Conceal Carry Permit constitutes probable cause for a search and seizure

[Philhelm]

He brought it on himself.

Too bad there aren't 100 Dorner's all working together.

 

[Dr.3D]

Too bad there aren't 100 Dorner's all working together.

Looks to me like they are already seeing a Dorner in every car.

 

[JK/SEA]

Dizzy fucking broad...


Yeah, that's all you should have said.

i'm going to assume hubby had a little sit down chat with her later....''when it comes to the police...just don't talk, ok, honey?''.....then a facepalm.

 

[Ronin Truth]

He brought it on himself.

Yeah, that's why the sticker isn't there. I usually play it borderline dumb and innocent when dealing with the cops.

 

[Czolgosz]

Stop asking for permission.

 

[Lucille]

Why I Cannot Support CCW Permits
http://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=227665

He wasn't pulled over for speeding.

It appears he was pulled over because of either an automated or manual random license-plate look-up by the cops, and when they did so his license was coded, as they all are, to show that he had a CCW permit.

There's nothing unlawful about having a CCW permit nor does it generate probable cause for a traffic stop. That doesn't matter in this case, because it did generate a traffic stop. And then the cop ultimately, when the driver says he doesn't have it with him and his wife (asked separately) doesn't know where it is, turns that stop into a full and complete search of the vehicle and everything in it.

The end result? No arrest or citation, but 90 minutes of being detained and searched.

Illegally.
[...]
Apologies? **** you Maryland. Your "officer" committed felony assault (you go menace someone, refuse to allow them to leave, and have a sidearm on you at the time and then tell me what the charge laid against you happens to be.)

There is only one solution to this problem folks -- it's none of the government's damned business if you're carrying a weapon or not. It's none of the government's damned business right up until you do something unlawful with it, at which point it becomes both reasonable and appropriate to search, arrest, charge, whatever -- for the unlawful act.

But the bottom line here is that the fact that this individual registered his ownership and intent to carry for personal protection of himself and his family in the places where it is lawful to do so with the government meant that he was unlawfully stopped, detained and searched by a ****head who has faced no penalty for the violation of his Constitutional right to be left alone absent evidence of, or probable cause to suspect, actual unlawful activity.

The only solution to this is Constitutional Carry. That is, you have the right under the 2nd Amendment to carry, either openly or concealed, a firearm without applying for any sort of permit or asking for permission from the government first.

It is only if and when you commit a crime with a weapon present and in some way related to the offense that the government gains the ability to intervene in your personal decision to not be a victim and protect both yourself and others near you, most-particularly your family.

There is no means to solve this problem any other way, as despite whatever sanctions Florida may apply to its peace officers for abusive acts of this sort the very act of registration exposes you to abuses by other political subdivisions in the United States.

Therefore, the only means of stopping this crap is in fact to get rid of any such requirement of registration -- period.

 

[Contumacious]

Why I Cannot Support CCW Permits - The only solution to this is Constitutional Carry. That is, you have the right under the 2nd Amendment to carry, either openly or concealed, a firearm without applying for any sort of permit or asking for permission from the government first.

Exactly.

.

 

[jbauer]

Got pulled over for speeding the other day. Told him I have my CC permit but am not currently carrying. Thanked me, gave me a warning for going fast. On my way, took 15 minutes. (fyi it was 48 in a 30 although I'm not sure how I was going that fast since I was following other.

Guess each case can be different.

 

[Anti Federalist]

Got pulled over for speeding the other day. Told him I have my CC permit but am not currently carrying. Thanked me, gave me a warning for going fast. On my way, took 15 minutes. (fyi it was 48 in a 30 although I'm not sure how I was going that fast since I was following other.

Guess each case can be different.

Sure they are.

That is one of the hallmarks of a police state.

It is arbitrary and capricious.

You never know for sure when the hammer will fall.

 

[Dr.3D]

Sure they are.

That is one of the hallmarks of a police state.

It is arbitrary and capricious.

You never know for sure when the hammer will fall.

Yep, had he told the cop he was in possession of a firearm, he might be dead today.

 

[69360]

HUH?

How the fuck does driving north on the turnpike with your wife and children provide the stormtrooper "probable cause" that a crime was being perpetrated and that the driver was armed?


... a "Terry stop" is a brief detention of a person by police[1] on reasonable suspicion of involvement in criminal activity but short of probable cause to arrest.

"A traffic stop is, for practical purposes, a Terry stop;[10] for the duration of a stop, driver and passengers are “seized” within the meaning of the Fourth Amendment.[11] Under federal law, drivers[12] and passengers[13] may be ordered out of the vehicle without additional justification by the officer, although such practices might not be authorized under state law depending on the jurisdiction. Drivers[14] and passengers[15] may be searched for weapons upon reasonable suspicion they are armed and dangerous. If police reasonably suspect the driver or any of the occupants may be dangerous and that the vehicle may contain a weapon to which an occupant may gain access, police may perform a protective search of the passenger compartment.[16][17]

.

The wife told the cop the gun was in the car in a state he didn't have a CC. That's probable cause for a search. You can use big fonts as much as you want, but it is what it is.

 

[Spikender]

Precise reason I will never get a permit.

Just not worth the time to know that I'm in a database and can be pulled over for practicing my natural right to self defense.

 

[Anti Federalist]

The wife told the cop the gun was in the car in a state he didn't have a CC. That's probable cause for a search. You can use big fonts as much as you want, but it is what it is.

I think you're missing the point...

The stop never would have happened, had it not been for a database of CCW holders tied to your vehicle registrations coupled with random or computerized surveillance of your tags.

 

[The Free Hornet]

The wife told the cop the gun was in the car in a state he didn't have a CC. That's probable cause for a search. You can use big fonts as much as you want, but it is what it is.

Bullshit, per the story:

First Kally says, “I don’t know.” Retelling it later she says, “And that’s all I should have said.” Instead, attempting to be helpful, she added, “Maybe in the glove [box]. Maybe in the console. I’m scared of it. I don’t want to have anything to do with it. I might shoot right through my foot.”

http://tbo.com/list/columns-tjackson/jackson-gun-owner-unarmed-unwelcome-in-maryland-20140112/

Nor did she give a conflicting story:

Conflicting stories and the wife saying the gun may be in the car is probable cause to search.

Does not conflict with:

“You own a gun,” the officer says. “Where is it?”

“At home in my safe,” John answers.

 

[belian78]

I can't wait for this to start happening here in IL, I know it's going to and it will make this look tame.

 

[Contumacious]

The wife told the cop the gun was in the car in a state he didn't have a CC. That's probable cause for a search. You can use big fonts as much as you want, but it is what it is.

Wut?

Are you fucking saying that the cop predicted the wife was going to respond in that manner?

WHAT WAS THE FUCKING BASIS FOR THE INITIAL STOP?

.

 

[Tod]

What do you think the chances are that the NICS is actually storing and sharing data on who buys a gun?

 

[asurfaholic]

Asking him to step out of the car is not a search.

I can't imagine what the warning was for either.

No, but he is being detained. And that led to him being searched, so there's that. You can't be detained without probable cause that you committed a crime. I understand CC laws so you only have to produce the permit if you are stopped. The gun does not have to be presented.

 

[Christian Liberty]

I hate how there's an apologist in every thread.

Even if the stop was "legal" it would still be wrong.

The fact that the 2nd amendment requires "permission" is an outrage.

 

[WM_in_MO]

Stop replying to the trolls and they go away.

Also if mods would BAN obvious trolls it would help...

Just use the -REP system for those who insist on getting it wrong every time.