Climate Alarmists Are So Uneducated

[Travlyr]

depends on what part of it you are looking at.

There is zero dispute of the right end of the hockey stick, ZERO.

The only problem people had with Mann's graph was the lack of medieval warming, and his statistical method, the right end of warming was never an issue (because it was based on instrumentation and measurement, not proxy approximation)

Zero dispute? The way I understand the debate is that increased CO2 levels is not a cause of warming but a result.

 

[Tpoints]

Zero dispute? The way I understand the debate is that increased CO2 levels is not a cause of warming but a result.

I was talking about temperature, not cause. So yes, zero dispute about the temperatures.

The way you understand it, although wrong, is irrelevant to what I said.
http://grist.org/climate-energy/historically-co2-never-caused-temperature-change/
http://grist.org/climate-energy/there-is-no-proof-that-co2-is-causing-global-warming/
http://grist.org/climate-energy/co2-doesnt-lead-it-lags/

 

[Travlyr]

I was talking about temperature, not cause. So yes, zero dispute about the temperatures.

The way you understand it, although wrong, is irrelevant to what I said.
http://grist.org/climate-energy/historically-co2-never-caused-temperature-change/
http://grist.org/climate-energy/there-is-no-proof-that-co2-is-causing-global-warming/
http://grist.org/climate-energy/co2-doesnt-lead-it-lags/

The Sky Is Falling The Sky Is Falling!!

 

[Tpoints]

The Sky Is Falling The Sky Is Falling!!

I didn't say that.

 

[Travlyr]

I didn't say that.

Those links do. You are selling fear.

 

[Dr.3D]

Zero dispute? The way I understand the debate is that increased CO2 levels is not a cause of warming but a result.

Warming a bottle of soda pop is a pretty good example of that. The warmer the soda gets, the less CO2 remains in the soda. Now just replace the soda with oceans.

 

[vienna]

only if you are afraid of graphs.

 

[Origanalist]

I couldn't help myself........

 

[Tpoints]

Warming a bottle of soda pop is a pretty good example of that. The warmer the soda gets, the less CO2 remains in the soda. Now just replace the soda with oceans.

the fact heat releases CO2 from oceans does not mean CO2 cannot cause or amplify warming. CO2 causing and contributing to warming has been well and long established, it's called greenhouse gas.

Whether it's caused by humans or whether we should tax carbon, are all different stories. Acknowledging the facts of global warming doesn't mean you have to accept any solutions or actions.

 

[Travlyr]

only if you are afraid of graphs.

I can read. Anybody can draw a graph. From the fearmongers, "The precedents are there, as are the dire warnings."

Dire warning! The Sky Is Falling!! The Sky Is Falling!! Really It Is! And there is nothing anybody can do about it except buy carbon credits and turn YOUR thermostat down.

 

[Tpoints]

Those links do. You are selling fear.

Answering misconceptions with facts. If you call that selling fear, fine, but it's not saying the sky is falling.

 

[Tpoints]

I can read. Anybody can draw a graph. From the fearmongers, "The precedents are there, as are the dire warnings."

Dire warning! The Sky Is Falling!! The Sky Is Falling!! Really It Is! And there is nothing anybody can do about it except buy carbon credits and turn YOUR thermostat down.

Who said there's nothing we can do about it except buying carbon credits?

 

[Dr.3D]

the fact heat releases CO2 from oceans does not mean CO2 cannot cause or amplify warming. CO2 causing and contributing to warming has been well and long established, it's called greenhouse gas.

Whether it's caused by humans or whether we should tax carbon, are all different stories. Acknowledging the facts of global warming doesn't mean you have to accept any solutions or actions.

So the last time there was warming, and the CO2 was released from the oceans, how did cooling happen to put the CO2 back into the oceans again? Seems like if the heat caused the CO2 to escape from the oceans, it would have made the earth heat up even more from all of the extra CO2 and it would be a never ending spiral where there would be no cooling again.

 

[Travlyr]

Warming a bottle of soda pop is a pretty good example of that. The warmer the soda gets, the less CO2 remains in the soda. Now just replace the soda with oceans.

This is exactly right. Anyone on these boards that believe that CO2 causes warming buy yourself a clear soda and watch the CO2 leave the soda as it warms up.

 

[John F Kennedy III]

there are 833.8 billion tons of co2 emitted into the atmosphere every year.
and about 817.2 billion tons can be consumed by nature.

those are the facts. more plants can of course bind co2. but only up to a certain degree of course. because in the end they'll set it free again. as this is how nature works. whether this happens within 1 day or 20 years wont change the principle and the balance of that cylce. an ordinary plant or tree sets its carbon pretty immediatly free again.

and because there are constantly more people living on this planet and getting access to technology, machines, cars, ... the amount of co2 emitted into the atmosphere will increase. and here for example in europe there is not much space left for additional woodland.

but anyway, you can't cover the whole earth with woods to compansate our emissions of co2. it's just not practical.

Sources?

 

[Tpoints]

This is exactly right. Anyone on these boards that believe that CO2 causes warming buy yourself a clear soda and watch the CO2 leave the soda as it warms up.

Again, the fact heat releases CO2 does not mean CO2 cannot also cause warming.

 

[vienna]

I can read. Anybody can draw a graph. From the fearmongers, "The precedents are there, as are the dire warnings."

Dire warning! The Sky Is Falling!! The Sky Is Falling!! Really It Is! And there is nothing anybody can do about it except buy carbon credits and turn YOUR thermostat down.

nope. not everybody can draw a correct graph.

 

[Tpoints]

So the last time there was warming, and the CO2 was released from the oceans, how did cooling happen to put the CO2 back into the oceans again? Seems like if the heat caused the CO2 to escape from the oceans, it would have made the earth heat up even more from all of the extra CO2 and it would be a never ending spiral where there would be no cooling again.

Good question.

1. You assume CO2 always causes more warming, and faster than whatever causes/allows for cooling
2. You assume CO2 output has remained constant
3. Because humans have outputted more CO2 into the atmosphere (undisputed), 1. may well be true for today's case, that warming will remain so for longer than previous, and may take longer than previous warming trends to cool back down. It might not be "never" but it doesn't need to be to cause some inconvenience to our fragile modern lifestyles. (And no, I never said we should tax carbon to prevent it)

 

[Tpoints]

nope. not everybody can draw a correct graph.

but we're supposed to believe whatever Travlyr posts.

 

[vienna]

Sources?

i use german or austrian sources. so you probably cant use them.