax: 603-271-6316
Email: [email protected]
The law is "RSA 660":
http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/...60/660-mrg.htm
They said there is a Democratic recount, but no Republican recount because the "money was not provided"
[email protected]
Secretary of State - William M. Gardner
Senior Deputy Secretary of State - Robert P. Ambrose
Deputy Secretary of State - David M. Scanlan
State House, Room 204, Concord, N.H. 03301
Phone: 603-271-3242 Fax: 603-271-6316
Email: [email protected]
The law is "RSA 660":
http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/...60/660-mrg.htm
If you are not an Agent Provocateur, you play one on TV.
This isn't because of your opinion so much as your wrath that is aimed at our own grassroots. Throughout this thread you repeatedly create the illusions:
-that we are angry with our own
-that the grassroots is somehow incompetent
-that we should no longer trust contributions
You, sir, are the enemy.
You, sir, are not one of us.
KewlRonduderules
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I'd definitely contest that. There is no indication in the law that the money was needed in advance.
http://www.sos.nh.gov/rsa660.htm
Last edited:
liberty_Forever
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affa: agreed.
Paypal is the enemy here.
Paypal is the enemy here.
jenninlouisiana
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liberty_Forever
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More information....
I do not know where to begin with all of this so I will just lay out the basic facts as they are being reported to me:
1. The state of New Hampshire ballot appeared to have been tampered with.
2. The people of America (and about half of the world too!) pulled together to sign a petition and have their voice heard, across the aisle, in an effort that has seen both Democrats and Republicans call for a recount of the ballots for the state of New Hampshire.
3. The Secretary of State placed a January 15th @ 15:00 deadline for the $55,600 to be handed over to cover the cost of the recount.
4. The money was raised by, again, people from all walks of life who simply wanted to see that every vote was counted.
5. At the very last moment, PayPal froze the Granny Warriors account and refused to release the funds whilst they “investigated” a “suspicious” $1000 donation.
6. The money could not be handed over and thus, at this point in time, it appears that the recount will NOT take place.
So, the following is what we are meant to believe:
1. PayPal have clearly not been paying ANY attention to what has been happening during this campaign and thus have no idea how quickly and in what amounts the Ron Paul Revolution is able to raise funds.
2. PayPal were clearly unaware that Ron Paul supporters were in the majority of those donating to this effort and would likely break the target REGARDLESS of what last minute donations were required.
3. PayPal were so unlucky during the four days that this appeal ran that they managed to:
1. Crash the original ChipIn at least 3 times making it impossible during this time to donate any money at all.
2. Destroy the original ChipIn altogether after around $40,000 had been donated requiring the Granny Warriors to start a new ChipIn for the remaining monies.
3. Crash the new ChipIn for about 2 hours on and off on the final fundraising date.
4. Stop the recount by denying that all and any funds received are now frozen (note: NOT just the $1000 which, by this point, was no longer needed as we were over the top by then) pending an investigation into where a perfectly decent sized donation came from.
4. The Secretary of State is unable to stretch the deadline or accept that said funds exist regardless of the amount of documented evidence placed on his desk.
5. This entirely calamitous and accidental chain of events was, at no point whatsoever, manipulated by anybody to ensure that this recount never took place.
I am sorry but I do not believe for one second that 1 through 4 could possibly have happened without 5 being false.
I never will either.
This is democracy being stolen, right in front of our eyes and we are watching it, some in disbelief, some in denial, all in bond.
America has been stolen and the vote with it.
I do not know what comes next. What new horrors? What new wars? What new laws?
I fear for the future of America.
Best wishes and good luck,
Shaun
I do not know where to begin with all of this so I will just lay out the basic facts as they are being reported to me:
1. The state of New Hampshire ballot appeared to have been tampered with.
2. The people of America (and about half of the world too!) pulled together to sign a petition and have their voice heard, across the aisle, in an effort that has seen both Democrats and Republicans call for a recount of the ballots for the state of New Hampshire.
3. The Secretary of State placed a January 15th @ 15:00 deadline for the $55,600 to be handed over to cover the cost of the recount.
4. The money was raised by, again, people from all walks of life who simply wanted to see that every vote was counted.
5. At the very last moment, PayPal froze the Granny Warriors account and refused to release the funds whilst they “investigated” a “suspicious” $1000 donation.
6. The money could not be handed over and thus, at this point in time, it appears that the recount will NOT take place.
So, the following is what we are meant to believe:
1. PayPal have clearly not been paying ANY attention to what has been happening during this campaign and thus have no idea how quickly and in what amounts the Ron Paul Revolution is able to raise funds.
2. PayPal were clearly unaware that Ron Paul supporters were in the majority of those donating to this effort and would likely break the target REGARDLESS of what last minute donations were required.
3. PayPal were so unlucky during the four days that this appeal ran that they managed to:
1. Crash the original ChipIn at least 3 times making it impossible during this time to donate any money at all.
2. Destroy the original ChipIn altogether after around $40,000 had been donated requiring the Granny Warriors to start a new ChipIn for the remaining monies.
3. Crash the new ChipIn for about 2 hours on and off on the final fundraising date.
4. Stop the recount by denying that all and any funds received are now frozen (note: NOT just the $1000 which, by this point, was no longer needed as we were over the top by then) pending an investigation into where a perfectly decent sized donation came from.
4. The Secretary of State is unable to stretch the deadline or accept that said funds exist regardless of the amount of documented evidence placed on his desk.
5. This entirely calamitous and accidental chain of events was, at no point whatsoever, manipulated by anybody to ensure that this recount never took place.
I am sorry but I do not believe for one second that 1 through 4 could possibly have happened without 5 being false.
I never will either.
This is democracy being stolen, right in front of our eyes and we are watching it, some in disbelief, some in denial, all in bond.
America has been stolen and the vote with it.
I do not know what comes next. What new horrors? What new wars? What new laws?
I fear for the future of America.
Best wishes and good luck,
Shaun
slantedview
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as usual, fuck paypal.
jenninlouisiana
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Shaun, I respect your opinion on what happened, but I still fail to see how this is PayPals' fault for "not knowing the revolution can raise a lot of money quickly".
Did the grannies have a *verified* account with Paypal?
Did the grannies call paypal/e-mail them letting them know WHY all of this money was going to come in?
Are the grannies a PAC?
Answer those questions first and then I'll look into your comments more closely.
Did the grannies have a *verified* account with Paypal?
Did the grannies call paypal/e-mail them letting them know WHY all of this money was going to come in?
Are the grannies a PAC?
Answer those questions first and then I'll look into your comments more closely.
liberty_Forever
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- Dec 27, 2007
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oh I am not Shaun, that was cut/paste =)
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